Why is Kerastem getting so much attention when there is a competing hypothesis

[Heavyduty]

Why is Kerastem getting so much attention when there is a surgeon is Spain trying to transplant stem cells from the hair follicle itself?

I'm not even trying to shill for the guy, his clinic is pretty average and there are far better hair transplant surgeons in Spain alone, but the man does claim to be extracting stem cells from the follicle without removing or damaging it in anyway, and as far as my knowledge goes no one else thought of this one.

If he's just outright lying to get publicity his business will get ruined so I don't think that's the case either.


Also, he said he is only transplanting stem cells from the follicle and hoping for a Hail Mary, can someone from Spain alert the man to the fact that he should be trying this along with transplanting fat just like Kerastem is doing? Sure it's cheating and stealing the idea but in the end if it works it's us who will win.

 

[Heavyduty]

I summon Swoop to give his opinion and make a devastating or hopeful analysis. You must have some opinion about this, I personally believe it can be combined with Kerastem for great results that neither alone can give.

 

[nameless]

I summon Swoop to give his opinion and make a devastating or hopeful analysis. You must have some opinion about this, I personally believe it can be combined with Kerastem for great results that neither alone can give.

You "summon" Swoop. LOL! Do you have a warrant or a subpoena?

Heavyduty, you might be right but nobody knows for sure.

 

[Heavyduty]

I think it's worth knowing his opinion, but yeah I can't exactly summon him..

 

[nameless]

I think it's worth knowing his opinion, but yeah I can't exactly summon him..

I got a big kick out of the way you worded it is all. It was funny.

 

[Heavyduty]

I got a big kick out of the way you worded it is all. It was funny.

Humour for coping with the fact that the guy could be very close to effectively "curing" hairloss, if only someone told him about kerastem. It's my intuitive, gut feeling, as a layman of course, that while neither by itself is going to do much, both, combined, could be it, Androgenetic Alopecia solved by 2018, only at a much higher price than what we were expecting, maybe by 2020 it could be down to affordable prices.

Again, to all our Spanish posters, ideally from Barcelona, please alert the man that he should be trying to do what he does along with kerastem, or at least the fat component.

 

[Pray The Bald Away]

Humour for coping with the fact that the guy could be very close to effectively "curing" hairloss, if only someone told him about kerastem. It's my intuitive, gut feeling, as a layman of course, that while neither by itself is going to do much, both, combined, could be it, Androgenetic Alopecia solved by 2018, only at a much higher price than what we were expecting, maybe by 2020 it could be down to affordable prices.

Again, to all our Spanish posters, ideally from Barcelona, please alert the man that he should be trying to do what he does along with kerastem, or at least the fat component.

How do you know neither will do much on their own? Just curious because that would be depressing as hell if true.

 

[Heavyduty]

How do you know neither will do much on their own? Just curious because that would be depressing as hell if true.

The Yale paper I read was a proof of concept for mice, as Swoop said before a ton of things grow hair on mice but fail on humans, plus Kerastem has been out for a while apparently and I'm yet to hear any convincing testimony.

As for the surgeon attempting to transplant stem cells from the follicles in the back of the head, it's literally a Hail Mary he already mentioned that on a small but significant number of people it failed to grow hair, I wouldn't be surprised if it was actually higher.

These two treatments go together perfectly imo.

 

[nameless]

The Yale paper I read was a proof of concept for mice, as Swoop said before a ton of things grow hair on mice but fail on humans, plus Kerastem has been out for a while apparently and I'm yet to hear any convincing testimony.

As for the surgeon attempting to transplant stem cells from the follicles in the back of the head, it's literally a Hail Mary he already mentioned that on a small but significant number of people it failed to grow hair, I wouldn't be surprised if it was actually higher.

These two treatments go together perfectly imo.

The Spanish surgeon attempting to transplant hair cells will still have the trichogenicity problem that everyone else is having. The Chinese may have solved that problem but if they have then they
won't need the Spanish Surgeon. So I think your suggestion is not going to solve anything. Now if you get Kerastem and the chinese DP cells research group together that might be something good.

 

[Pray The Bald Away]

The Spanish surgeon attempting to transplant hair cells will still have the trichogenicity problem that everyone else is having. The Chinese may have solved that problem but if they have then they
won't need the Spanish Surgeon. So I think your suggestion is not going to solve anything. Now if you get Kerastem and the chinese DP cells research group together that might be something good.

The Chinese solved trichogenisity but they still have to work on gene expression. From what I hear, there is still a ton of work to be done on that. And how can we know that the new hair follicles will cycle correctly? It just seems there are so many unanswered questions and unsolved problems.

 

[Heavyduty]

The Spanish surgeon attempting to transplant hair cells will still have the trichogenicity problem that everyone else is having. The Chinese may have solved that problem but if they have then they
won't need the Spanish Surgeon. So I think your suggestion is not going to solve anything. Now if you get Kerastem and the chinese DP cells research group together that might be something good.

See, now this is the kind of detailed analysis for which I made the thread. Kerastem + Chinese DP cells, who would have thought about this just a couple of years ago? We can't be that far way.

 

[nameless]

The Chinese solved trichogenisity but they still have to work on gene expression. From what I hear, there is still a ton of work to be done on that. And how can we know that the new hair follicles will cycle correctly? It just seems there are so many unanswered questions and unsolved problems.

The Chinese think they might be close enough. They want to start human trials.

 

[Pray The Bald Away]

The Chinese think they might be close enough. They want to start human trials.

Really? That's fantastic news! Can you post a link?

 

[nameless]

Really? That's fantastic news! Can you post a link?

I googled everything I could about it when this story broke days ago and I don't recall where I saw that but I saw it somewhere.

I assumed everyone would do searchers on it and see everything I saw. I guess not.

 

[Pray The Bald Away]

I googled everything I could about it when this story broke days ago and I don't recall where I saw that but I saw it somewhere.

Are you talking about the article desmond found? That said nothing about coming to trials soon. I'm skeptical. As far as I've heard, the gene expression problem hasn't been solved.

 

[nameless]

Are you talking about the article desmond found? That said nothing about coming to trials soon. I'm skeptical. As far as I've heard, the gene expression problem hasn't been solved.

The article by Desmond is where I started searching. I then started googling and yahooing the information and found more stories. I read everything I could find about it. I put some
hours into it. If I had known other people weren't doing the same thing I would have posted some of the things I came across but I assumed everybody was doing their own searches
about it. Anyway, in the relevant story the interviewer asked the researcher about human studies and he said he wanted to do that. The interviewer asked him if he could go straight
to human studies in China, and he said just like in the USA with the FDA he would have to submit an application to Chinese authorities and wait for permission to proceed with human
studies. They exchanged a few sentences back and forth about the technology moving to human studies. I don't know where that article is. I read it, got the info I wanted from it, and
then I was done with it.

 

[Pray The Bald Away]

The article by Desmond is where I started searching. I then started googling the information and found more stories. I read everything I could find about it. I put some hours into it.
If I had known other people weren't doing the same thing I would have posted some of the things I came across but I assumed everybody does it. In the relevant story I came across
an interviewer asked the researcher about human studies and he said he wanted to do that. The interviewer asked him if he could go straight to human studies in China and he said
that same as the USA and FDA he would have to submit information to Chinese authorities and wait for approval to progress to human studies. They exchanged a few sentences about
the technology moving to human studies. I don't know where that article is. I read it, got the info I wanted from it, and then I was done with it.

I think you're talking about the hairlosscure2020 guy's interview with the head Chinese researcher. He wasn't saying they were going to trials yet. He just said it's possible to have a treatment out of trials by 2020 given the right conditions.

 

[nameless]

I think you're talking about the hairlosscure2020 guy's interview with the head Chinese researcher. He wasn't saying they were going to trials yet. He just said it's possible to have a treatment out of trials by 2020 given the right conditions.

I don't know. Post it and I'll tell you if it's the same thing.

And anyway you're mischaracterizing what I said that he said. I never said he was DEFINITELY taking it
into human trials. If you look at my previous posts above on this subject I said he wanted to go to human
trials. Here is exactly what I said:

The Chinese think they might be close enough. They want to start human trials.

 

[Pray The Bald Away]

I don't know. Post it and I'll tell you if it's the same thing.

And anyway you're mischaracterizing what I said that he said. I never said he was DEFINITELY taking it
into human trials. If you look at my previous posts above on this subject I said he wanted to go to human
trials. Here is exactly what I said:

The Chinese think they might be close enough. They want to start human trials.

http://www.hairlosscure2020.com/interview-with-dr-malcolm-xing/ Chill, I was just inquiring.

 

[nameless]

http://www.hairlosscure2020.com/interview-with-dr-malcolm-xing/ Chill, I was just inquiring.

I'm cool. I wasn't trying to give you a hard time. I just wanted to be sure that I don't get misquoted. I don't recall if it's the same story or not but the story you yourself linked indicates that the Chinese are trying to move their technique into human trials and it indicates that the Chinese are adding something(s) new to what Jahoda has already done with his 3-d cellular research. Here are 4 lines from the story that you linked:

1.“Xing is currently trying to move the technology from the bench to the bedside.”

2. Yes, we are trying to apply this trial in China. China has similar regulations to the US. Currently, several Chinese industry partners show their interests in collaborations. There potential partners have already biomedical products approved by China FDA. Right now, I am also looking forward to the industry collaboration from Canada.

3. Not sure for these final trials before the end of 2020, but we are working at this goal. Yes, we need funds from government and industry to move this application forward.

4. In our another new work (to be submitted), we already combined currently published nano-clothing with 3D spheroids for hair regeneration. It’s very difficult for me to say which one is easier.

And in this article below they talk about how they have improved the 3-d model and added new things:

http://www.laboratoryequipment.com/news/2016/03/culturing-cells-more-effective-hair-loss-treatments

Here is a quote from the above article (with relevant bolding & enlarging by me):
"To better mimic the natural environment cells experience inside the body, researchers have developed 3-D cell culturing techniques, but these have limitations. So, Zhiqi Hu, Malcolm Xing and colleagues decided to make improvements and test the system with DP cells."

If you put all of the above statements together they support my position that the Chinese claim they have improved on Jahoda's technology, they think they might be close enough, and they want to take the technique into human studies. As a matter of fact, I don't understand how you read those statements before (asking me to demonstrate that the Chinese said these things) and came to a different conclusion. It kind of makes me wonder if you drink a lot of alcohol or maybe heavy into illegal drugs.