Only Certified Bozos Get Fut In Current Year

[hanginginthewire]

When I think about getting a transplant and waffle between strip versus extraction, this statement always rings in my ear. I feel like I'm headed for a 5 or 6 pattern of loss.

 

[shookwun]

Explain your reasoning aside from the most obvious. 'why would anyone want a fut linear fut scar at the back of the head, when I can 1000's of punch grafts instead'

There are reasons aside from cost why FUT is still considered the most viable approach for advanced norwoods.

 

[diffuse_thinner]

When I started reading the forums in the early 2000's, FUE was still in its infancy. The general consensus at the time was that FUE was good for small jobs, touch ups, repair work, etc and that the best approach on a virgin scalp would be a combination of FUT and FUE. Has anything changed? It's debatable, but some points in favor of strip include:
1: Likely higher yield and less transection( The techs can see the strip under a microscope)
2. More margin for error- FUE is harder to do and do well, whereas strip is fairly straight forward.
3. Depending on scalp laxity, more grafts can be taken via strip. If you're going to become very bald then this is obviously very important.
I guess it boils down to the question of what price is a strip scar?

 

[hanginginthewire]

Explain your reasoning aside from the most obvious. 'why would anyone want a fut linear fut scar at the back of the head, when I can 1000's of punch grafts instead'

There are reasons aside from cost why FUT is still considered the most viable approach for advanced norwoods.

No I agree, it's just I worry that FUT is dying out and that its a mistake to get it somehow. Quite literally the "certified bozo" comment that I read on some forum repeats in my mind. Leaping into FUT seems like a huge commitment. So yeah I don't know. Proponents of FUE make it sound like the transection and yield issues are pretty minor these days.

Is FUE harder to do if the patient is diffuse?

 

[shookwun]

No I agree, it's just I worry that FUT is dying out and that its a mistake to get it somehow. Quite literally the "certified bozo" comment that I read on some forum repeats in my mind. Leaping into FUT seems like a huge commitment. So yeah I don't know. Proponents of FUE make it sound like the transection and yield issues are pretty minor these days.

Is FUE harder to do if the patient is diffuse?

Well typically you would want to exert all FUT depending on scalp laxity. Afterwards maximize your FUE grafts to close off the scar, and fill in areas that otherwise need refinement, and tweaking.


every case is different, but for people heading to advanced stage they could very well be limiting them self on there donor potential. problem is most people are not willing to wait, and want the fastest, and quickest results they can get. Which I can understand, as a prior FUT patient... I didn't like the idea of not being able to keep my hair short, but for those who like it grown out.. always go FUT route first.


With FUT, an average donor can expect to yield around 2-3 strips depending on laxity and around 7500-10000 grafts

Afterwards we can exert all FUE, and possibly get another 2000-3000.



Most people cannot handle more then 5000 FUE without the risk of over harvesting the donor and looking like a moth ate the back of your head.


(dont post Erdogans ridiculous post transplant results either. these are all cherry picked with people who have exceptional donors)

i.e a 'classic erdogan patient posting' No surprise, a tier 1 donor. his 'average patient'

 

[shookwun]

Even if a NW5-6 gets a FUT on top of his FUE('s), it's still pointless, he will still look like he's balding.

The other day at the gym, I saw a NW6 who had a FUT, you could see the outline of his scar despite his hair being grown out, and he just had hair at the front while the rest of his scalp was slick bald.

Painful to watch, and because this bozo (yes!) had a FUT, shaving it or even buzzing it is not an option anymore, he will be forced to look like George Costanza forever now (or until we have new treatments).

There are no miracles, whether you chose FUE, multiple FUE's, multiple FUE's and FUT's, you'll never have a normal head of hair if you started off as a NW6, except for the rare exceptions who have an insanely thick donor area and are smart enough to choose a NW2.5 hair line.

I may look quite thin right now but at least I can still go for that shaved look, if I had to let my hair grow, I would look like a pathetic old uncle, even if I added 4000 more grafts with a FUT, no thanks.

there are to many variables involved to say that a NW5 will still look bald, even after several transplants. A lot of this outcome is depicted by your donor, but small characteristics such as skin contrast, and placement will have an impact on the illusion of the result.


There are no miracles, but under the right surgeon and guidance through miniaturization mapping we can establish a result that will appear aesthetic, and natural. FUT also has limitations, as you already mentioned for those that have average, and below donor. Makes it difficult to conceal the scar, and be a viable approach. FUE, would be an alternative to harvest minimal grafts, and still represent a natural donor.

But for most people who have average, and above donor areas, maximizing FUT is the best approach. But most people don't want to be patient, as a FUT donor area on average takes around 3 months to heal.


We can take into consideration this exceptional donor of this H&W patient after 7900 FUT grafts. A top percentile candidate who managed to have a remarkable result.

Dr Feriduni sums up FUT

'Compared to FUT, much fewer hairs can be extracted from the donor area in any one treatment session. In an FUT, the strip of hair is taken from the optimal part of the donor area, meaning that even bald patches between follicular units are removed. By contrast, FUE removes individual hairs or hair units, leaving the bald patches in between. This means that in such areas enough hair needs to be retained to avoid making the removal visible.
This basically means that only about half the amount of hairs can be extracted through FUE than would be taken through FUT. Generally speaking, about 20 - 25% of hairs can be extracted per square cm. This is a major disadvantage, greatly limiting the amount of donor hair. To gain enough donor hair for a transplant, a hair restoration surgeon is therefore often forced to extract hair follicles from above and below the ideal donor area.

Follicular Unit Extraction leaves behind a large number of wounds. Though these are all very small, they can still cause scarring. Such micro-scars can have a negative effect on the surrounding FUs, making any further treatment more difficult as the amount of potential donor hair is reduced.
Although new techniques and instruments have helped reduce these disadvantages, it needs to be stated clearly that FUE is not always the right option for patients with medium or advanced hair loss. A further disadvantage of FUE is that it is generally very time-consuming and causes high lab costs, making it relatively expensive.'

 

[JeanLucBB]

there are to many variables involved to say that a NW5 will still look bald, even after several transplants. A lot of this outcome is depicted by your donor, but small characteristics such as skin contrast, and placement will have an impact on the illusion of the result.


There are no miracles, but under the right surgeon and guidance through miniaturization mapping we can establish a result that will appear aesthetic, and natural. FUT also has limitations, as you already mentioned for those that have average, and below donor. Makes it difficult to conceal the scar, and be a viable approach. FUE, would be an alternative to harvest minimal grafts, and still represent a natural donor.

But for most people who have average, and above donor areas, maximizing FUT is the best approach. But most people don't want to be patient, as a FUT donor area on average takes around 3 months to heal.


We can take into consideration this exceptional donor of this H&W patient after 7900 FUT grafts. A top percentile candidate who managed to have a remarkable result.

Dr Feriduni sums up FUT

'Compared to FUT, much fewer hairs can be extracted from the donor area in any one treatment session. In an FUT, the strip of hair is taken from the optimal part of the donor area, meaning that even bald patches between follicular units are removed. By contrast, FUE removes individual hairs or hair units, leaving the bald patches in between. This means that in such areas enough hair needs to be retained to avoid making the removal visible.
This basically means that only about half the amount of hairs can be extracted through FUE than would be taken through FUT. Generally speaking, about 20 - 25% of hairs can be extracted per square cm. This is a major disadvantage, greatly limiting the amount of donor hair. To gain enough donor hair for a transplant, a hair restoration surgeon is therefore often forced to extract hair follicles from above and below the ideal donor area.

Follicular Unit Extraction leaves behind a large number of wounds. Though these are all very small, they can still cause scarring. Such micro-scars can have a negative effect on the surrounding FUs, making any further treatment more difficult as the amount of potential donor hair is reduced.
Although new techniques and instruments have helped reduce these disadvantages, it needs to be stated clearly that FUE is not always the right option for patients with medium or advanced hair loss. A further disadvantage of FUE is that it is generally very time-consuming and causes high lab costs, making it relatively expensive.'

The only reason I didn't get an FUT is expense. I can get 3600 grafts with Erdogan for 9000 Euros, but for FUT with someone like Rahal or Hassan it would cost twice that. FUE is only expensive in America and Canada where the surgeons have not even mastered it.

 

[shookwun]

The only reason I didn't get an FUT is expense. I can get 3600 grafts with Erdogan for 9000 Euros, but for FUT with someone like Rahal or Hassan it would cost twice that. FUE is only expensive in America and Canada where the surgeons have not even mastered it.

Let's hope that you have a good donor, and that you don't end up being over a NW5


Make sure those 5000 FUE grafts donor potential completely restore your hair


Fut is 4.50 CAD with Rahal, and H&W. Which is 3.21 euro a graft





I plan on having another FUT in the future after this FUE. Then I will completely close the scar off with 250 grafts.

FUT
FUE
FUT
FUE (scar closure)

 

[JeanLucBB]

Let's hope that you have a good donor, and that you don't end up being over a NW5


Make sure those 5000 FUE grafts donor potential completely restore your hair

A 3600 graft Norwood 0 transplant + the big three will keep me nice for at least 5 years, and after that I can become a monk and go up into the mountains and eat berries or something. I need hair NOW.

 

[shookwun]

A 3600 graft Norwood 0 transplant + the big three will keep me nice for at least 5 years, and after that I can become a monk and go up into the mountains and eat berries or something. I need hair NOW.

your norwood 0? that would mean that you have a full head of hair....


pictures?

 

[JeanLucBB]

your norwood 0? that would mean that you have a full head of hair....


pictures?

I meant to send me to one after I've got it done. I'm a norwood 3 atm.

 

[sunchyme1]

seems to me your fucked either way once you go past nw4. unless you dont mind having some kind of pathetic thin combover.

if your hairloss isnt gonna go past that because of genes/meds, then you might as well go for fut to get maximum grafts.

nw5 plus i would just shave it personally. guys who are heading nw5 plus are f*****g nuts to get fut.

its kind of paradoxical

fut may give high norwoods more grafts, but it would still look like sh*t. and you lose the option of just shaving it

fue gives you less grafts, but therefore a more pluggy look because of it. shaved or grown out

your fucked either way as a high norwood

 

[JeanLucBB]

seems to me your fucked either way once you go past nw4. unless you dont mind having some kind of pathetic thin combover.

if your hairloss isnt gonna go past that because of genes/meds, then you might as well go for fut to get maximum grafts.

nw5 plus i would just shave it personally. guys who are heading nw5 plus are f*****g nuts to get fut.

its kind of paradoxical

fut may give high norwoods more grafts, but it would still look like sh*t. and you lose the option of just shaving it

fue gives you less grafts, but therefore a more pluggy look because of it. shaved or grown out

your fucked either way as a high norwood

Some hair looks better than no hair. if you are going beyond a nw5 then it's tricky, but nw4 and 5s can still get good results.

 

[sunchyme1]

Some hair looks better than no hair. if you are going beyond a nw5 then it's tricky, but nw4 and 5s can still get good results.

it all depends on age/personal preference

some hair is definately not ALWAYS better than no hair. imo having thin coverage spread over your scalp looks either pathetic when grown out, or pluggy when cut short. your fucked as a high norwood

thin hair on top whilst your young just looks sad. better to buzz it. but when im older i wont mind it as much. dont need perfect density in my 40s plus

 

[GoldenMane]

Would it be possible to FUE 5000 grafts and then do a FUT later or must FUE be done before FUE? Never understood the reasoning behind the FUT first idea.

 

[Afro_Vacancy]

Would it be possible to FUE 5000 grafts and then do a FUT later or must FUE be done before FUE? Never understood the reasoning behind the FUT first idea.

FUT first to cover up your head.

Then an FUE to cover up the scar.

 

[GoldenMane]

Yeah but couldn't you just FUE your skin, extract half the FUs then later FUT it out and get all the remaining FUs in that strip. Why would the yield be any lower that way? Like excise the moth eaten FUEd skin and get whatever is left

 

[Pequod]

I've had two FUT's and will probably be getting a third one soon. Some people should not get FUT, while someone like myself can have it done. I am glad i went with FUT, and no I am not stuck with a comb-over. The guy at the gym went to a bad doctor or only did one procedure when he needed two or three.

There is a pharmacist in my area that was butchered by someone, little patchy areas and scars left here and there. He must have had an early FUE as a guinea pig. I wouldn't use him as an example of what normally happens to others.

There is some luck involved, you don't know how your body will react, and then you need to stop the loss to save what you have. The medical community is a joke, after all these years they know little about hair loss other than DHT. Minoxidil is even misunderstood by many people.

I would not do FUT for 1000 grafts. Many that have had FUE on hairlines have had horrible results. The hair on the back is not the same texture as on the front, but they have to learn that the hard way.

 

[shookwun]

I've had two FUT's and will probably be getting a third one soon. Some people should not get FUT, while someone like myself can have it done. I am glad i went with FUT, and no I am not stuck with a comb-over. The guy at the gym went to a bad doctor or only did one procedure when he needed two or three.

There is a pharmacist in my area that was butchered by someone, little patchy areas and scars left here and there. He must have had an early FUE as a guinea pig. I wouldn't use him as an example of what normally happens to others.

There is some luck involved, you don't know how your body will react, and then you need to stop the loss to save what you have. The medical community is a joke, after all these years they know little about hair loss other than DHT. Minoxidil is even misunderstood by many people.

I would not do FUT for 1000 grafts. Many that have had FUE on hairlines have had horrible results. The hair on the back is not the same texture as on the front, but they have to learn that the hard way.

I always lol at people who think they have more then 6000 FUE grafts. this on average is the max most people ever get.

People with poor donors will be lucky to get 4000
average 5000

amazing donor 6000


Like I said, FUT in the long run will yield more grafts on average, and then once you exert your entire scalp laxity, you can channel through the rest of the scalp all over the sides, and back for remaining FUES to add final coverage, and closure of scar.

Problem is, most people are not patient, and want results right away! Which I can understand.


My scar is literally a pencil thin mark from ear-to-ear. I have a few keloids, and raised areas... but this is entirely based on your own bodies biology.

I have a low fade which has a #1.5-2 around the scar and then blade tight every where else

 

[follicle2001]

The talk on this, and most, boards about FUT scars is overblown. MOST FUT scars are VERY hard to detect. FUT is still about half of all transplants, and for many it is a better option than FUE.

FUE is being aggressively marketed on the boards, online, and in print these days as the only way to go (See the Neograft ad in every issue of any airlines inflight magazine to see what I mean) but there are a lot of guys out there with crummy yields and bad overharvesting from FUE. Sure, some FUT scars are bad, but that does not take away from all the good FUT outcomes any more than the bad FUE outcomes take away from the good ones. FUE has also proliferated due to the low barrier to entry i.e. the turkish model.

Many people have both FUT and FUE over the course of their lifetime.

Pissing on one surgery while championing the other is just silly and, frankly, stupid. I suspect FUT and FUE will both be around for a long time as they play different roles in different patients at different points in their lives and hair transplant journey.