Best Alternative to internal DHT Blockers Available:

Blondilocks

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As someone who seems to be affected by every DHT blocker taken internally, im stumped:

Therefore can anyone suggest, the most scientifically backed, unbiased evidence based product that would be better than nothing:

Ive been on Nizroral for a year and regaine foam for a year: Help!
 

ClayShaw

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Blondilocks said:
As someone who seems to be affected by every DHT blocker taken internally, im stumped:

Therefore can anyone suggest, the most scientifically backed, unbiased evidence based product that would be better than nothing:

Ive been on Nizroral for a year and regaine foam for a year: Help!

They will all tell you that no such product exists, and they're probably right. Propecia... or a razor. Those are the choices we have.
 

decro435

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After trying countless treatments, I've come to the conclusion aswell that Finasteride is the only way to halt male pattern baldness.
 

ClayShaw

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I'm with you, Blondilocks. I'm not on propecia, and never will be. It's too bad, but I'm pretty sure that once you make that choice, you're destined to be bald.
 

Bryan

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I second the Proxiphen. Dr. Proctor says it's more effective than Propecia.
 

ClayShaw

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Nuli said:
RU 58841 or proxiphen.

RU is unavailable, as far as I know, unless you want to spend $300 a month to have a chemist cook it up for you. Correct me if I'm wrong.
Proxiphen is legit? Sounds like repackaged Rogaine.
Bryan, what makes you think Proxiphen is good? Have you used it?
Uhh... Proxiphen is $100 a month... Thats a lot of money.
 

decro435

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How can Proxiphen be better than Propecia?

It doesn't effect levels of DHT right? Isn't it just a more advanced Minoxidil formulation?
 

Bryan

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ClayShaw said:
Proxiphen is legit? Sounds like repackaged Rogaine.

Yes, it's legit. It has numerous active ingredients in it, besides minoxidil.

ClayShaw said:
Bryan, what makes you think Proxiphen is good? Have you used it?

Dr. Proctor's products (including Proxiphen to some extent, but mostly Prox-N) are the things I've used since I first got interested in this field around 1995.

ClayShaw said:
Uhh... Proxiphen is $100 a month... Thats a lot of money.

If money is a big issue, I suggest you stick with Prox-N.
 

Bryan

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decro435 said:
How can Proxiphen be better than Propecia?

It doesn't effect levels of DHT right? Isn't it just a more advanced Minoxidil formulation?

It doesn't inhibit 5a-reductase, but it does contain spironolactone (for what that's worth). It has numerous other growth stimulators, including those "turbocharged" SODs like TEMPO/TEMPOL and PBN. That's the really good stuff. Minoxidil is just a relatively minor ingredient.
 

Nuli

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I've been using proxiphen for about four weeks now. Been shedding pretty bad the last week or so, but i think its a good thing. I've noticed more little hairs on the hairline and my existing hair seems thicker. I'm also using the nano shampoo every two days.
 

ClayShaw

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Bryan said:
ClayShaw said:
Proxiphen is legit? Sounds like repackaged Rogaine.

Yes, it's legit. It has numerous active ingredients in it, besides minoxidil.

ClayShaw said:
Bryan, what makes you think Proxiphen is good? Have you used it?

Dr. Proctor's products (including Proxiphen to some extent, but mostly Prox-N) are the things I've used since I first got interested in this field around 1995.

ClayShaw said:
Uhh... Proxiphen is $100 a month... Thats a lot of money.

If money is a big issue, I suggest you stick with Prox-N.

Yeah, $60 for 2 months isn't that bad... Thats less than $400 a year...
Have you had good results with it? Is it a reasonable for maintaining? I saw the pics of the NW7 to pretty full head of hair... Obviously thats not possible, but does it work at all?
I'm not into internal meds if I can avoid it, but I saw that it says 8 or 10 drops a day on the thinning areas... That sounds like brushing your teeth: Easy. Is it greasy/smelly?
 

Axl_Rose

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Hmm, and where can one get a hold of this Proxiphen?
 

JWM

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Keep in mind that there is a difference between Proxiphen and Proxiphen-N.

There are no pictures on Dr. P's site of responders to Prox-N; there are only pics of responders to Proxiphen and Nano Shampoo.

Proxiphen is a prescription product and far more potent than Prox-N. It is also expensive.

HOWEVER, Prox-N is still a decent treatment, and if your thinning is mild, Prox-N coupled with Nano Shampoo, Nizoral shampoo, and maybe topical spironolactone, may be a decent topical assault plan to help you out. Call it a poor man's Proxiphen if you will.

FYI, go to LEF.org. Order Dr. Proctor's Advanced Regrowth Formula. It is the same thing as PRox-N, but a little "lighter" as Dr. P says, HOWEVER even Dr. P has admitted several times, that the cost makes it a much better value than buying it from him personally! Stand-up guy if you ask me.
 

Bryan

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ClayShaw said:
Have you had good results with it? Is it a reasonable for maintaining?

Yes. For _me_ at least, it was excellent at maintaining. I used to have a pair of before-and-after pictures on this site which documented my use of nothing but Prox-N and NANO shampoo (no finasteride, no minoxidil) for a period of almost exactly two years, to the day. You could tell in my photos that my hair was slightly improved after two full years of use of those products. While people have complained to me that there wasn't any really noticeable cosmetic change in my baldspot, I keep pointing out that even if you can't have lots of regrowth (even Dr. Proctor mentioned how "slick" my baldspot was, at the start of treatment), even maintenance of one's scalp with no further loss is a goal greatly to be desired.

ClayShaw said:
I saw the pics of the NW7 to pretty full head of hair... Obviously thats not possible, but does it work at all?

Are you talking about that one set of pics on Dr. Proctor's Web site which shows that nearly-bald guy who used Proxiphen for a few months, and had the dramatic regrowth? :) Yeah, those results are obviously not typical. That guy was a really excellent responder.

ClayShaw said:
I'm not into internal meds if I can avoid it, but I saw that it says 8 or 10 drops a day on the thinning areas... That sounds like brushing your teeth: Easy. Is it greasy/smelly?

Prox-N certainly isn't greasy or smelly (unless he's changed it recently and I don't know about it). It's a clear liquid with a slight medicinal odor (probably from the alcohol content) that dissipates fast and dries pretty quickly. It's nowhere nearly as messy and greasy as (for example) Rogaine.
 

pproctor

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To answer some questions. In 1984, we started some patients on topical minoxidil. People that did not respond got treated with various additional agents until they started responding. In the pharmaceutical development trade, we call this a cross-over trial and it is how drugs got developed until about the early 1950's. You keep trying until something works. All based on the science, naturally.

Thus, anything that gives a clinical response in persons who had not responded to previous treatment is automatically an improvement. So we were able to do better than plain minoxidil quite quickly.

A number of promising classes of agents emerged. These included the copper-peptide superoxide dismutases. These destroy superoxide radical, which destroy nitric oxide (NO), which seems to be the natural compound that miNOxidil mimics. Also emerging were topical arginine, the percurser for NO, as well as pyridine-N-Oxides such as NANO, and spin traps and spin labels such as PBN and TEMPOL. Even hydroxyl radical scavengers such as acetylcysteine seem to help.

Naturally, we patented all of this in a series of nine US patents. We also added topical spironolactone, which seems to help. BTW, a lot of stuff you are always hearing about we invented.

So from the very first, we have been able to do better than (say) minoxidil alone.

The essence of treatment of hair loss seems to be to use several different agents that work in somewhat different ways. This way, we get additive and likely even synergistic effects.

BTW, more recently, our we have come to recognize that SOD-mimetic nitrones and nitroxides such as TEMPOL and DMPO work better than copper-peptide SODs. TEMPOL is even in clinical trials for radiation-induced hair loss.

So, while 25 years ago, it was arguable that our formulations were an advanced form of minoxidl, we have come considerably beyond that now. In essence, if it works, we tend to use it.

BTW, we work at such a basic level of how tissue go bad that my most recent work has been in the area of stroke and neuroprotection. See:

http://stroke.ahajournals.org/cgi/conte ... type=HWCIT

Interestingly, becaue everything works at a very basic level of pathogenesis, neuroprotective treatments tend to also to be useful in the treatment of pattern loss. E.g., the same light helmet reported to help with pattern loss is also reliably reported to be effective in stroke.

Peter H. Proctor, PhD,MD
 

JWM

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It's a clear liquid with a slight medicinal odor (probably from the alcohol content)

Bryan, I'm fairly sure Prox-N doesn't contain alcohol--at least not anymore.
 

Bryan

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JWM said:
Bryan, I'm fairly sure Prox-N doesn't contain alcohol--at least not anymore.

You may be right about that! I have an old bottle of Prox-N here, and the "Ingredients" list includes (among numerous other things): SD alcohol 40-B. But a newer bottle makes no mention of alcohol at all! Maybe Dr. P can verify that he removed the alcohol from Prox-N, and tell us why he did that.
 

beaner

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Bryan said:
ClayShaw said:
Have you had good results with it? Is it a reasonable for maintaining?

Yes. For _me_ at least, it was excellent at maintaining.....


You really mean it was good at giving an offset of growth, right Bryan?

Surely Proxiphen N doesn't maintain..... :) :) :)
 
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