Even with finasteride, 15% still go bald!

[Loolapalooza]

I was googling finasteride and I was surprised when I found that about 15% of the users still continue to see hair loss (eventually going bald) in long term treatment.

This means that even finasteride is not a guarantee you will not go bald.

In this cases, anybody with a scientific explanation for this men continuing going bald? I mean if finasteride erases most DHT from the scalp, what is the cause of their baldness?

This could mean that DHT may not be the only responsible for male pattern baldness, right?

So .. Anybody here belonging to this 15% group?

Anybody here with an explanation?

Cheers

 

[hairrific]

15% sounds like very good odds.

Science still has know idea the what the cure is for hair loss.

Some talk is that just simply doing an off label dosage increase of finasteride or perhaps dutasteride might change those odds. A study showed dosages way above 30mg finasteride were safe.

Some other talk is that even with finasteride some of the unlucky few might have hair follicles that become sensitive enough to Testosterone to cause hair loss, and again what the other causes is its anybody's guess.

The premise of the above is eunuchs and pseudohermaphrodites don't bald, being low testosterone and the later has no 5ar type II enzyme, to which inspired the development of finasteride by Merck.

So if I was still going bald I would try jumping on dutasteride or upping finasteride or/and trying an topical that would kill the T in the scalp like RU.

After that, an hair transplant.

After that I would castration (transgender) No actually I would hope for some new treatment in the near future.

Now what about re-growing hair lost to DHT damage? the odds are bad, so don't lose it in the first place.

 

[HT55]

A study showed dosages way above 30mg finasteride were safe.

Could you post a link to that study ?


Some guys can't handle 1mg of finasteride, I can't imagine someone using 30mg/day

 

[Bryan]

A study showed dosages way above 30mg finasteride were safe.

Could you post a link to that study ?

I don't have a link to it, but it's cited in the PDR (Physician's Desk Reference) in the section on Proscar. In early testing of finasteride, they gave as much as 80 mg/day of the drug to human volunteers for several months. They had no problems at that dosage. In other experiments, as much as 400 mg of finasteride was given to humans in a single dose, again with no problems. In early testing of the drug in stumptailed macaques, the usual dose of finasteride that was given to the animals was 1 mg/kg/day, and it went on for well over a year; and again, there were apparently no ill effects in the monkeys. Since I personally weigh about 100 kg, that would be the same as if I took 100 mg every day for an extended amount of time.

Some guys can't handle 1mg of finasteride, I can't imagine someone using 30mg/day

Because of the relatively "flat" dose-response curve of finasteride, anybody who has a problem with 30 mg/day of finasteride would most likely have a similar problem with 1 mg/day. In other words, the specific dose that you use (within reason) probably doesn't have much to do with it.

 

[timbo]

I mean if finasteride erases most DHT from the scalp, what is the cause of their baldness?

This is incorrect. Finasteride only lowers serum DHT levels by 60-80%, and only lowers scalp DHT by 38%.

So 62% of the body's original DHT is still having negative effects on follicles.

 

[Mr Clean]

I'm definitely in the 15%. Finasteride didn't do squat for me. Actually, it was kind of weird. Right at the 3 month mark, my hair loss came to a grinding halt as was expected because of the hair cycle, but 3 to 4 weeks later, it went right back to what it was before I started taking Finasteride and continued shedding ever since. This was years ago, I've been on finasteride for God knows how many years now. I do think it has slowed down my hairloss (not sure), but definitely did NOT stop it.

 

[HT55]

A study showed dosages way above 30mg finasteride were safe.

Could you post a link to that study ?

I don't have a link to it, but it's cited in the PDR (Physician's Desk Reference) in the section on Proscar. In early testing of finasteride, they gave as much as 80 mg/day of the drug to human volunteers for several months. They had no problems at that dosage. In other experiments, as much as 400 mg of finasteride was given to humans in a single dose, again with no problems. In early testing of the drug in stumptailed macaques, the usual dose of finasteride that was given to the animals was 1 mg/kg/day, and it went on for well over a year; and again, there were apparently no ill effects in the monkeys. Since I personally weigh about 100 kg, that would be the same as if I took 100 mg every day for an extended amount of time.

Some guys can't handle 1mg of finasteride, I can't imagine someone using 30mg/day

Because of the relatively "flat" dose-response curve of finasteride, anybody who has a problem with 30 mg/day of finasteride would most likely have a similar problem with 1 mg/day. In other words, the specific dose that you use (within reason) probably doesn't have much to do with it.

BS !! I have been on 1 - 1.25 mg of finasteride for 12 years with no sides. My Dr wanted me on testosterone and I started to lose hair so I upped the dose to 5mg day.

ZERO improvement on the hair falling out but TREMENDOUS SIDES !

I can have sex 4-5 times a day on 1.25 mg, had trouble getting it up at all on 5mg !

 

[hairrific]

I'm definitely in the 15%. Finasteride didn't do squat for me. Actually, it was kind of weird. Right at the 3 month mark, my hair loss came to a grinding halt as was expected because of the hair cycle, but 3 to 4 weeks later, it went right back to what it was before I started taking Finasteride and continued shedding ever since. This was years ago, I've been on finasteride for God knows how many years now. I do think it has slowed down my hairloss (not sure), but definitely did NOT stop it.

SWITCH.... Dutasteride was shown to be more effective and showed less variation in inhibition of the different genotypes of 5-alpha reductase type II than finasteride. In a few genotypes, finasteride showed better inhibition than dutasteride, indicating that genotyping of patients would be beneficial when choosing treatment. This also provides a possible answer as to why some people who treat their hair loss with finasteride see a lot of improvement when they switch to dutasteride, and why a few instead notice a worsening of their condition. It may very well be due to some genotypes responding better to one drug than the other.

http://www.hairlosshelp.com/forums/mess ... SGDBTABLE=

 

[Bryan]

BS !! I have been on 1 - 1.25 mg of finasteride for 12 years with no sides. My Dr wanted me on testosterone and I started to lose hair so I upped the dose to 5mg day.

ZERO improvement on the hair falling out but TREMENDOUS SIDES !

I can have sex 4-5 times a day on 1.25 mg, had trouble getting it up at all on 5mg !

Did you seriously consider the possibility that that's just "all in your head"? That you were so nervous at the idea of quadrupling your dose, you made yourself unable to perform? :dunno:

To get to the bottom of this, submit yourself immediately for medical experimentation!

 

[HT55]

BS !! I have been on 1 - 1.25 mg of finasteride for 12 years with no sides. My Dr wanted me on testosterone and I started to lose hair so I upped the dose to 5mg day.

ZERO improvement on the hair falling out but TREMENDOUS SIDES !

I can have sex 4-5 times a day on 1.25 mg, had trouble getting it up at all on 5mg !

Did you seriously consider the possibility that that's just "all in your head"? That you were so nervous at the idea of quadrupling your dose, you made yourself unable to perform? :dunno:

To get to the bottom of this, submit yourself immediately for medical experimentation!

Did you ever consider that you are not always right ?

I never gave 2 thoughts to upping the dosage and then bang, NOTHING. stayed on 5 mg for a month. Went back to 1.25 mg and things slowly improved over 2 months.

In my head, yea right

You are afraid to even take Propecia so you have BALLS telling ANYONE who says they have sides it's all in their head !!

Stick your PDR up your *** !

 

[Bryan]

LOL! "Methinks thou doth protest too much." After seeing you fly off the handle like that, I think it's more and more likely that it _is_ all in your head!

 

[azyx]

its not all in the head! eveybody is so so different... somebody have many many many sex experiences with many many many partners and know better how the "tool" must works!

 

[hairrific]

its not all in the head! eveybody is so so different... somebody have many many many sex experiences with many many many partners and know better how the "tool" must work!

Everybody is so different is right!

Not to open a new can of worms but you would not believe how many young males just can not get it up and perform, where for some, well into old age, it is as easy as smiling for a photo.

What this tells me is that finasteride might easily trigger sexual sides in those with an preexisting predisposition for sides.

 

[azyx]

I believe that nobody must take finasteride without having sex experiences.... if i take finasteride at my young age and trying to have sex for 1st time i will have many many troubles to make it works...

 

[SmileBam]

They say that science is very advanced this days.WTF? If u can find a cure,a clear solution for hair loss,which is maybe the most common fear of men in periods of history,u can't call it advanced science.Is not.Finasteride is only something that stops this...and not even a long time.Well,just hope most of us wi'll have succes with currents trataments(?) and hope that in the near future a miracle will happen...

 

[Bryan]

Everybody is so different is right!

Not to open a new can of worms but you would not believe how many young males just can not get it up and perform, where for some, well into old age, it is as easy as smiling for a photo.

What this tells me is that finasteride might easily trigger sexual sides in those with an preexisting predisposition for sides.

For what it's worth, please note that I wasn't challenging the simple claim that finasteride can cause sexual side effects. I was challenging a more specific claim made by HT55. Go back and re-read what he said, and my response.

 

[JWM]

I've taken as much as 5 mg of finasteride a day. For what it's worth, my pants still got tight if a waitress smiled at me while pouring my coffee.

 

[eXVee]

I'm with Bryan on this. Anecdotes aren't evidence. That's why we need science in the first place. C'mon people, it's the 21st century...act accordingly to it.

 

[HT55]

I have been around this forum, Hair loss talk, Hair transplant network, etc for a long time.

I have seen SO MANY guys who have side effects on 1mg/day but they are able to use .25 or .50 mg/day with few issues but according to you there is no way me upping my dose 400% could cause any problems.

I know you have a study that says that it can't possibly happen. I can show you a study that says only 2% get sides on finasteride and the sides are always reversable when you discontinue the drug. So much for studies.

 

[HT55]

LOL! "Methinks thou doth protest too much." After seeing you fly off the handle like that, I think it's more and more likely that it _is_ all in your head!

I'm just sick of the way you strut around here thinking you know everything because you have links to this study and that study.


Now you know how my body responds to finasteride, AMAZING !!!!


A guy who has this written in his signature tells me I fly off the handle, lol

1) No, damnit, finasteride for hairloss was NOT an "accidental discovery


DAMNIT, lol


As I said before, you claim 30mg is safe but you have admited in the past you are afraid to even try 1mg. Kind of strange if you ask me.