Azelaic Acid revisited...Again

[Bryan]

Bryan: I read the posted exchange you had with Doctor Lee a while back and it was "weird". No doubt about that. He definitely didn't answer your question directly. All he had to say was "yes, but in my clinical experience AA is a good treatment".

Exactly!! If he had simply said from the beginning something like, "Yeah, I see that you're right...there's no real evidence that azelaic acid works in living humans; however, I still believe from my clinical experience that it's helpful for balding", then I wouldn't have said much more about it.

But what REALLY left a bad taste in my mouth is that he didn't say the above at all, he kept saying something to the effect, "Oh, there's LOTS of scientific evidence for it", and he'd keep posting studies showing (for example) that it works for acne; then I'd come back and say yeah, it works for acne because it's an ANTIBACTERIAL, damnit! Show me evidence that it reduces DHT! And then he'd say, oh there's TONS of evidence for that! And I'd say, in effect, SHOW ME SOME, DAMNIT!! He never was able to do that. He finally bailed-out of the discussion without producing any real evidence at all, and never admitted that there wasn't any.

However, I just can't bring myself to think of him as dishonest in any way. Maybe I'm being naive. I just like the guy and think he is very reputable.

Maybe there's a shadowy middle-ground, a sort of "Twilight Zone" between honesty and dishonesty. Maybe deep-down, he sees the inherent problems with the claims he makes for azelaic acid, but can't QUITE bring himself to acknowledge them to his customers, or even to himself. It's called being in denial! :wink:

Bryan

 

[michael barry]

Bryan,

Maybe Lee is having a hard time finding either a alpha-five inhibitor or a recetor blocker he can mix with finasteride and not have them react together so they can both be used in the same product.

Dr. Lee is not a PHd Pharmacologist like Proctor is? It would seem that the typical fatty acids like ALA, GLA, LA, OA that one might use or a "suspected" receptor "intereferer" like beta sitosterol (which would probably be expensive to synthesize in large amounts because it doesn't occur in large quantities in nature------but is in good portions found in an industrial byproduct called tall oil) might react with minoxidil, and make them (or the minoxidil) unneffective.?


Everyone would like a product that put a great growth stimulator with proven anti-androgens with no systemic side effects. Proxiphen does this, revivogen tries it with grape seed proanthocyanidins. Crinagen doesnt work (my opinion), American Crew uses green tea extract and topical saw palmetto with barley or hops (I forget) proanthocyanidins and copper peptides (the L-alanine, histydil, the third stooge not ontop of my head) complex in tricomin. There's surely some more out there.........

Here's an idea for Dr. Lee....................have a two-pronged dispenser with the minoxidil on one side and and an alpha-five inhibitor on the other. But that would get people to thinkin' ........."why dont I just go to Wal Mart, buy a ton of minoxidil and then....................... : )

 

[Bryan]

Bryan,

Maybe Lee is having a hard time finding either a alpha-five inhibitor or a recetor blocker he can mix with finasteride and not have them react together so they can both be used in the same product.

You just reminded me of something else that Dr. Lee once said that made me hit the ceiling at the time! Somebody had asked him what his opinion of Revivogen was, and he replied that "there's not much evidence" for the use of those fatty acids it contains! :freaked2: :freaked2: :freaked2: I thought to myself, WTF???? Does he actually have the UNMITIGATED GALL to say that, when there's a LOT more evidence supporting the use of fatty acids like GLA, ALA, and LA, compared to the almost non-existing evidence (not to mention the negative evidence) for azelaic acid?? I threw up my hands in total disgust that he would either stoop that low, or be so ignorant of the facts.

Bryan

 

[Old Baldy]

Bryan: You posted alot of good reasons for having doubts about Doctor Lee. Yet, I just can't bring myself to think badly of him!?

I guess I must be in denial! :shock:

 

[techprof]

ob, I was in deep denial for a long time with regards to aa.
For the last 6 months I switched xandrox 5 with regular minoxidil and things have improved (after adding dutasteride and prox-N).

The fact that Dr. Lee is not successful in making 12.5% minoxidil yet (read his page) shows the importance of AA in making high concentration minoxidil solutions.
(Even other doctors or sites that sell high concentration minoxidil sell them only with AA).

 

[sonictemples]

Do you guys know any azelaic studies that prove its DHT blocking abilities? It's weird that I could only find only one study despite azelaic acid being the go to add-on for most minoxidils etc.

 

[sonictemples]

I am going to make the B E S T H A I R L O T I O N @Pigeon good that I could lure you in with interest. Can you help

 

[sonictemples]

I am gonna be the Azelaic Acid King

 

[sonictemples]

A Z E L A I C A C I D G A I N S

 

[sonictemples]

I don't know any studies except that it should be an AA like fina. And I read about a couple of people getting pfs from it, so be careful.

It's weird that every hair company uses it but no one did studies on it despite calling it proven