Does Micro Needling Actually Help? Need Your Help

[Oribv1324]

First of all hey there! I'm not quite sure as to where to post this question so forgive me if it's the wrong place
I'm a 22 y/o dude with moderate to massive thinin. I used finasteride from 18-20. After two years started to notice sexual sides and decided to stop using it. At the moment I'm wondering if I should jump on microneedling as it shows much promise. Id like to try using it without minoxidil and maybe with (I'd rather use as less meds as possible) should I go for it? Is it any good? Will I be getting results with it alone?

 

[Dhldan]

First of all hey there! I'm not quite sure as to where to post this question so forgive me if it's the wrong place
I'm a 22 y/o dude with moderate to massive thinin. I used finasteride from 18-20. After two years started to notice sexual sides and decided to stop using it. At the moment I'm wondering if I should jump on microneedling as it shows much promise. Id like to try using it without minoxidil and maybe with (I'd rather use as less meds as possible) should I go for it? Is it any good? Will I be getting results with it alone?

It does for some, a lot of users actually reported that it worked for them. For me however, 9 months of dermarolling weekly on hairline & temples only (recently switched to biweekly) 1.5mm drawing blood hasn’t helped. In fact my hair line has gotten much worse. I’m sure this would’ve happened even without dermarolling & I doubt it did me any harm. I’d just use minoxidil first and dermaroll with minoxidil if results aren’t enough. I don’t think you’ll get results with derma alone since you also started balding at a younger age.

Of course you’ll need to incorporate an anti androgen to stop further hair loss long term. I recommend a lower dose of finasteride or CB.

 

[Oribv1324]

It does for some, a lot of users actually reported that it worked for them. For me however, 9 months of dermarolling weekly on hairline & temples only (recently switched to biweekly) 1.5mm drawing blood hasn’t helped. In fact my hair line has gotten much worse. I’m sure this would’ve happened even without dermarolling & I doubt it did me any harm. I’d just use minoxidil first and dermaroll with minoxidil if results aren’t enough. I don’t think you’ll get results with derma alone since you also started balding at a younger age.

Of course you’ll need to incorporate an anti androgen to stop further hair loss long term. I recommend a lower dose of finasteride or CB.

But they give me sides like hell so that's our of the question. So if I'll dermaroll is it useless without an anti androgen?

 

[Chromeo]

But they give me sides like hell so that's our of the question. So if I'll dermaroll is it useless without an anti androgen?

Hello there. No, I wouldn't say it's useless without an anti-androgen; many of those currently needling are not using an anti-androgen at all.

I suggest you head over to the photographic results thread and have a look at some of the progress needlers have been making, and judge from there whether or not it's for you.

https://www.hairlosstalk.com/interact/threads/microneedling-photo-results-summary.121072/

 

[coolio]

Dermarolling = mild surface wounding

Mild surface wounding = slight hair gains for most guys.

The science has said this for decades. It's true for needling and it's true for dermabrasion. It never does a lot, but it normally does have a positive impact.

How much can needling do as a cumulative long-term effort? IMO that remains to be seen. AFAIK it has never been tested to the extent that is going on now. Science has more experience/observation history with abrasion wounds, but that is much more traumatic & less repeatable than well-done needling.

 

[Redgate]

The few studies about it show that it works.
Though you should probably try to lower your finasteride dose first and see if sides go away. There is a merck-sponsored study that says 0.2mg finasteride can be just as effective as 1mg in reducing scalp (not serum) DHT which could solve your problems.
But regardless, go for it.

 

[RobertBBrown]

Many have been experiencing good results with dermarolling but like most other things it depends on your individual reaction so the best way to find out is to try it yourself...

 

[baldman329]

First of all hey there! I'm not quite sure as to where to post this question so forgive me if it's the wrong place
I'm a 22 y/o dude with moderate to massive thinin. I used finasteride from 18-20. After two years started to notice sexual sides and decided to stop using it. At the moment I'm wondering if I should jump on microneedling as it shows much promise. Id like to try using it without minoxidil and maybe with (I'd rather use as less meds as possible) should I go for it? Is it any good? Will I be getting results with it alone?

I have experienced regrowth with microneedling+monoxidil. I am unsure if microneedling works by itself but I was non-responder to minoxidil before. Now I am seeing hairs grow on my temples. Although, stillstill weak and thin, If it grows out, I would recover much of my hairline. I think I'm around NW4/NW5

 

[Oribv1324]

I have experienced regrowth with microneedling+monoxidil. I am unsure if microneedling works by itself but I was non-responder to minoxidil before. Now I am seeing hairs grow on my temples. Although, stillstill weak and thin, If it grows out, I would recover much of my hairline. I think I'm around NW4/NW5

the thing is, is it sustainable?

The few studies about it show that it works.
Though you should probably try to lower your finasteride dose first and see if sides go away. There is a merck-sponsored study that says 0.2mg finasteride can be just as effective as 1mg in reducing scalp (not serum) DHT which could solve your problems.
But regardless, go for it.

actually im still having some sides so im really scared of propecia and from reading on forums ive heard that lowering the dosage doesnt prevent sides.. so actually the real question is does micro needling combined with minoxidil enough to at least fight the baldness for 4 or 5 years? im like 23 and its too young for me.

Hello there. No, I wouldn't say it's useless without an anti-androgen; many of those currently needling are not using an anti-androgen at all.

I suggest you head over to the photographic results thread and have a look at some of the progress needlers have been making, and judge from there whether or not it's for you.

https://www.hairlosstalk.com/interact/threads/microneedling-photo-results-summary.121072/

these are amazing results and part of the reason for my post. the thing is that i dont want to use propecia and i wonder how a non anti androgen treatment will fend against dht . and what's the future of these new grown hairs from the needling..

thanks alot guys !!!

 

[Dhldan]

the thing is, is it sustainable?


actually im still having some sides so im really scared of propecia and from reading on forums ive heard that lowering the dosage doesnt prevent sides.. so actually the real question is does micro needling combined with minoxidil enough to at least fight the baldness for 4 or 5 years? im like 23 and its too young for me.


these are amazing results and part of the reason for my post. the thing is that i dont want to use propecia and i wonder how a non anti androgen treatment will fend against dht . and what's the future of these new grown hairs from the needling..

thanks alot guys !!!

Most cases minoxidil only works for 2 ish years. So at best I’d say 4, but it’s also unlikely if you stretch minoxidil out tht much and expect to maintain/regrow with it alone over a period of time.

Don’t know what to tell ya if finasteride gives you sides. I guess CB would work for you since it’s an anti androgen and a lot of ppl report they don’t get aides from it. Minoxidil will just disguise your hair loss like make up, it won’t stop it from progressing.

Maybe try-
Derma rolling with minoxidil

CB, if you’re willing to pay for it, pretty sure it’s expensive)

Ketoconzale shampoo 2%

Saw Palmetto (weak finasteride according to studies)

I would also say LLLT, but it didn’t work at all for me. Could for you, idk.


Good luck!!

 

[RobertBBrown]

With your experiences with Finasteride it's understandable that you don't want to jump the med train but finasteride is pretty tough when it comes to sides (according to the Doctor that did my FUT it's 3 out of 100 that suffer from sides).
Minoxidil when applied (and not taken orally) has a lot less sides as it only is dry skin, red skin, itching etc. which you can counter.

Back to your initial question, don't expect wonders when using a dermaroller only and, like Dhalan said, use it with Minoxidil and a good DHT Blocker shampoo (Hair Surge or Hair Restoration Labs DHT Blocker shampoo are my personal choices) is a solid setup to hold your hairline.

If your balding still gets more aggressive you will sooner or later need to get a hair transplantation as a final step (looking at the family history) but with the above setup (derma roll, minoxidil and shampoo) you're fighting it in a good way without the tough drugs.

 

[RobertBBrown]

These DHT blocking shampoos good?

The mentioned ones are the ones I use myself and I really like them. I personally use the Hair Surge because it has a good load of Caffeine and the Hair Restoration Labs one because it has tons of active DHT Blocker ingredients. They are like $30 but they last 2-3 months for me. Good scent and I hair feels good. Only bad thing is that you need to leave it in your hair for 3-5 minutes so your scalp will absorb the active ingredients and until washing out and I get bored under the shower a little bit

You shouldn't experience any other side and it feels like a regular shampoo so give it a try.

Here's a review in case you want to read more about it.

 

[RobertBBrown]

I use them for like 2 years now. Never used finasteride and recently went to my doctor who did my hair transplant 2 years ago for final checkup and asked him about it and he discouraged me using finasteride as my I had almost no more hair loss for the past 2 years in the areas behind my hair transplant (was not that many grafts) and he said that fina sides are pretty common and he would only say to use it if hair loss progresses when using minoxidil and dht blocker shampoo.
Really surprisingly for me as I had bad hair loss in my mid 20s and did the FUT at age 30. But I didn't use any minoxidil and dht blocker before age 30 because I prepared myself to get the hair transplantation done anyway sooner or later.
Now I use minoxidil and dht blocker shampoo and it seems to hold. the doctor also said that I can think about getting a 2nd FUE to make the hairline really thick rather than waiting to make a 2nd to fill up more thinning areas behind my hair line.

I'm sure if I would have used minoxidil and DHT shampoo in my early 20s I could have been holding the hairline a lot longer but here also genetics come into the game.

I'd recommend you to use the shampoo and the minoxidil and see where the hairline is in 6-12 months. There are also new treatments like stem cell activation are coming lately. You should also consider seing a doctor instead of self-medication, especially with finasteride and other medicals.

TL;DR only consider taking meds when the over-the-counter solutions are not enough

 

[Oribv1324]

With your experiences with Finasteride it's understandable that you don't want to jump the med train but finasteride is pretty tough when it comes to sides (according to the Doctor that did my FUT it's 3 out of 100 that suffer from sides).
Minoxidil when applied (and not taken orally) has a lot less sides as it only is dry skin, red skin, itching etc. which you can counter.

Back to your initial question, don't expect wonders when using a dermaroller only and, like Dhalan said, use it with Minoxidil and a good DHT Blocker shampoo (Hair Surge or Hair Restoration Labs DHT Blocker shampoo are my personal choices) is a solid setup to hold your hairline.

If your balding still gets more aggressive you will sooner or later need to get a hair transplantation as a final step (looking at the family history) but with the above setup (derma roll, minoxidil and shampoo) you're fighting it in a good way without the tough drugs.

Thanks for the informative and kind answer!
I'm doing prp on Monday so I guess I'll try waiting Month or two to see any improvement. In the meanwhile I will order the dermapen and minoxidil. Regarding the shampoos, I have never heard about them and my main concern is systemic absorption. Does it happen?? If not how come aren't these shampoos more popular around here? I'm still dealing with weak erections from Fina (or from a breakup with gf after 2 years and the thought of my unattractive bald single head haha) so I'm at a thought spot. Thanks alot! Also isn't caffeine harmful for hair loss?

 

[RobertBBrown]

my main concern is systemic absorption

Most of the active ingredients are from natural oils and saw palmetto so don't be concerned, it's boyscout stuff compared to what you took with Finasteride, mildly spoken. It is only absorbed in the scalp anyway.

Also caffeine is the opposite from harmful as it will stimulate hair growth and extends the life of your hair -> means more hair on your head (you always lose hair every day, every human does so there's always a cycle between hair at the end of their life cycle falling out and regrowing, which takes time. If your hair has longer life cycle your will have more hair on your head... very basically)

It's a good combination and I never heard from anyone having any sides from it.

But don't expect wonders, this only will SLOW DOWN balding (or eventually freeze it), you won't regain that much hair with it.

One curious question, how come you started taking finasteride? Did you see a doctor? In my country it's only available on prescription and I highly doubt that a doctor will give this to a 18-20 year old looking at the sides. Finasteride is, like Pigeon mentioned, one of the last resorts due to the heavy sides and the high percentage of people experiencing sides.

 

[Oribv1324]

Most of the active ingredients are from natural oils and saw palmetto so don't be concerned, it's boyscout stuff compared to what you took with Finasteride, mildly spoken. It is only absorbed in the scalp anyway.

Also caffeine is the opposite from harmful as it will stimulate hair growth and extends the life of your hair -> means more hair on your head (you always lose hair every day, every human does so there's always a cycle between hair at the end of their life cycle falling out and regrowing, which takes time. If your hair has longer life cycle your will have more hair on your head... very basically)

It's a good combination and I never heard from anyone having any sides from it.

But don't expect wonders, this only will SLOW DOWN balding (or eventually freeze it), you won't regain that much hair with it.

One curious question, how come you started taking finasteride? Did you see a doctor? In my country it's only available on prescription and I highly doubt that a doctor will give this to a 18-20 year old looking at the sides. Finasteride is, like Pigeon mentioned, one of the last resorts due to the heavy sides and the high percentage of people experiencing sides.

Tbh my dad's a doctor and I also have a dermatologist sister, so prescription wise it was easy. Did they support it? Yes. Were they scared of its possible outcome? Yes. Unfortunately my self confidence revolves around my hair so I'll do anything I can in order to at least slow it down until I'll be a little bit older . The thing that scares me the most about these shampoos and specifically the one you mentioned is that it has no negative reviews what so ever on its Amazon page. Nobody talks about it as a possible solution for former Fina users and it has no traction in the hair loss community.. Now I know that you are probably trying to help but according to my knowledge the scientific community has yet to find an anti androgen topical that doesn't enter the system. What do u think ?

 

[RobertBBrown]

So you're concerned using a shampoo that has no negative ratings that won't enter your system but you took a med that needs a prescription where you can find hundreds of negative opinions in seconds using google? (no offense)
Maybe the problem is that people start thinking using the strongest will help most and (self-)prescribe them such a rough med, I honestly don't know.
Actually it's good that you've become super-suspicious what things you will use next after the negative experience you've had.

I'd say you just go to the homepage of the manufacturers and take the list of ingredients and you can look them up one by one, almost all of them are linked to clinical studies.

I can only speak for myself and the people I know using it and it's a good shampoo and I had more sides from the $4 wholestore shampoos from the big brands (silicones, dry skin etc.) than from the ones I mentioned above.

You're at the beginning of your personal journey to find the things that work for you and you will need to gather a lot of information out there and the bald truth is that androgenic alopecia can only be slowed down or frozen. Sooner or later you will need to get a hair transplantation when you're really self-conscious about your hair. I also have friends that fought that battle for years and gave up, just shaved hairs off and are happy with their look now instead of self-hating each morning in front of the mirror

 

[Oribv1324]

So you're concerned using a shampoo that has no negative ratings that won't enter your system but you took a med that needs a prescription where you can find hundreds of negative opinions in seconds using google? (no offense)
Maybe the problem is that people start thinking using the strongest will help most and (self-)prescribe them such a rough med, I honestly don't know.
Actually it's good that you've become super-suspicious what things you will use next after the negative experience you've had.

I'd say you just go to the homepage of the manufacturers and take the list of ingredients and you can look them up one by one, almost all of them are linked to clinical studies.

I can only speak for myself and the people I know using it and it's a good shampoo and I had more sides from the $4 wholestore shampoos from the big brands (silicones, dry skin etc.) than from the ones I mentioned above.

You're at the beginning of your personal journey to find the things that work for you and you will need to gather a lot of information out there and the bald truth is that androgenic alopecia can only be slowed down or frozen. Sooner or later you will need to get a hair transplantation when you're really self-conscious about your hair. I also have friends that fought that battle for years and gave up, just shaved hairs off and are happy with their look now instead of self-hating each morning in front of the mirror

Well you know how it is, once you make a mistake you become more suspicious of everything. And yea I guess I'll order that shampoo. Balding is indeed an unwinnable battle and yet at my age it is unacceptable to lose to it.i just wish I could've have testimonials from this forum about this shampoo..nonetheless thanks alot for the assistance.. I hope the saw palmetto won't be absorbed haha

 

[RobertBBrown]

I hope the saw palmetto won't be absorbed haha

As long as you don't eat the shampoo you'll be fine

 

[Jakejr]

Yes
Micronneedling is something you can do at home to stimulate growth factors to follicles.
It’s the best we have so far. Don’t worry any wounds heal very fast.
Substitute for Finasteride are many. It’s trial & error to see which ones you like.
Magnesium L-Threonate is DHT inhibitor
Scutellaria Baicalensis Androgen receptor inhibitor
FIXE is a combination supplement which lowers DHT has Soy Isoflavones , Flax, Saw Palmetto Biotin.
There are host of topicals.
It seems there is not a single bullet, but a multi-layered regimen is current best strategy.