Worried About GYNO from PROPECIA or AVODART

d00fy

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Alright to everyone worried about GYNO here are your two options offered by me , NOLVADEX and ARIMIDEX, i have a slight small case of gyno, mine is from steroid use, i combat the irritation and swolleness of the nipple with nolvadex, one dose keeps my NIPPLE feeling pain free

defwer@bellsouth.net
20mg/50ml nolvadex
1mg/30ml airmidex

Here is some information on the 2
 

d00fy

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NOLVADEX


his remedy is somewhat different from others since it is not an anabolic/androgenic steroid. For male and female bodybuilders, how-ever, it is a very useful and recommended compound which is con-firmed by its widespread use and mostly positive results. Nolvadex belongs to the group of sex hormones and is a so-called antiestrogen.


The normal application of Nolvadex is in the treatment of certain forms of breast cancer in female patients. With Nolvadex it is pos-sible to reverse an existing growth process of deceased tissue and prevent further growth. The growth of certain tissues is stimulated by the body's own estrogen hormone. This is especially true for the breast glands in men and women since the body has a large number of estrogen receptors at these glands which can bond with the estro-gens present in the blood. If the body's own estrogen level is unusu-ally high an undesired growth of breast glands occurs. However, in healthy women and particularly in men this is not the case. Despite this, it is mostly male bodybuilders who use Nolvadex, and fewer women. At first sight this seems somewhat inconceivable but when taking a closer look, the reasons are clear. Bodybuilders who take Nolvadex also use anabolic steroids at the same time. Since most steroids aromatize more or less strongly, i.e. part of the substance is converted into estrogens, male bodybuilders can experience a sig-nificant elevation in the normally very low estrogen level. This can lead to feminization symptoms such as gynecomastia (growth of breast glands), increased fat deposits and higher water retention.



The antiestrogen Nolvadex works against this by blocking the es-trogen receptors of the effected body tissue, thereby inhibiting a bonding of estrogens and receptor. It is, however, important to un-derstand that Nolvadex does not prevent the aromatization but only acts as an estrogen antagonist. This means that it does not prevent testosterone and its synthetic derivatives (steroids) from converting into estrogens but only fights with them in a sort of "competition" for the estrogen receptors. This characteristic has the disadvantage that after the discontinuance of Nolvadex a "rebound effect" can occur which means that the suddenly freed estrogen receptors are now able to absorb the estrogen present in the blood. For this reason the combined intake of Proviron is suggested (see Proviron.) Nolvadex is also useful during a diet since it helps in the burning of fat. Al-though Nolvadex has no direct fatburning effect its antiestrogenic effect contributes to keeping the estrogen level as low as possible. Nolvadex should especially be taken together with the strong an-drogenic steroids Dianabol and Anadrol 50, and the various test-osterone compounds. Athletes who have a tendency to retain water and who have a mammary dysfunction should take Nolvadex as a prevention during every steroid intake. Since Nolvadex is very affective in most cases it is no wonder that several athletes can take Anadrol 50 and Dianabol until the day of a competition, and in combination with a diuretic still appear totally ripped in the. limelight. Those who already have a low body fat content will achieve a visibly improved muscle hardness with Nolvadex.


Several bodybuilders like to use Nolvadex at the end of a steroid cycle since it increases the body's own testosterone production -which will be discussed in more detail in the following-to counter-act the side effects caused by the estrogens. These can occur after the discontinuance of steroids when the androgen level in relationship to the estrogen concentration is too low and estrogen becomes the dominant hormone. A very rare but all the more serious problem of Nolvadex is that in some cases it does not lower the estrogen level but can increase it. Another disadvantage is that it can weaken the anabolic effect of some steroids. The reason is that Nolvadex, as we know, reduces the estrogen level. The fact is, however, that certain steroids -especially the various testosterone compounds-can only achieve their full effect if the estrogen level is sufficiently high. Those who are used to the intake of larger amounts of various steroids do not have to worry about this. Athletes however, who predominantly use mild steroids such as Primobolan, Winstrol, Oxandrolone, and Deca-Durabolin should carefully consider whether or not they should take Nolvadex since, due to the compound's already moderate ana-bolic effect, an additional loss of effect could take place, leading to unsatisfying results.


A rarely observed but welcome characteristic of Nolvadex is that it has a direct influence on the hypothalamus and thus, by an in-creased release of gonadotropine, it stimulates the testosterone pro-duction in the testes. This does not result in a tremendous but still a measurable increase of the body's own testosterone. This effect, however, is not sufficient to significantly increase the testosterone production reduced by anabolic/androgenic steroids.


The side effects of Nolvadex are usually low in dosages of up to 30 mg/day In rare cases nausea, vomiting, hot flashes, numbness, and blurred vision can occur. In women irregular menstrual cycles can occur which manifest themselves in weaker menstrual bleeding or even complete missing of a period. Women should also be careful not to get pregnant while taking Nolvadex. It is important for fe-male athletes that Nolvadex and the "pill" not be taken together since the antiestrogen Nolvadex and the estrogen-containing pill nega-tively counterfeit each other. The normal daily dosage taken by athletes corresponds more or less to the dosage indications of the manufacturer and is 10-30 mg/day To prevent estrogenic side ef-fects normally 10 mg/day are sufficient, a dosage which also keeps low the risk of reducing the effect of simultaneously-taken ste-roids. Often it is sufficient if the athlete begins this preventive intake of Nolvadex only three to four weeks after the intake of anabolics. Athletes who have tendencies toward gynecomastia, strong water retention, and increased fat deposits with steroids such as Dianabol, Testosterone, Anadrol 50, and Deca-Durabolin usually take 20-30 mg/day The combined application of Nolvadex 20-30 mg/day and Proviron 25-50 mg/day in these cases leads to excellent results. The same is true for athletes who are in competition, and for women. Women, however, should do without the intake of Proviron or at least reduce the dose to one 25 mg tablet per day. Unfortunately, in most cases, a very pronounced gynecomastia ("b**ch tits") cannot be reduced by taking Nolvadex so that often surgery is required, surgery which is not paid for by health insurance. First signs of a possible gynecomastia are light pain when touching the nipples. The tablets are usually taken 1-2x daily, swallowed whole without chewing, with some liquid during meals.


Nolvadex unfortunately is a very expensive compound. Some ex-amples: In Germany one hundred 20 mg tablets cost $192. In Spain the prices are fixed by the govern-ment and it makes no difference whether it is an original Nolvadex or a generic compound. One hundred 20 mg tablets cost approx. $60 in Spain. In Greece the same quantity costs about $85. The athlete should look for the 20-mg version since, from its price, it is the most economical. On the black-market, mostly the foreign Nolvadex can be found costing about $2 - 3 per 20 mg tablet. Origi-nal Nolvadex tablets can be easily identified since, on the front, ICI (name of the manufacturer) is stamped and, on the back, the name "Nolvadex". Most of the time the tablet strength is also imprinted. Ten tablets are included in an unusually large push-through strip. In the U.S. original Nolvadex is packaged by the manufacturer, ICI Pharma, in small, white plastic boxes with a childproof screw cap. So far there are no fakes of Nolvadex and its generic products.
 

d00fy

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AIRMIDEX

Anastrozole (Arimidex) is the aromatase inhibitor of choice. The drug is appropriately used when using substantial amounts of
aromatizing steroids, or when one is prone to gynecomastia and using moderate amounts of such steroids. Arimidex does not have the side effects of aminoglutethimide (Cytadren) and can achieve a high degree of estrogen blockade, much moreso than Cytadren. It is possible to reduce estrogen too much with Arimidex, and for this reason blood tests, or less preferably salivary tests, should be taken after the first week of use to determine if the dosing is correct.


As an aromatase inhibitor, Arimidex's mechanism of action -- blocking conversion of aromatizable steroids to estrogen -- is in contrast to the mechanism of action of anti-estrogens such as clomiphene (Clomid) or tamoxifen (Nolvadex), which block estrogen receptors in some tissues, and activate estrogen receptors in others. During a cycle, if using Arimidex, there is generally no need to use Clomid as well, but (as mentioned in the section on Clomid) there may still be benefits to doing so.


Arimidex is quite expensive, costing approximately $9 per milligram. With moderate doses of testosterone 0.5 mg/day is usually sufficient and in some cases may be too much.
 

drinkrum

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You use 1 mg of Arimidex/day? That's the same dosage recommended for post-menopausal women suffering from breast cancer. That can't be healthy.

D.
 

d00fy

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.25mg each day or 1mg each other day is what most steroid users take :) it inhibits estrogen blocking to the receptors, nolvadex just cobats already whats there ,while arimidex prevents it from happening in the 1st place
 

misterium

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Yeah so why did you take steroids then to begin with?
 

muii

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he was probably competeing amaturely as a bodybuilder, i used to compete in all natural bodybuilding and so i know what goes on in the feild ...i never did the stuff, and when your competing, its prevelant out there..and quite a few people take it to enhance their look big time...but its filled with side effects...so i never touched the sh*t..
 

misterium

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^ Well, I find that just silly then.

"For every action there is a blah blah blah blah blah"..

I suppose it goes the same in the case of steroids... DON'T TOUCH EM, f*** BEING ARNOLD BIG !
 

Thinning

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I dont understand why you Gyno sufferers dont have the surgical solution to your problem. Once they remove the fat cells and breast tissue you have nothing to worry about. You dont want to be taking those meds forever.

Speaking of gyno, I saw that very muscular boxer Clifford Etienne box a couple months ago and he had some serious man-boobs. When he bounced up and down during his warm up it looked pretty bad. I wonder if his muscularity and gyno were due to some steroid use.
 

BadHairDecade

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Thinning said:
I dont understand why you Gyno sufferers dont have the surgical solution to your problem. Once they remove the fat cells and breast tissue you have nothing to worry about.

This simply just isn't true.

And as far as taking steriods....I can honestly say it was the single stupidest thing I've ever done in my life. If there was one thing in my life that I could change I would have never gotten involved with that stuff.
 

Thinning

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BadHairDecade said:
Thinning said:
I dont understand why you Gyno sufferers dont have the surgical solution to your problem. Once they remove the fat cells and breast tissue you have nothing to worry about.

This simply just isn't true.

Really? Because I was thinking of getting some fat lipo'd from my love handles area because its very difficult to get lean for me there and when I did some seaches for lipo clinics many of them showed guys getting their breasts reduced. It looked extremly effective. If I had the problem I would be all over that surgery. Do some internet searches for "male Liposuction" and see what I mean.
 

BadHairDecade

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Thinning said:
BadHairDecade said:
Thinning said:
I dont understand why you Gyno sufferers dont have the surgical solution to your problem. Once they remove the fat cells and breast tissue you have nothing to worry about.

This simply just isn't true.

Really? Because I was thinking of getting some fat lipo'd from my love handles area because its very difficult to get lean for me there and when I did some seaches for lipo clinics many of them showed guys getting their breasts reduced. It looked extremly effective. If I had the problem I would be all over that surgery. Do some internet searches for "male Liposuction" and see what I mean.


Lipo for love handles isn't permanent either. You have to maintain a strict diet or else they will come back.
Surgery usually is the only cure for Gyno. However if you continue to take a drug that's giving it to you, it will return.
 

drinkrum

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Bingo, BHD. And don't forget that surgery isn't as simple as taking a pill. There are often complications, there is a sufficient recovery period, and your pectoral muscles and nipple area may not look normal afterwards.

D.
 

d00fy

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if you reduce your bf% thats also a good chance for reducing the fat around the chest area, fat cells hold on to estrogen!!
 
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