Difference between Fluridil, flutamide and flutagel???

[Bryan]

If it works off a systemic mechanism, then why even go to the trouble of applying it at all to your scalp? Why not just swallow some of it?

Peace of mind? Not wanting to swallow amounts of alcohol and ppg/w.e other sh*t they put in there?

Why not just rub it on your abdomen or chest, then, instead of on your scalp? It's really messy to put topicals onto your scalp, especially if they're not even having any "local" effect there!

Besides, I'd rather have the flutamide have to pass through the hair follicles to get into the system, rather than have to digest it internally.

Based on the general observations in animals that topical flutamide doesn't have any apparent local effect at all, I don't even see any particular reason to attempt to have it "pass through" the follicles. There just seems to be no particular benefit or purpose at all to apply it to the scalp.

 

[$tackz]

Based on the general observations in animals that topical flutamide doesn't have any apparent local effect at all, I don't even see any particular reason to attempt to have it "pass through" the follicles. There just seems to be no particular benefit or purpose at all to apply it to the scalp.

Sure there doesn't seem to be... but then again I think the study you're referring to tests "hamster flank organs". And there is the minute possibility that the mechanism works differently on human skin.

And studies frequently don't correlate to real-life success, sorry to say. Didn't they say spironolactone is a stronger anti-androgen than Flut, with a way stronger LOCAL effect? We all know how that one went. :jackit:

 

[Bryan]

RU58841 has a very shorty life of 1 hour and breaks dow in plasma.

Reference or citation, please, for the "1 hour" claim. I've read the study having to do with RU58841 breakdown products, but I don't recall their stating any such figure having to do with RU life (or half-life) in the blood, or anywhere else.

Another thing you haven't made clear is if you're referring to the "life" of RU in the BLOOD, or on the SCALP.

 

[el_duterino]

RU58841 has a very shorty life of 1 hour and breaks dow in plasma.

Reference or citation, please, for the "1 hour" claim. I've read the study having to do with RU58841 breakdown products, but I don't recall their stating any such figure having to do with RU life (or half-life) in the blood, or anywhere else.

Another thing you haven't made clear is if you're referring to the "life" of RU in the BLOOD, or on the SCALP.

"life" is a typo, I was meant to write half-life, and yes, obviously in plasma where it is elimitated.

reference:
http://www.sciencedirect.com/science?_o ... 091735a924


The non-steroidal antiandrogens, RU 58841 and RU 56187 are amongst the most active of a new series of N-substituted aryl hydantoins or thiohydantoins. Their pharmacokinetics and principal metabolic profiles have been evaluated in rat plasma after intravenous administration of a 10 mg/kg dose. Both compounds disappear relatively rapidly from the plasma (elimination half-life of the order of 1 h), but they form a common metabolite, the N-desalkyl derivative, RU 56279, which is eliminated much more slowly.
....The results showed that: (1) the common metabolite, RU 56279, is clearly antiandrogenic; ...
>>>
So this proves what I have been experiencing..low side effects but not zero side effects. Perhaps that's why RU58841 was not commericially develepped as a hair-loss product.
Since the product was not tested in humans, it is diffcult to evaluate side effects on a large scale but I read some other posts on the other forums of people who had some sides after using RU58841.

 

[Bryan]

Sure there doesn't seem to be... but then again I think the study you're referring to tests "hamster flank organs". And there is the minute possibility that the mechanism works differently on human skin.

The studies I'm referring to (there are at least TWO of them) used more than just one kind of rodent. Besides hamsters, rats and mice have also been tested. The results were consistent in all three species of rodent.

I acknowledge your point about the uncertainty of whether or not topical flutamide works exactly the same way in human skin as it does in rodent skin, but nevertheless I feel we should err on the side of caution here. Flutamide is a potentially VERY hazardous drug, and if it works topically on rodents in an entirely systemic way, it's not a good idea to just assume, "Well, let's go ahead and use it ourselves topically anyway, maybe it works differently in humans!" :woot:

And studies frequently don't correlate to real-life success, sorry to say. Didn't they say spironolactone is a stronger anti-androgen than Flut, with a way stronger LOCAL effect? We all know how that one went. :jackit:

There are no in vivo studies which ever claimed a stronger effect from spironolactone than from flutamide. However, topical spironolactone does have a much more pronounced "local" effect than topical flutamide.

 

[Bryan]

reference:
http://www.sciencedirect.com/science?_o ... 091735a924

"Both compounds disappear relatively rapidly from the plasma (elimination half-life of the order of 1 h)..."

Ok, thanks. I'd forgotten that 1-hour figure. You saved me having to dig that study out of my Study Stack again!

 

[TKN]

Hey, El Duterino, as mentioned before, my scalp has been covered with very fine hairs, hardly noticeable at a distant. I was just wondering if I applied fluridil, will these thicken? I also have some 'ingrowing hair' looking fine hairs on my temple too if you know what i mean. Like little dots under the skin. I thought you might be able to shed some light on this and my questions about thickening of already present fine hairs. Ive just ordered some fluridil. I tried taking pictures but I cant get some clear close ups like yours.

Thanks

 

[el_duterino]

Regarding fluridil, based on my personal experience it did not thicken exisiting hair when used with dutasteride.
But it did completely halt hair shedding/loss.
My sense is that reducing the number of Androgen receptors controls the way hair will grow or shed in terms of cycles.

For existing hair thickness I found that topical Flutamide or RU gave better results.

 

[2guard]

el,
where are you getting your RU? i'm thinking of adding an anti-androgen again, i used spironolactone in the past but i don't think it did anything. i'm a diffuse thinner and would like some extra regrowth. i've been maintaining with proscar for about 5 years now.