All we need to know about RU58841

[pv78]

Hi everybody,
I carefully read your discussions about Ru588841,and I'm interested in it.
And I suppose to be a good candidate to establish if it works.
My story:31 y.o.
My alopecia started 1 year ago.
Now at day, I'm a Norwood 1/2,but my alopecia is a diffuse pattern and all my hairs are still in my head,just miniaturized,but I have no vellus.
So this shoud be the best situation for testing RU58841 efficacy,like El Duterino wrote.
I'm a doctor too (a medicine nuclear doctor),so I that I have a knowledge of drugs and sides.
I don't use finasteride,because it gives to me gymnecomasty.I'm very sensitive to ormonal changings:so I'm a good candidate to estimaty possible internal absorptiont or accumulation of the drug.
So I bought Ru58841 yesterday from Elitenet and I want to start a personal trial.It will be with photos,by the way I think things must be accurate,so that words like "In my opinion" or "Maybe" are not correct.
So I cut my hairs 3 mm,so that:
-Application is easier
-All the pothos can be take at the same hair lenght
If my hairs would be longer than 3 mm at photo time,I'll cut before.
All the photos will be taken with the same photography machine and in the same conditions,from the top of the head with flash.
I'll post 1 photography every week.
But before getting started I think it is necessary standardize the procedure,and I ask you some advice:
-First of all,I think to prepare Ru58841 every day before use.Stockage of the powder will be in the freezer.
-I have some 3 ml bottles with a micropipet where I will put the solution.
I want to use isopropyl alcohol for solution:and this is the first question.Can I use a 100% solution of it?For a question of confort.....
It will be in the bottles in quantity of 3 ml and I will add a 150 mg of Ru58841,so that I will get a 5% solution.And this is the second question:I'm not a good chemical,so that can you check if this proportion is correct?
The third question is:how much daily Ru58841?I read in El Duterino discussion that he suggests 20 mg/die but he used 200 mg/die:it is 10 times bigger!
So that I'd like to know from him or someone who had results how much Ru58841 used daily.
Please consider that I'm 5.9 feet and 81 kg of weight.
Another consideration:the cost of terapy.5g are 239 usd,about 177 euros.150 mg/die are about 1 month of use:it is so very expensive.
I'll check every month:
-Ast
-Alt
-GammaGt
To evaluate possible epatical damages.
I will use also Fluridil too:not to copy El Duterino regimen,but for the reason I'm already using from one month,and it decreased my shedding but no regrow.

The possible bias are:
-Stock of Ru58871 gone bad or cut with other substances.Did anyone from Elinet have a bad expedition?Is it true the story about smelly fish of good powder and yellow colour?
-Interaction with other substances:i.e. fluridil,etc.....
-Amount too small.People with succesfull experimentations how much powder did they use daily?
-Bad solvent:suggest about better solvent?

In my opinion,these could be good lineguides to try a "self" trial.
It would be very interesting that someone else in the forum would start too,using the same methods.And if possible,with the same regimen,Norwood,and age or similar.....

Thank you in advance for your reply

 

[pv78]

Waiting for answers,reading the famous article about Ru58841 on machacos,I made some considerations.Maybe correct,maybe not.
They used a 5% solution and used 0,5 ml daily.It means 25 mg of Ru58841.
But they used an area of 50 cm2,so that they used 0,5 mg/cm2.
Now,considering that the entire upper of male scalp is about 254 cm2,but I'm not so sure,this means that for a man we can use about 125 mg of Ru58841 daily.So that maybe we have a solid proof that 150 mg daily could be a fair value.
Any opinions?

 

[barcafan]

What delivery vehicle is best to reduce systemic absorption?

Liposomal?

 

[first]

So that maybe we have a solid proof that 150 mg daily could be a fair value.
Any opinions?

I had good results with 100 mg/day (all over the male pattern baldness-area of the scalp) yet some results with 20 mg/day. There is clearly a difference in results between the two yet both do show some results.

So, from my experience 100 mg will yield good results, what it comes down to in the end is how much you can afford.

 

[amsch]

So that maybe we have a solid proof that 150 mg daily could be a fair value.
Any opinions?

I had good results with 100 mg/day (all over the male pattern baldness-area of the scalp) yet some results with 20 mg/day. There is clearly a difference in results between the two yet both do show some results.

So, from my experience 100 mg will yield good results, what it comes down to in the end is how much you can afford.

first, what where your results using RU? Is this your only treatment right now? Any details?

 

[aussiedavid]

The Elitenet site says the RU must be kept below 4C. If it's shipped unrefrigerated, won't it be degraded by the higher temps?

Would it be possible to mix the RU in with my minoxidil solution? Will it dissolve ok?

It seems like a 5% solution of RU is the way to go, so that would mean having 5g of RU in a 100ml solution, or 1g in a 20ml solution. It's suggested that it should be made in small quantities and the rest left refrigerated until needed, so I guess making a 20ml solution would be best. So, if I got 19ml of my minoxidil solution and added 1g of RU, would that be the right mix? Is it possible the RU won't dissolve in the minoxidil solution, or it will destroy the solution?

I'm very tempted to give it a go, but I'm a novice when it comes to chemistry, so I want to keep it simple. I also travel a lot, so keeping it cool would be a problem. In the back of my mind I also wonder why it's not being used commercially, especially with such good results in the monkey trials. Side effects maybe???

 

[el_duterino]

powder will not degrade so fast in heat - this is not sushi.
the key is to make fresh lotion mixes each day and keep powder it in the freezer whenever you can for long term storage - but no need to be paranoid. travel is fine and shipping is no problem...

if it was a problem no one would have any success since the powder spends weeks in ambiant temparture for all of us during shipping.

 

[aussiedavid]

Thanks el-duterino. Is the RU working for you? Is 2% strong enough. The monkey trial was 5%. I really only need to use it on my temples and hairline. One ml/day is all I need to cover that area. Can you suggest a formula for me to make?

 

[el_duterino]

Forget about %..just use the real amount in gramms since it depends on how much lotion you need , hair length etc..

I now use 20 mg a day for hairline/temples.

Anything between 20mg to 60mg a day would be sufficient to maintain hair. Very little RU is needed really.
And this makes cost quite reasonnable too.

The macquaques are different - in the tests they used a lot more to show regrowth - but humans do not get regrowth using anti-androgens only, unlike animals, even at high doses..and high doses of RU are not safe.
RU goes systemic and will cause side effects if you use too much...and perhaps other more severe health issues as well.

 

[beaner]

.... but humans do not get regrowth using anti-androgens only.....

What makes you say that when evidence like the Propecia trials and user experience tells us the opposite?

 

[amsch]

Forget about %..just use the real amount in gramms since it depends on how much lotion you need , hair length etc..

I now use 20 mg a day for hairline/temples.

Anything between 20mg to 60mg a day would be sufficient to maintain hair. Very little RU is needed really.
And this makes cost quite reasonnable too.

The macquaques are different - in the tests they used a lot more to show regrowth - but humans do not get regrowth using anti-androgens only, unlike animals, even at high doses..and high doses of RU are not safe.
RU goes systemic and will cause side effects if you use too much...and perhaps other more severe health issues as well.

I'm still very skeptical as you were on topicals only for a very short time before you started finasteride again. So how do you know RU+fluridil would be able to thicken your hair without propecia? In this short time it should be impossible to tell, duti!

 

[barcafan]

you guys are crazy using a totally untested drug without knowing the possible side effects

 

[casken]

I was just considering adding RU58841 to try to halt the heavy shedding of my hairline that I've been experiencing in my nine months on Propecia, but I've noticed that elitenet says "Product Unavailable. The product is currently unavailable, please check back later."

So is FaithEagle the only place to get it from now?

 

[casken]

So when you email Faith Eagle, do you just ask for a price quote for gram, or do you have to specify how much you want?

 

[let-it-grow]

Maybe that's kind of an odd question, but what if a minoxidil user would stop using minoxidil after two years and some good results, and instead he'd start using RU58841 - would he still lose the hairs he gained by minoxidil? (since he stopped minoxidil). Or RU58841 will just grow them back or just make them stay?

When it could get a FDA approval? It's possible to get this RU from China and Korea, but when it would officially be available in the US? What is the name of the company that is researching about it?

 

[el_duterino]

faith eagle do not give discounts based on volume - i already asked them before.

Unless they changed their prices due to the low dollar these days, last time I ordered (April 09)it was $30 per gram, minimum 10 g order and $110 flat rate for shipping (same rate applies to any country).So that's 410 minimum to get you in the game.

Shipping is a bit expensive so I usually order 15g.

Keep in mind that you don't need to use a lot of RU to maintain hair, around 20 mg to 60mg a day should be sufficient. So this $410 couyld last anywhere between 6 months to a year depending on your area of application.

Keep in mind that the drug has not been tested for safety in humans and use it at your own risk.

I did some "human testing" on my humble self ..as always I am ready to take some risks...and used 400mg a day for a few months then 200mg a day.

I am still alive.. but had some recurring episodes of angioedema during this time..not sure if this related..and cut down on dosage.
I am on 20mg a day now and this works ok ont he hairline and temples.
I stopped using PG in the mix and only use Ethanol now.

About stopping minoxidil, no one really knows but it would be interesting to try it out and report back to help us all building a better knowledge base on these drugs and how they interact.

 

[let-it-grow]

If every lab could sell RU58841 then why would the big drug companies invest tens of millions on researching and get an FDA approval for something that other companies could and would sell also, and for less? That's why this RU58841 is stuck for years, Mercks prefer to sell Propecia other than researching a drug that it 10 times better and won't be their patent. It's all about money here.

Do you think that using RU58841 alone will have a great effect also? Without taking finasteride.

 

[kento]

el_duterino: Why did you stop putting PG in the mix. My plan is to use 100mg ru in 70/30 alcohol/pg, having very long hair i hope that the right daily dose.

About eucapil what is the best time to apply topical after/before.

 

[kento]

That's why this RU58841 is stuck for years, Mercks prefer to sell Propecia other than researching a drug that it 10 times better and won't be their patent. It's all about money here.

Do you think that using RU58841 alone will have a great effect also? Without taking finasteride.

RU isn't an wonder drug. I guess the respond rate is bigger than propecia but about the results is same or maybe little better than propecia. I guess it's a great option for people who got sides from propecia. That why i planing to take it.

RU patent is in one Scottish company who are in Phase II but seem that they aren't pushing up hard to make ru on the market.

 

[el_duterino]

I stopped using PG to see if my angioedema was linked to a PG allergy.

It works also fine without PG, and dries very fast but the lotion is very thin and can easily drop onto the face and eyes .PG makes it easier to apply.

I would use Fluridil at night and RU in the morning, or opposite or do EOD.
But its really up to you. Fluridil needs a clean and dry scalp to work and needs to be left on top for a t least 3 hours before washing hair or uising another topical on top of it.
Avoid sun exposure right after using alcohol based topicals.