Doctors for Medical Liability Reform

[Odelay]

This is a little off the topic of hair loss discussions, but since it concerns the doctors we see to get our treatments and hair transplants I feel that it should not be moved to another forum that does not get as much traffic. I will keep this post short because the website explains the problem very well and conveys the crisis that is occuring with the shortage of certain doctors in many states due to the fact they can't afford the medical liability insurance. This is something that is affecting many states and is something people should take an interest in because it could affect you or your family.

Here is the website.

http://www.protectpatientsnow.org

If nothing else just take a look and be aware of the looming problem we are facing.

 

[HairlossTalk]

I haven't read the site yet, because they didn't explain the problem in an easy to find location, and im somewhat feeling lazy today ... but ...

I often hear about doctors complaining that they keep getting sued.

Tell me. How are they getting sued for malpractice if they're not completely screwing up all the time? Doctors constantly tell me they and their peers are leaving the profession because of the "sue happy" patients. The first problem with blaming the patient for this is simple logic. You can't be sued, and LOSE, unless you were in the wrong. If you lose, then you messed up. You harmed someone by your own malpractice, arrogance, lack of education, lack of followup, etc etc etc. People can't be sued and lose unless they were at fault.

So are doctors trying to tell us "Let us screw up constantly but don't sue us anymore?" That is the message I keep getting from doctors and thats just plain backwards thinking.

Well anyone who has ever had to see a doctor about a persistent medical condition knows how incrediby hard it is to even get in there for an appointment, how incredibly undereducated 80% of the doctors are, how they refuse to run diagnostic tests to rule out other conditions out of fear of ridicule by insurance companies, how incredibly overworked they are, and how a good 40 to 50% of them are arrogant and just plain don't give a sh*t about their patients.

I hate to say all of that but its the cold hard truth. Even for hair loss. Especially for hair loss. 99% of doctors don't know what they're talking about because they never continued their education, work less hours than a banker does (my Doctor is avail 9 to 11am and 2:30 to 4, weekdays only!), and get offended, angry, conceited if you try to bring them information found on the web that shows they're incorrect in their facts. Ive had doctors plainly tell me "Im not going to run diagnostic tests for that because I don't want to deal with the insurance companies". There have been more than 3 "expose's" on nationwide shows like 60 minutes in the last 2 years proving that insurance companies actually REWARD doctors financially for NOT running diagnostic tests. It has been proven that nearly 18,000 people died in hospitals in 2002 for misdiagnosis, or plain old mistakes by doctors.

This is what results in the high liability lawsuits. They don't happen because people are just annoying. They happen because doctors are undereducated, misinformed, too busy, and they end up making huge errors. My car gets more attention from my mechanic in the last year than my body has from my doctors in the last 10 years. Yearly physical has gone from a 2 hour long complete physical exam with full blood workup and treadmill with checklist.... to a 30 minute 10 question exam with "yes" or "no" checkboxes and a tap on the knee. They didn't even take a CBC. That was my first and only "Complete Physical" in 29 years and that is all he did. And to top it off, since a physical qualifies as "preventative" the insurance company wont cover it any more and I had to pay $150 cash out of pocket for it! I get more attention if I walk in with a cold than I did on my "Complete Physical", which is supposed to be a "fine toothed comb" look into my system.

This is why doctors get sued. I honestly have no pity for them, and it bothers me that they're looking at this as "Aw we cant be doctors because of silly patients bringing unnecessary lawsuits against us all the time". Baloney.

The solution? Checks and balances for once. Doctors who are accountable to a panel of other peers to review each and every patient they saw that day, what they did with the patient, whether they ran all the necessary (and seemingly unnecessary) diagnostic tests, and what diagnosis was given, as well as what followup will be taken. Approved by their peers and checked off. Doctors should be required to go to continuing education classes every single month to learn the latest discoveries in the specialty they treat. They should be forced to be the most educated up to date individuals on the planet. People shouldn't be able to know more than their doctor by simply going online for 10 minutes and finding out their Doctor has minsiformation that is outdated because he last read up on the condition the year he was in med school in 1984. Most importantly, doctors should all care. If a patient comes to them with a problem, that doctor should be just like a lawyer, just like a detective, just like any other profession on the planet that actually takes their job SERIOUSLY, and he should be at home that night researching everything he can, with a promise to the patient to get back with them the next day with his findings. He should be scouring the web, calling peers, calling colleagues, getting input, thinking outside the box, and seeing if he can find any further info to help that patient. I haven't met a single doctor who cared enough to do that, and to me that means they don't realize the importance of their job.

That is my $0.02 on this whole "Please stop suing doctors" topic.

HairLossTalk.com

 

[Hairless Potter]

HairLossTalk.com, I often agree with your posts, but this time you have been grossly misinformed.

Tell me. How are they getting sued for malpractice if they're not completely screwing up all the time? HairLossTalk.com

First of all anyone can file a suit against anyone they want to anytime they want.

Doctors constantly tell me they and their peers are leaving the profession because of the "sue happy" patients. The first problem with blaming the patient for this is simple logic. You can't be sued, and LOSE, unless you were in the wrong. If you lose, then you messed up. You harmed someone by your own malpractice, arrogance, lack of education, lack of followup, etc etc etc. People can't be sued and lose unless they were at fault. HairLossTalk.com

Our society is extremely litigious to deny this is ignorance. I agree with prosecuting gross neglegence and medical malpractice, but often times the medical profession is riddled with legal frivolity, just like many other professions. Often times these lawsuits are settled out of court because the time and money involved with going to trial to defend is simply greater than settlement costs. The enormous cost of med mal insurance, which by the way is almost doubled every year for the past 5+ years for most specialties is driven by a lack of limitation of jury awards.

So are doctors trying to tell us "Let us screw up constantly but don't sue us anymore?" That is the message I keep getting from doctors and thats just plain backwards thinking.HairLossTalk.com

Absolutely not. All of the doctors I know are just as incensed by medical malpractice as you, and I am truly shocked if this indeed has not been your experience.

Well anyone who has ever had to see a doctor about a persistent medical condition knows how incrediby hard it is to even get in there for an appointment, how incredibly undereducated 80% of the doctors are, how they refuse to run diagnostic tests to rule out other conditions out of fear of ridicule by insurance companies, how incredibly overworked they are, and how a good 40 to 50% of them are arrogant and just plain don't give a sh*t about their patients.HairLossTalk.com

This is such an inflammatory generalization, I barely know where to start. First of all, most doctors if they are members of an HMO, or participate in Medicaid. Have limitations placed on how much money can be spent on a patient. HMO's contract physicians in capitated reimbursement plans resulting in loss of wage for physicians who exceed these diagnostic stipends. Doctors don't "fear ridicule" by insurance companies. Their hands are often tied because HMO represented by individuals who often aren't even college graduates, let alone health professions denying coverage of necessary diagnostic tests. And fortunately the arrogant, heartless physician you describe is an extreme minority.

I hate to say all of that but its the cold hard truth. Even for hair loss. Especially for hair loss. 99% of doctors don't know what they're talking about because they never continued their education, work less hours than a banker does HairLossTalk.com

Holy sh*t! I know many physicians, and all work a minimum 60 hr week. A minimum 60 hours! Most work upwards of 80 to 100. Maybe there are a few dermatologists who have great hours and are never on call, but this is a minority.

(my Doctor is avail 9 to 11am and 2:30 to 4, weekdays only!), and get offended, angry, conceited if you try to bring them information found on the web that shows they're incorrect in their facts. Ive had doctors plainly tell me "Im not going to run diagnostic tests for that because I don't want to deal with the insurance companies". There have been more than 3 "expose's" on nationwide shows like 60 minutes in the last 2 years proving that insurance companies actually REWARD doctors financially for NOT running diagnostic tests. It has been proven that nearly 18,000 people died in hospitals in 2002 for misdiagnosis, or plain old mistakes by doctors.HairLossTalk.com

Doctors are not rewarded for decreased testing, they are penalized for increased diagnostic costs.

This is what results in the high liability lawsuits. They don't happen because people are just annoying. They happen because doctors are undereducated, misinformed, too busy, and they end up making huge errors. My car gets more attention from my mechanic in the last year than my body has from my doctors in the last 10 years. Yearly physical has gone from a 2 hour long complete physical exam with full blood workup and treadmill with checklist.... to a 30 minute 10 question exam with "yes" or "no" checkboxes and a tap on the knee. They didn't even take a CBC. That was my first and only "Complete Physical" in 29 years and that is all he did. And to top it off, since a physical qualifies as "preventative" the insurance company wont cover it any more and I had to pay $150 cash out of pocket for it! I get more attention if I walk in with a cold than I did on my "Complete Physical", which is supposed to be a "fine toothed comb" look into my system.

This is why doctors get sued. I honestly have no pity for them, and it bothers me that they're looking at this as "Aw we cant be doctors because of silly patients bringing unnecessary lawsuits against us all the time". Baloney.

The solution? Checks and balances for once. Doctors who are accountable to a panel of other peers to review each and every patient they saw that day, what they did with the patient, whether they ran all the necessary (and seemingly unnecessary) diagnostic tests, and what diagnosis was given, as well as what followup will be taken. Approved by their peers and checked off. Doctors should be required to go to continuing education classes every single month to learn the latest discoveries in the specialty they treat. They should be forced to be the most educated up to date individuals on the planet. People shouldn't be able to know more than their doctor by simply going online for 10 minutes and finding out their Doctor has minsiformation that is outdated because he last read up on the condition the year he was in med school in 1984. Most importantly, doctors should all care. If a patient comes to them with a problem, that doctor should be just like a lawyer, just like a detective, just like any other profession on the planet that actually takes their job SERIOUSLY, and he should be at home that night researching everything he can, with a promise to the patient to get back with them the next day with his findings. He should be scouring the web, calling peers, calling colleagues, getting input, thinking outside the box, and seeing if he can find any further info to help that patient. I haven't met a single doctor who cared enough to do that, and to me that means they don't realize the importance of their job.HairLossTalk.com

The above paragraph is completely idiotic. If you think doctors don't stay current on the medical literature and spend countless hours attending seminars, lectures, journal clubs and conferences than you have never spent time with a physician. Anyway most good doctors encourage there patients to do there own research and discuss it with them. This makes the patient an active participant in informed consent and treatment and is the essence of good doctor patient relationship. By the way, physicians are constantly subjected to peer review and recertification exams. I don't know where you get your facts, but I sure hope you aren't poisoing this exceptional site against a noble profession due to a few negative experiences you have had with a couple bad dermatologists regarding hairloss. Please get your facts straight. I welcome any and all replies. Thank you

 

[blue]

Im to lazy to read this lol

 

[HairlossTalk]

this time you have been grossly misinformed.

Most of my comments were based upon personal experience, so Im not sure how I could be misinformed. Maybe you misunderstood what I said. Let's see...

First of all anyone can file a suit against anyone they want to anytime they want.

My post wasn't calling into question people who file suits for no reason, and that web site is not about people who do this. It is about putting caps on the $ that a victim can be paid, putting caps on the $ the doctor has to pay lawyers to defend him, etc. My post was pointing out that if you get sued for malpractice and lose, you're guilty. Period. No misinformation there.

I agree with prosecuting gross neglegence and medical malpractice, but often times the medical profession is riddled with legal frivolity, just like many other professions.

Again, we don't disagree and there is no misinformation involved in my comments. I am not talking about frivolous lawsuits, and neither is that web site. It's discussing capping $ paid out when they *lose*. Its trying to get people to feel sorry for doctors that get sued for malpractice. Sure, a small part of that web site also includes the money spent *determining* if its a legitimate lawsuit, but that is not the whole message, and you seem to be completely ignoring the other 3/4 of that site and focusing only on frivolous lawsuits. My entire premise is that most lawsuits that doctors lose are not frivolous at all. If they lose, they're guilty of something, and they should be expected to pay for it. Again, not even a bit of "misinformation" like you stated.

Absolutely not. All of the doctors I know are just as incensed by medical malpractice as you, and I am truly shocked if this indeed has not been your experience.

I never said doctors supported malpractice. Again, nobody has misniformation. You misread my post, again. I said I know plenty of doctors whining that they're afraid to practice because they're afraid they'll get sued. That they are blaming the public for the number of malpractice suits. The tone of that site and all doctors ive spoken to is the exact same tone you have. Its the consumers/patients fault that they keep getting sued. I am quite sure you're aware there are definitely two viewpoints on that, especially with the reputation of absolute inadequate education, 18,000 people dying in hospitals due to "oopsies" by doctors, etc.

I would tend to believe doctors are f*****g up, more than Id believe that people are just suing them for "no reason". Again, an opinion, no misinformation.

This is such an inflammatory generalization, I barely know where to start.

No its not inflammatory. Its based on personal experience and listening to every single poster on this site for 5 years. In that respect its 100% accurate, and can be documented.

Doctors don't "fear ridicule" by insurance companies.

Baloney. Even 60 minutes said they do, and several exposes have gone nationwide television about this very topic. You're quite simply wrong. Its a proven fact.

Holy sh*t! I know many physicians, and all work a minimum 60 hr week. A minimum 60 hours! Most work upwards of 80 to 100. Maybe there are a few dermatologists who have great hours and are never on call, but this is a minority.

And your point is? Unless you know 500,000 physicians and can give me an accurate percentage of ones that see patients 60 hours a week, your comment is no different than mine. An opinion based upon personal experience. You disregarded my comments based upon personal experience as invalid. I guess I'll do the same for yours above.

Doctors are not rewarded for decreased testing, they are penalized for increased diagnostic costs.

Again, wrong. You are the one who is misinformed. Doctors are given a bonus at the end of the year by insurance companies if they stay under a certain dollar amount. That was the entire point of the special on 60 minutes last year. "Can you believe doctors are actually PAID not to test you? Its true". Email 60 minutes if you disagree. Don't tell me im misinformed.

The above paragraph is completely idiotic.

Very mature of you, Now I see what mentality you have. You're here to insult rather than discuss the issues. You just lost all credibility in my eyes.

If you think doctors don't stay current on the medical literature and spend countless hours attending seminars, lectures, journal clubs and conferences than you have never spent time with a physician.

Again, you're flat out WRONG. I have asked all of my doctors, as well as their bosses, and nuses, how often they go for followup education. 90% of them go to a seminar once every 6 months that is a general thing. They all attend it. Whoop de doo. A seminar for a day. That is their continuing education. They get "continuing education" credits for going, and thats it for another 6 months to a year. To top it off, its not even mandatory. Again, you can sit here like a 3 year old and call me an "idiot" but telling me im wrong when I've verified my facts straight from the horses mouth will do nothing. I can sit here and tell you you're "wrong" too. Its very easy. Doesn't hold an ounce of water in the face of the facts. You are misinformed.

Anyway most good doctors encourage there patients to do there own research and discuss it with them.

Again totally wrong. I myself and countless people on this very forum have recounted that doctors get angry, or offended, or just plain discourage their users from researching things. Their strongest argument is that information on the web is subjective and therefore dangerous, and therefore they may be getting bad information. You are totally flat out wrong about this. I have even had doctors related to this site email me concerns that people are taking their own diagnosis and research into their own hands. Many doctors have a "God Complex" and the internet is destroying that for them. They are no longer the aloof all knowing beings they used to be, in a sea of uneducated people.

I am absoltely amazed that you've had such a charmed life when it comes to interacting with doctors, but you my friend are the extreme minority. I also love how you completely glossed over the 18,000 deaths in hospitals due to misdiagnosis from doctors or just plain old mistakes made. That was very slick.

HairLossTalk.com

 

[HairlossTalk]

By the way, it should be pointed out that according to your other posts, you work in the medical community, so you should not even be engaging in this debate at all.

Naturally you're going to say that all doctors are loving, helpful, work long hours, get regular education boosts, and encourage patients to research things on their own. Its painfully obvious that you are biased on this issue, and you are not accepting reality. I don't know a single person alive, nor any poster on this website who has ever shared your view of doctors.

Its quite simply hogwash to say that most of them are like that. I wont buy it. I have had so many personal experiences and seen so many documented facts on the absolute lack of quality of service in the medical community that your viewpoint is absolutely wrong. I and all of my family members have given well over 30 doctors a chance to prove your viewpoint right, and they've all failed miserably. Miserably. It has been so bad, the things these doctors have done, said, ways they've conducted themselves, there isn't even room for a gray area. The stories I could tell you would blow you away.

If a non-biased-non-doctor would like to discuss this id be open to continuing the discussion. Im not going to argue with someone who has an agenda to promote his own profession, which he will now undoubtedly deny he is doing.

Arguing this topic with you would be like me injecting myself into a debate as to whether this site is a good site or not. Naturally im going to say its a great site and have hundreds of reasons why. But who cares what I think. I would be biased. The real value is what consumers think, and every one I know is extremely dissatisfied with the medical community right now.

Amazing how sterling your view of doctors is though, isn't it?

HairLossTalk.com

 

[Hairless Potter]

HairLossTalk.com,

I'm sorry you have had bad experiences with physicians. It saddens me to hear many of your thoughts. Obviously we disagree on the matter. I made no attempt to conceal that I am a medical professional. I agree that is a bias. Actually I'm a fourth year medical student. I have spent the past 4 years working with many different types of physicians. Most good. A few not so good. It has been my experience that most of them share my committment to patient care. I have had much opportunity to observe this. If indeed you are correct and many share your point of view that physicians are malignant and greedy its disappointing to me. All I can say to you is that if one wishes to be financially secure there are much quicker, easier, less expensive ways to achieve this than with a medical degree.

 

[HairlossTalk]

99% of the doctors who qualify for this God Complex mentality are the ones who were educated pre-internet. They're the 40-60 year old doctors out there. The old timers. I will stick to this opinion to my death regarding them.

99% of the doctors who are currently in training today are doing so in a completely different world. You as a doctor of the future are learning your trade in a highly competetive world. A world where all your patients are going to be educated on a topic as of about 5 minutes prior to your appointment with them. Doctors in your age group are going to be forced to be educated, up to date, and accountable. People aren't going to put up with attitudes, or being told they're wrong when they've got a printout from xxx.com proving they're right. They're not going to put up with reading that Diagnostic tests 1 thru 10 are recommended for such symptoms, and have a Doctor say "Im only doing 1 or 2 of those, the other 8 aren't necessary". None of that crap is going to continue as people become more educated. Things are going to be different, and I believe this is going to attract a completely different breed of people to the profession. People who know this already, and will be ready for it, and will stick with it because they're there to actually help, not make the person wait 2 weeks for an appointment and get them in and out in 5 minutes. The 40-60 yr old doctors don't like what is happening, dont appreciate it, and rarely put up with it.

Hopefully it will attract people who care, and people who are going to work their assess off to provide good service instead of getting that golf ball in the hole ... and act annoyed if they're on call and someone needs them. (You have no idea how common that is! "Dont bother me!" bad attitude, sour grapes, rudeness... ugh).

The stories I could tell you would blow you away. Let's hope your generation of doctors will be going into it for the purpose of helping people. There is no doubt in my mind the 40-60 yr old doctors were educated during a time when medical profession meant highest pay... and their attitudes reflect it.

HairLossTalk.com

 

[Hairless Potter]

99% of the doctors who qualify for this God Complex mentality are the ones who were educated pre-internet. They're the 40-60 year old doctors out there. The old timers. I will stick to this opinion to my death regarding them.HairLossTalk.com

I agree. Your right a lot of older physicians were trained in a sort of parent-type school of thougt. They felt it best to decide what is best for the patient. This attitude is archeic and on the way out, thank god. In school now we actually have course on doctor patient relationship training where we learn to provide the patient with all facts and act as assistant to them deciding on what is best for their health. Many of my attendings have taken me aside and lectured me on doing what is right for the patient regardless of insurance approval. "You are here to act as your patient's advocate". This type of reform is so prevelent in my training I rarely get exposed to the alternative, and it is easily recognized as bullshit medicine. Anyway I appologize about the idiot thing, if I thought for a second you were and idiot I wouldn't spend as much time as I do on this site asking your opinon. :wink:

 

[Odelay]

I made this post because in areas that my family live this has already happened, and is begining to happen where I live now. I am not involved in the medical field to any extent, but I can see that there is a problem and one day it might affect me or someone I care about. No one is saying that some doctors don't make mistakes, because it would be a lie, there are many cases in which a doctor was at fault and should be sued by the patient. The problem is arising from the fact that trial lawyers and patients in this country have become "sue happy" and will look for a lawsuit even if their claims are fraudulent. This oraganization is just trying to have a limit put on the amount a patient could sue for, which is not due to greed. One of the problems is that many of the trial lawyers are taking up to 50% of the settlements, which is obsurd when they were not even the person that was injured.

A bill has already been passed in the House that "places a $250,000 cap on non-economic damages, limits attorneys’ contingency fees by using a sliding scale, and requires periodic payment of future economic damages in excess of $50,000." The problem is that a similar messure has been stalled in the Senate due to lobbying on behalf of the personal injury attorney. The problem here is not the doctors, instead it is the people who are looking to get rich quick and the attorney's that represent them. If someone is a victom of malpractice then they should receive money for the errors of of the doctor, but over time the settlements have gotten out of control due to the greediness of some lawyers and people.

 

[Guest]

I have spent over 30 yrs in the healthcare industry. There is NO answer to this issue that will satisfy the players involved. The reality however, is that malpractice lawsuits will not go away, simply morph in nature, scope and awards.

Here is a hint:

Doctors make mistakes.

Even great doctors make mistakes.

Bad outcomes often happen in spite of good medical treatment.

Patients with bad outcomes feel bad and want someone to blame.

Patients and lawyers are aligned financially.

Doctors and malpractice insurance companies are aligned financially.

The medical/insurance system is very very complex and difficult to change.

Let the good times roll!

 

[Odelay]

All true, but by getting a federal law such as this would be a compromise on both sides. If malpractice has occurred then the patient will be able to receive compensation, and the trial lawyers will only get sliding percentage of the claim. This will cut the price of insurance for the doctors and they will not be forced to move to states that already have a law like this in effect.

This will not really affect the number of claims that people make, but it will at least cut back on some of the obsurd claims people are getting in lawsuits. It will be hard to put a max claim value for lawsuits because one person might of suffered more than the next, but it is something that has to be done. Much like the Sept. 11 funds that were given to families who lost loved ones in the attacks a resonable amount of money will have to be assigned for every possible situation. While it might seem harsh to some people it is the best option to make sure everyone is allocated funds equally and fairly.

 

[Guest]

All true, but by getting a federal law such as this would be a compromise on both sides. If malpractice has occurred then the patient will be able to receive compensation, and the trial lawyers will only get sliding percentage of the claim. This will cut the price of insurance for the doctors and they will not be forced to move to states that already have a law like this in effect.

This will not really affect the number of claims that people make, but it will at least cut back on some of the obsurd claims people are getting in lawsuits. It will be hard to put a max claim value for lawsuits because one person might of suffered more than the next, but it is something that has to be done. Much like the Sept. 11 funds that were given to families who lost loved ones in the attacks a resonable amount of money will have to be assigned for every possible situation. While it might seem harsh to some people it is the best option to make sure everyone is allocated funds equally and fairly.

Since the overwhealming majority of LAWMAKERS are ah, lawyers, what chance do you think we have of getting laws that REALLY cut into attorney income??

Think so?

 

[Axon]

I haven't read the site yet, because they didn't explain the problem in an easy to find location, and im somewhat feeling lazy today ... but ...

I often hear about doctors complaining that they keep getting sued.

Tell me. How are they getting sued for malpractice if they're not completely screwing up all the time? Doctors constantly tell me they and their peers are leaving the profession because of the "sue happy" patients. The first problem with blaming the patient for this is simple logic. You can't be sued, and LOSE, unless you were in the wrong. If you lose, then you messed up. You harmed someone by your own malpractice, arrogance, lack of education, lack of followup, etc etc etc. People can't be sued and lose unless they were at fault.

Yep. By the way, if your case holds no water, it will be thrown out, or your attorney should move for summary dismissal.

I guess I feel bad for Doctors, since they're all walking around with a target on their back. But some of them do treat people like sh*t. My grandmother had a surgery on Wendsday and she was not visited by a physician until this morning. That's not right.

By the way, there already is a rule to disuade uneccessary lawsuits. I believe it is called Fed Rule 8, but I don't have my book in front on me.

If the plantiff cannot prove his claim, and it is considered slander, the attorney himself can be disbarred and face jail time. The problem stems from Due Process, and it's a long story, but that's the meat and potatoes of it.

 

[Odelay]

Since the overwhealming majority of LAWMAKERS are ah, lawyers, what chance do you think we have of getting laws that REALLY cut into attorney income??

Think so?

What you don't seem to get is that there are different types of lawyers, those that actually care and those that could give a damn as long as they get paid. Many of the Senators are people who have to care about the people or else they will be out of a job, that is what makes this system work at the end of the day the Senators need the people. A bill similar to this was already passed in the House, which also supports a large number of lawyers. So yes, there is a very good chance that laws of this nature will get passed because once the politicians see this is a cause that many people that are voting them into office support they will jump on the bandwagon.

 

[Axon]

Big firm law will continue to dominate, bill or no bill.

 

[Odelay]

Yep. By the way, if your case holds no water, it will be thrown out, or your attorney should move for summary dismissal.

I guess I feel bad for Doctors, since they're all walking around with a target on their back. But some of them do treat people like sh*t. My grandmother had a surgery on Wendsday and she was not visited by a physician until this morning. That's not right.

By the way, there already is a rule to disuade uneccessary lawsuits. I believe it is called Fed Rule 8, but I don't have my book in front on me.

If the plantiff cannot prove his claim, and it is considered slander, the attorney himself can be disbarred and face jail time. The problem stems from Due Process, and it's a long story, but that's the meat and potatoes of it.

The problem is people are suing for things like mental anguish on top of any malpratice, which is very easy to prove. Then they are getting absurd amounts in claims most of which goes to their attorney and not the patient who has suffered. This oranization is only trying to put a limit on the amounts some of these people are suing for. Rest assure if a doctor is at fault the patient will receive enough money to compensate them, there is no one saying otherwise. Just look around at the site because everything on there is the truth and it is eerie to believe it has been allowed to get this bad. No one is saying you have to do anything if you don't want, even if it is a good cause.

 

[Axon]

For each outrageous settlement you hear about that includes mental anguish, 10 or 20 get dismissed.

Your facts are a little off. PI Lawyers get 1/3 and occasionally they command as much as 40%. These also float any and all legal fees before hand. Ask for any more and you're shooting yourself in the foot.

Lawyers also know when they have a case and when they don't, they know when to drop if a certain judge is assigned, etc, etc. They also prey on emotional connections to juries to win larger awards; wheter you're willing to admit it or not it's your (and my) peers that are deciding the size of these settlements. An unbiased jury does not exsist.

You say we need Tort Reform. Fair enough - the system is currently a mess of bias and red tape. I would know, I deal with complex litigations and mass-torts for a living. Tort reform has been ongoing for many years, and it is difficult to come up with a better system without giving up your due process rights. Before you get your panties in a twist, I would be for a limitation on awards except under extreme circumstances, such as death or paralyzation.

But I would suggest that, in addition, we need medical reform. The current state of Doctors and hospitals makes me sick. Many doctors are horribly indifferent and tired of the constant bullshit from patients, but it's a vicious cycle. I cannot have sympathy for them. Lawyers are shithead leeches but at least they admit it; doctors sit on their Ivory towers and pretend they can do no wrong. In fact, this entire website is indicative of the typical "pass the buck" mentality I see in M.D.'s.

 

[HairlossTalk]

I shouldn't have to wait 2 weeks to get in to see a doctor for a piercing pain in my chest, only to have him see me for 5 minutes, stand 5 feet from me, literally look out the window and act like he's thinking about golf while im telling him my symptoms, then tell me "its just gas" and send me home.

Now ... had I gone home that night and died from a heart attack... who would know what the doctor told me? Nobody. Would anyone realize that he is completely responsible for my death? Probably not. Did anyone sit that doctor down, ask him what he told me, review with him if he did all the necessary diagnostic tests or anything?

Nope.

Because of him I lived with a seriously bad ulcer for 2 years, thinking it was just "gas". After seeing literally 6 other doctors, I actually stumbled upon one that had some education. That doctor did an H. Pylori breath test (since then ive spoken to 5 doctors who aren't even aware there is a breath test for H. Pylori!!!!!!!!!), tested me positive, told me I had an ulcer, and told me that in 2001 they discovered a cure for ulcers via a 3 prong antibiotic antacid treatment for 10 days.

10 days later, after 3 years of stabbing pain, I was completely cured permenantly.

Now lets assess.

1. Total lack of education
2. Total lack of necessary diagnostic testing
3. Total lack of "giving a sh*t" factor by the doctor
4. Extremely long wait time for an..
5. Extremely short visit where doctor did Nothing
6. Total lack of accountability of what went on during the visit
7. Resulted in 2 years of "pain and suffering".
8. Total lack of education in nearly 5 other doctors, so the solution to "get someone elses opinion" was usurped by the general lack of education by 90% of doctors in the medical system.

If that isn't the medical system in a nutshell, I don't know what is. Thank god it was just an ulcer.

The medical system is the only service based profession I have ever encountered where the customer comes last. You are forced to wait ridiculous amounts of time even if symptoms are *current*... you are forced to get unsatisfactory treatment and accept it because doctors still think they know everything.... you are forced to get service many times from a provider (doctor) who gives you an arrogant attitude (something a mechanic who deals with your car's health would get fired for) .... you are refused diagnostic tests that *YOU* want and will pay for because the all knowing God-complex doctor says you don't need the tests. The customer comes *last* in the medical system time and time again.

Institute checks and balances in the medical system. Accountability. Especially for private practice doctors. If you have a panel of physicians "checking off" everything and everyone who passes through their doors, they can not only ward off mistakes via bad judgment from one doctor, but they can review whether all necessary tests were done, and REDUCE the incidence of errors. They will simultaneously INCREASE customer satisfaction by simply showing that they care. You don't know how many people feel motivated to sue simply because of the Arrogance factor. If someone feels like they have a problem and the doctor is virtually ignoring it or blowing them off, you can be assured if something goes wrong in the end, they're going to want to sue. Simply showing you care can offset that immensely. Feeling like the doctor is "There with you" trying his hardest to find the answer and get you well again, is a huge factor that is completely missing in the medical system, except for a few doctors. Additionally they will have 10 guys responsible for 1 guy's decisions, and that will undoubtedly increase their chance of winning in court. This to me is the solution.

When I run into the opposite of this on a regular basis, you can imagine the reason I personally feel there are a lot of lawsuits.

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[HairlossTalk]

But I would suggest that, in addition, we need medical reform. The current state of Doctors and hospitals makes me sick. Many doctors are horribly indifferent and tired of the constant bullshit from patients, but it's a vicious cycle. I cannot have sympathy for them. Lawyers are shithead leeches but at least they admit it; doctors sit on their Ivory towers and pretend they can do no wrong. In fact, this entire website is indicative of the typical "pass the buck" mentality I see in M.D.'s.

Exactly, bingo bingo bingo.

To sit there and deny that medical reform wont reduce lawsuits is completely flat out wrong. It will. Exponentially.

That is why I say this whole "Pity the doctor" mentality is backwards. Maybe some people just haven't had to get a lot of medical assistance yet in their lives. Those of us who have, know how bad things are.

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