Massive, Sudden Shed With Diffuse Thinning On Crown--help!

[Valiant]

Gentlemen,

Any thoughts or opinions on this massive, sudden shed would be appreciated.

My regimen since about June 2013:

.25 mg/day Propecia (name brand)*
Minoxidil 5% (usually Kirkland), 2x day
Nizoral 1% shampoo, 2-3x week

*I used .25 mg as with tests my serum DHT was low (approx. 15 ng/mL) on the small dose and I had just started to emerge from a bad bout of sides in 2013.


I had regrown hair on my crown and filled in my front hairline. Hair was holding steady. First two pics are of my crown in June 2016 at the gym and my hairline from July 2016. Sorry I don’t have better pics, but I was not taking any crown/hairline pics because I did not have any issues.


I dropped nizoral this summer…no reason other than I just ran out and did not buy more. I dropped Min about mid-July or early August. I thought that the finasteride was doing all the work.


In early September, just after Labor Day, I started to notice a massive shed. Tons of hair in the shower, on my brush, on my pillow, on my shoulders, my crown was not as dense and my temples were starting to go big time. Losing 100+ day for sure. My scalp burns and itches, like bugs are crawling on it. Itching moves from spot to spot, i.e., not in the same spot. I have no visible rash.

In late Sept. I jumped back on nizoral and Min. Last two pics are current (Oct. 2016) pics. Same guy, I swear. I do have a scar visible in that pic.

In early Oct. I checked Total Test and it was in normal range (730 ng/dL, range 250-1100) My Free Test was really good (101.5 pg/mL, range 35-155) and my DHT was in the range it has been for 3-4 years, (15 ng/mL, range 16-79).

I had cycled/stacked a bunch of Test boosters this summer. Dumb reasons. But I did it.

Grape seed extract
Natto kinase
Nettle
Chrysin
Estro-DIM
Progesterone cream
Vitamin B
Several servings of BCAA’s every day

Dropped them all like garbage in mid-September.

Possible theories:

1. Minoxidil-related: Quitting Min contributed to the shed + restarting caused more shed; also caused itching/burning.
2. Genetic male pattern baldness: Propecia is not as effective anymore just due to aging. But, it seems to me that any loss of effectiveness would happen gradually, not in the period of about 8-10 weeks causing a massive shed.
   
3. Test-boosters: The test boosters jacked up my free test and pushed up my scalp DHT.
4. Stale batch of Propecia: This summer I was using an old bottle I found in my drawer that was filled in 2013. It was loose-fill too, meaning that the pills were put in a brown jar as opposed to the original packaging. Does finasteride lose effectiveness or go stale?
5. Telogen effluvium: Stress-related hairloss caused by wife getting stalked by ex-boyfriend in March 2016. Incredible stress for about 6-8 weeks until it got worked out.
6. Seborrheic dermatitis: Fungus is cause. I did have two scalp zits recently but I don’t have any visible rash.
7. Seasonal shed (fall fast approaching, getting colder, etc. I live in the north/USA.)
8. Other cause: Maybe a f**ked up thyroid, as my fingernails don’t grow as quickly anymore either.

I am going to my GP on 10/31.

 

[Vesemir]

1. Minoxidil-related. Most likely.
   
2. Genetic male pattern baldness. It could have gone into overdrive but in most cases it goes very slowly. So I don't think so.
   
3. Test-boosters. Don't think so.
   
4. Stale batch of Propecia. I don't know if finasteride can lose it effectiveness, but everything can go bad. You should be sure you take the right medicine.
   
5. Telogen effluvium. Don't think so. Every male would be slick bald that way.
   
6. Seborrheic dermatitis. Not likely but let your doctor check it out to be sure.
   
7. Seasonal shed. Most people will loose a little more hair but you aren't supposed to shed like a dog.
   
8. When we get ill or something like that we start to watch/notice things we haven't watched/noticed before.

 

[IggyPop]

Agree with option 1.

 

[Valiant]

Thanks for responding to my post; will update with Dr. thoughts.

 

[hairblues]

I would guess the minoxidil

BUT you may want to make sure you dont have 'scarring alopecia' which can under the scalp--its highly unlikely but it can cause pain and not be visible..Leaves no hair in the areas it attacks but i dont know the time line--i dont know much about it to be honest but i know it can cause pain.

i think its most likely the minoxidil because the time line.

 

[rafiles]

What was shedding rate before minoxidil. And how much Progesterone did you use.

I used both of them minoxidil Foam Liquid 2-3 years then stopped nothing happened. But the problem is, it also hasnt any positive effect, maybe therefore no shedding.
If the regrowth was from minoxidil (most likely) then if you stop you will most likely have aggressive shedding.
But if you wait and do nothing (no minoxidil), I think your shedding will be decreased and maybe you will have a bit regrowth again.
But most people cant wait that long (8 month -1 year).

Therefore if you havent any side effects, I would recommend to start minoxidil again maybe 1 time a day.

 

[Valiant]

Gents,

I have been back on my standard regimen for a while now and wanted to close out this thread.

My regimen:

finasteride .25 mg/day (I use name-brand and cut it into quarters, generic is too small to easily cut)
Min, 2x day
nizoral 2-3x week

I had been on this regimen since about June 2013. In the summer of 2016, I dropped the min completely and started noticing quit a bit of thinning (see earlier pics). I went back on the min and got hit with a massive shed, which resulted in this thread. I have been on min again 2x day. Here is a pic from October, at the time that I started this thread and a pic from five months later:

My views:

If you have read my story, which was long and then I posted a shorter version, I used finasteride for about 6 or 7 years with no side effects. I quit finasteride in late 2012 and experienced a total crash of my testosterone and full-blown sides. It took me about 11 months to get back to "normal" after resuming finasteride, but at the lower dose of .25 mg/day.

PFS is a real thing. Some men suffer from the side effects only after they quit. I would stick with min and nizoral and if you decide to start finasteride, do so with your eyes open to the risk of side effects. Let's face it -- most men don't have problems with sides. I know three guys in my neighborhood alone who use it in some form or fashion without sides. But, it can cause sides. On rare occasions, the sides don't resolve after quitting or like in some cases that I have had, that I have read about and that I have talked to others about, the sides start only after quitting. I use it now without sides but I have not tried to quit since June 2013. Quite frankly, I am afraid to have sides after quitting because I tried to quit twice and both times had bad hormonal responses.

Min is effective. Give it time to work before you judge it. I see threads with guys posting that they are suffering a shed and are going to quit after a couple of months or that it has been a few weeks and they haven't seen improvement. It takes longer than a few weeks and a shed is not unusual.

Finally, I have had bad anxiety about my hairloss and worse anxiety about sexual dysfunction. IMO, a normal sexual response and hair are not equal. It is great to have both but if I had to pick, I would pick sexual response every time.

I may not be posting or lurking for a while after this thread gets stale but encourage all of you to be educated and thoughtful about your treatment plan.

--Valiant

 

[dralex]

Holy sh*t you're a strong responder to minoxidil...lucky mofo

 

[stachu]

It was always bothering me. Why crown is filling easier than hairline or ultra restrictive f*****g temples.

 

[michel sapin]

great result man .never drop minoxidil !
just wanted to know, when you first started propecia in 2013 , your crown was thin?

 

[michel sapin]

and when you drop minoxidil you dip below baseline ?

 

[Valiant]

great result man .never drop minoxidil !
just wanted to know, when you first started propecia in 2013 , your crown was thin?

I quit finasteride and the restarted it. During that time I also did not use min. My crown was thin in 2013 similar to the Oct. 2016 pic above, but maybe not as bad.

 

[Valiant]

and when you drop minoxidil you dip below baseline ?

Yes I dipped below baseline and then started shedding like crazy when I restarted min.

 

[michel sapin]

below 2013 baseline ? so when you first started propecia you got crown regrowth ?

 

[Valiant]

Yes, I got crown regrowth on finasteride when I first started. It happened in 2005-2006 when I originally started finasteride and then again in 2013.

However, this whole thread really only concerns min. When I quit minoxidil in the summer of 2016 I started to shed on the crown, and then when I restarted I had a massive shed. Note I was on finasteride and have been since June 2013.

 

[Valiant]

It was always bothering me. Why crown is filling easier than hairline or ultra restrictive f*****g temples.

I don't know, but I have read threads where people have used minoxidil on the frontal hairline.