Is Soy the poison seed?

[Maelstrom]

I was under the impression that soy could be helpful for male pattern baldness. I've just switched to soy and/or goats milk because of all the crap I read that ends up in cows milk.

Then I read stuff like:
"We are bathed in a sea of estrogen daily. Environmental estrogen's are called xeno estrogen's and they come from: exposure to pesticides, organo phosphate fertilizers, petro chemical fumes, the esters of plastic containers, but by far the worst sources of estrogen exposure is soy and flax]. "

http://www.totalityofbeing.com/FramelessPages/Articles/real_reason_men_lose_hair.htm

http://healthnews.benabraham.com/html/soy_-_the_poison_seed.html

Now I don't know WTF to think!
:dunno:

 

[mpbsux20]

Soy is extracted from waste and it only mimics estrogen...In my personal opinion,it is nowhere near as healthy as many claim it to be.

 

[Brains Expel Hair]

Stay away from soy, at the very least avoid all unfermented soy like soy milk/tofu/50% of all processed foods. It really has no place in the human diet and additionally almost all that you'll find in the US is GMO.

 

[Maelstrom]

Well, f*** me sideways and call me Doris.

I could've sworn that soy was supposed to be good for male pattern baldness!! What about soy isoflavones or whatever being beneficial!?

Argh...why does there have to be so much conflicting advice on stuff?

So, what to use instead of cow's milk or soy? Goat's milk? Rice milk?

 

[Brains Expel Hair]

Those isoflavones are the estrogenic compounds.

What to use instead of cow's milk?
Water

 

[Maelstrom]

Goat's milk no good either?

 

[Nashville Hairline]

Well, f*ck me sideways and call me Doris.

I could've sworn that soy was supposed to be good for male pattern baldness!! What about soy isoflavones or whatever being beneficial!?

Argh...why does there have to be so much conflicting advice on stuff?

So, what to use instead of cow's milk or soy? Goat's milk? Rice milk?

There is good studies on soy isoflavones and hair e.g.
http://inhumanexperiment.blogspot.com/2 ... asing.html

I've yet to see anyone the internet claim success with supplements of it though.

 

[Chris87]

I personally am allergic to soy so I avoid it at all costs but Ive heard that soy is bad for guys pretty much in all cases because it raises estrogen levels which can lead to things like depression

 

[Bryan]

http://www.totalityofbeing.com/FramelessPages/Articles/real_reason_men_lose_hair.htm

Don't believe anything about hair loss that's written by that "William Wong" clown. The guy is an imbecile.

 

[vauxall]

So, what to use instead of cow's milk or soy? Goat's milk? Rice milk?

Breast milk. No, I mean seriously. We shouldn't drink milk, it's not in out genetic heritage to feed ourselves on other mammals' milk. I do drink milk but I know it's not good for me. I am addicted to it because I have started drinking it in infancy, just like everybody else in the so called west.

 

[Bryan]

Breast milk. No, I mean seriously. We shouldn't drink milk, it's not in out genetic heritage to feed ourselves on other mammals' milk.

What exactly does "genetic heritage" mean in this context? Is it our "genetic heritage" to eat caviar (FISH EGGS), which a lot of people consider to be a delicacy?

 

[Brains Expel Hair]

Is it our "genetic heritage" to eat caviar (FISH EGGS), which a lot of people consider to be a delicacy?

Actually yes eating fish eggs would be, since such a sound source of protein and nutrients would hardly be something that our ancestors would have thrown away. Fish eggs would somewhat fall under the organ meats category of foods that we once ate in decent volume but now only consume as delicacies and acquired tastes. If you look at more primitive societies today they will often times eat not just the meat and fat and bone marrow and organs of a kill but also even the stomach contents! Obviously such a practice would be somewhat difficult to promote in modern day terms though.

I realize this is just capitalizing somewhat on a poor analogy choice, something both of you have done. Dairy consumption is a heavily argued practice which personally I am for... because I'm white. Dairy consumption was severely limited in scope up until just a few thousand years ago and was only really made possible by a recent genetic mutation in our species localized in europe. This mutation however only dealt with the continued production of lactase after infancy and potentially does not impact the bodies acceptance of the casein protein. Potential Casein intolerance issues aside, the majority of humans are lactose intolerant (70%).

But yeah, drink water. What will you put on your cereal though?? WTF are you eating cereal?

 

[Bryan]

Is it our "genetic heritage" to eat caviar (FISH EGGS), which a lot of people consider to be a delicacy?

Actually yes eating fish eggs would be, since such a sound source of protein and nutrients would hardly be something that our ancestors would have thrown away.

I was actually focusing more on exactly what the other poster meant by the words "genetic heritage", which implies to me more of a philosophical or ethical approach to a choice of foods, rather than a scientific or nutritional one. I've frequently seen other people complain bitterly about drinking cow's milk, saying it isn't "normal" to do such a thing, and that we are the only species to do that. But my opinion is that such reasoning is ridiculous, and we should base our food choices purely on nutritional science, like the levels of vitamins and minerals in the food under consideration, the quality of its protein, its lack of anything toxic to humans, etc. That's why the words "genetic heritage" were so interesting to me.

 

[Brains Expel Hair]

It's obvious we should take EVERY SINGLE important decision from nature, for instance I think I'm going to stop going to the barber because cows don't cut their hair so it's obviously a harmful practice.

I see your point, the world of naturopathy and other holistic types of nutrition is not immune to poor science and logic (or a complete lack thereof). While adult milk consumption is a severe oddity for Earthian species, its widespread practice is the result of a well documented genetic mutation some of our species (30%ish) just happen to have. As far as your basis for making food choices though, milk would not fit as casein is toxic to some humans and lactose can cause distress to the majority of humans (unless you're white). The issue would be finding out at what dosage over chronic exposure results in any unfavorable changes and for that there would be no applicable general consensus as it all depends on your luck of the draw in the heredity game that we all get to play only once.

I am now going to vent about homeopathy, mainly because I'm quite intoxicated (the widespread result of another genetic mutation this time shared by other mammals as well) and an ex recently informed me about going to school for naturopathy. How can naturopaths expect to be taken seriously when they advocate homeopathy or applied kinesiology? Does the fact that every single rigorous examination of those concepts has completely debunked any claim made by those practices not alarm them? It's like a cult for people who think they're too forward thinking for cults.

 

[Maelstrom]

But yeah, drink water. What will you put on your cereal though?? WTF are you eating cereal?

I was gonna ask you about that. I've eaten ceral for breakfast and supper ever since I can remember. As bread/toast is also presumably out of the question - what do you typically eat for breakfast or supper brains?

 

[Brains Expel Hair]

Even though I've been there in the past, it somewhat saddens me to see people eat cereal for dinner. For breakfast I know it can be quite a hard habit to break but it's beneficial as it's been shown that whether you eat a high fat or high carb breakfast matters how your body responds to food for the rest of the day. A high carb breakfast will prime your body to adequately handle carbs while a high fat diet primes you to handle both fat and carbs. Additionally if you have any sort of insulin or inflammation issues, then the more meals you can cut carbs from the better.

My breakfast is almost always eggs of some sort. Mostly scrambled sometimes poached or in an omelette if I'm trying to impress someone. I'll normally vary how I spice it, what sort of additional stuff I put in it (like onions, tomatoes, peppers, herbs, avocados etc) and they're almost always cooked in butter, cream, coconut oil or pig fat if I've made a new stock recently (probably not something most people do). I'll often times include some non-cured sausage (trader joe's) along with the eggs or some plain "greek" yogurt which is on the very opposite end of the spectrum from lowfat (and much more delicious too!). Depending on what I've got in the fridge as far as left overs go and how much of a rush I'm in it can be anything from some microwaved meat to some cooked dark leafy greens such as mustard greens/collard greens/spinach but I normally prefer to save the left overs for lunch.

Just try to make each meal of the day a healthy nutritious one and you'll be doing well. Cereal is not a part of a balanced anything, the "balanced" breakfast that they always talk about would still be perfectly balanced even if you took out the cereal. The only benefit you get from cereal is the vitamins and minerals they spray on during the manufacturing process which means a multivitamin would be just as much if not more of a part of a balanced breakfast than that bowl of sugar would be. Eggs are a great way to start off the morning because they're a good source of protein, fat, vitamins and various micronutrients.