finasteride and gynecomasty
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xxenergyxx
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@ fat elvis: read again this: http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/2132 ... t=Abstract
and this: http://www.psms.org/sporeprints/sp338.html
about the second link: "it is not a good idea to eat any mushroom raw..."
"...researchers have shown that even Agaricus bisporus, the “store bought†mushroom, contains agaritine which metabolizes into a hydrazine."
"Many hydrazines are known to be strong carcinogens and can be found in a lot of edible mushrooms. Cooking destroys some or all of the hydrazines, but the steam given off during cooking has been known to make some cooks ill"
"Cooking does not destroy chitin but may ease its effect"
"The spring verpas, morels, and brainlike mushrooms (Gyromitra) are notorious for their toxicity in the raw state and, for some people, in the cooked state"
"The best rule to follow is cook all mushrooms thoroughly before eating and eat them in moderation."
and this: http://www.psms.org/sporeprints/sp338.html
about the second link: "it is not a good idea to eat any mushroom raw..."
"...researchers have shown that even Agaricus bisporus, the “store bought†mushroom, contains agaritine which metabolizes into a hydrazine."
"Many hydrazines are known to be strong carcinogens and can be found in a lot of edible mushrooms. Cooking destroys some or all of the hydrazines, but the steam given off during cooking has been known to make some cooks ill"
"Cooking does not destroy chitin but may ease its effect"
"The spring verpas, morels, and brainlike mushrooms (Gyromitra) are notorious for their toxicity in the raw state and, for some people, in the cooked state"
"The best rule to follow is cook all mushrooms thoroughly before eating and eat them in moderation."
So it's basically it's hair vs. manboobs vs cancer. awesome.
Are there any other 'natural'/herbal ways to moderate your estrogen levels? I mean, they say that decreasing your estrogen can lead to a number of bad effects because estrogen plays certain positive roles, but then again all of these side effects from finasteride are due to rising estrogen in the first place. Is it just that it's impossible with supplements/medications to find a happy medium?
Are there any other 'natural'/herbal ways to moderate your estrogen levels? I mean, they say that decreasing your estrogen can lead to a number of bad effects because estrogen plays certain positive roles, but then again all of these side effects from finasteride are due to rising estrogen in the first place. Is it just that it's impossible with supplements/medications to find a happy medium?
wesleyBelgium
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i use also the most potent anti-cancer stuff...
i cant post about it but its curcumin but 30x so powerfull...
the active form thats in curcumin...
i use it for my hair also , but it goes verry much systematic... high energy and concentration , clear in the head , that stuff, nothing negative about it
but i noticed better fitnessperformance sinds i eat the mushrooms, but i read that theres a chanse that 2 much of the active stuff in mushrooms can put stress on the liver , sinds i use also dutasteride , i will be carefull with this
http://www.raysahelian.com/agaricus.html
Up to June 2009, no agaricus side effects had been reported in Japan, where it has been in use as a dietary supplement since the mid 1990s. There is now a report in the medical literature that three cancer patients taking an agaricus supplement had liver damage.
An Alternative Medicine, Agaricus blazei, May Have Induced Severe Hepatic Dysfunction in Cancer Patients.
Japan J Clinical Oncology. 2006 Dec;36(12):808-10. Mukai H, Watanabe T, Ando M, Katsumata N. Division of Oncology/Hematology, National Cancer Center Hospital East, 6-5-1, Kashiwanoha, Kashiwa-shi, Chiba, Japan.
We report three cases of patients with advanced cancer who showed severe hepatic damage, and two of whom died of fulminant hepatitis. All the patients were taking Agaricus blazei ( Himematsutake ) extract, one of the most popular complementary and alternative medicines among Japanese cancer patients. In one patient, liver functions recovered gradually after she stopped taking the Agaricus blazei, but she restarted taking it, which resulted in deterioration of the liver function again. The other patients who were admitted for severe liver damage had started taking the Agaricus blazei several days before admission. Although several other factors cannot be completely ruled out as the causes of liver damage, a strong causal relationship between the Agaricus blazei extract and liver damage was suggested and, at least, taking the Agaricus blazei extract made the clinical decision-making process much more complicated.
Comments by Dr. Sahelian: For the time being, limit your intake of agaricus supplement to maximum 3 times a week and a full week off each month. It is not clear at this time whether the problem was with the particular agaricus supplement these patient were using, i.e, Himematsutake as it is called in Japan, or whether the problem of liver harm applies to all agaricus extract brands. Was the Himematsutake product these Japanese cancer patients were taking contaminated with something else? It is also not clear whether the liver problem is dose dependent. Sometimes patients with cancer will take a very high amount of a supplement thinking more is better. It is also not clear whether the liver damage occurred due to the fact that these patients may have been on chemotherapy drugs which weakened their liver and immune system.
i will cook the mushrooms every time and eat less of them...
its not to help my hair, its to boost my testo for fitness, and you dont want to much conversion from testo to estrogen....
but i will eat verry less of this, dont wanne risk my liver....
i cant post about it but its curcumin but 30x so powerfull...
the active form thats in curcumin...
i use it for my hair also , but it goes verry much systematic... high energy and concentration , clear in the head , that stuff, nothing negative about it
but i noticed better fitnessperformance sinds i eat the mushrooms, but i read that theres a chanse that 2 much of the active stuff in mushrooms can put stress on the liver , sinds i use also dutasteride , i will be carefull with this
http://www.raysahelian.com/agaricus.html
Up to June 2009, no agaricus side effects had been reported in Japan, where it has been in use as a dietary supplement since the mid 1990s. There is now a report in the medical literature that three cancer patients taking an agaricus supplement had liver damage.
An Alternative Medicine, Agaricus blazei, May Have Induced Severe Hepatic Dysfunction in Cancer Patients.
Japan J Clinical Oncology. 2006 Dec;36(12):808-10. Mukai H, Watanabe T, Ando M, Katsumata N. Division of Oncology/Hematology, National Cancer Center Hospital East, 6-5-1, Kashiwanoha, Kashiwa-shi, Chiba, Japan.
We report three cases of patients with advanced cancer who showed severe hepatic damage, and two of whom died of fulminant hepatitis. All the patients were taking Agaricus blazei ( Himematsutake ) extract, one of the most popular complementary and alternative medicines among Japanese cancer patients. In one patient, liver functions recovered gradually after she stopped taking the Agaricus blazei, but she restarted taking it, which resulted in deterioration of the liver function again. The other patients who were admitted for severe liver damage had started taking the Agaricus blazei several days before admission. Although several other factors cannot be completely ruled out as the causes of liver damage, a strong causal relationship between the Agaricus blazei extract and liver damage was suggested and, at least, taking the Agaricus blazei extract made the clinical decision-making process much more complicated.
Comments by Dr. Sahelian: For the time being, limit your intake of agaricus supplement to maximum 3 times a week and a full week off each month. It is not clear at this time whether the problem was with the particular agaricus supplement these patient were using, i.e, Himematsutake as it is called in Japan, or whether the problem of liver harm applies to all agaricus extract brands. Was the Himematsutake product these Japanese cancer patients were taking contaminated with something else? It is also not clear whether the liver problem is dose dependent. Sometimes patients with cancer will take a very high amount of a supplement thinking more is better. It is also not clear whether the liver damage occurred due to the fact that these patients may have been on chemotherapy drugs which weakened their liver and immune system.
i will cook the mushrooms every time and eat less of them...
its not to help my hair, its to boost my testo for fitness, and you dont want to much conversion from testo to estrogen....
but i will eat verry less of this, dont wanne risk my liver....
wesleyBelgium
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nope its not the original stuff ,its chemical developed in a lab and is 30x more potent then the original curcumin
i cant post anything about it , sinds its the real substance that they use in the acne trails.... get it
unk:
human trails 2 for acne are normally done
human trail 1 for hairloss is getting started
i'm allready an active user....
it goes systematic also :
high energie, clear in the head , feeling more warm , fatburning is up 2
it seems to react a bit with my avodart that i take every day... then the energy is boosted even more , and i feel bit more agressive 2
it breaks down the androgen receptors at the hairfollikels....
not blocking it like spironolactone or fluta but really damaging them...
another side-effect : it also binds for 75% to estrogen receptors , holding back a lot of uptake of estrogen.... so it works also anti-gyno...
this stuff is nowhere for sale....
got it trough a friend , its from india and 95% pure with documents to prove the chemical code, and details...
and i not talking about regular curcumin 95% here, i talk about the active ingredient of curcumin thats for 1,5% in the herbal curcumin... but 95% PURE
and verry expensive, RU is much cheaper then this....
i cant say more about it for now...
but if i see results i will let it know...
downside to this stuff :
sleeping is almost impossible , it keeps boosting you with energy....
so sleeping is verry difficult , sometimes i sleep only 4 - 5 hours
maybe 6 - 8 with sleeping pills
for the moment i apply 2 times a day when i get up , and before i go to work , so i have 8 hours between last dose and when i go asleep...
with this sleeping goes....
but to keep the androgen receptors damaged its best every 12 hours , just like with minoxidil , but i expect still improvement... with the 2 applications with 5 hours between , just to get some sleep it needs to be like this....
i made a topical out of it that has 30% glycerine in... applying it on a damp scalp or with a little dermaroller of 0,5mm...
i cant post anything about it , sinds its the real substance that they use in the acne trails.... get it
unk: human trails 2 for acne are normally done
human trail 1 for hairloss is getting started
i'm allready an active user....
it goes systematic also :
high energie, clear in the head , feeling more warm , fatburning is up 2
it seems to react a bit with my avodart that i take every day... then the energy is boosted even more , and i feel bit more agressive 2
it breaks down the androgen receptors at the hairfollikels....
not blocking it like spironolactone or fluta but really damaging them...
another side-effect : it also binds for 75% to estrogen receptors , holding back a lot of uptake of estrogen.... so it works also anti-gyno...
this stuff is nowhere for sale....
got it trough a friend , its from india and 95% pure with documents to prove the chemical code, and details...
and i not talking about regular curcumin 95% here, i talk about the active ingredient of curcumin thats for 1,5% in the herbal curcumin... but 95% PURE
and verry expensive, RU is much cheaper then this....
i cant say more about it for now...
but if i see results i will let it know...
downside to this stuff :
sleeping is almost impossible , it keeps boosting you with energy....
so sleeping is verry difficult , sometimes i sleep only 4 - 5 hours
maybe 6 - 8 with sleeping pills
for the moment i apply 2 times a day when i get up , and before i go to work , so i have 8 hours between last dose and when i go asleep...
with this sleeping goes....
but to keep the androgen receptors damaged its best every 12 hours , just like with minoxidil , but i expect still improvement... with the 2 applications with 5 hours between , just to get some sleep it needs to be like this....
i made a topical out of it that has 30% glycerine in... applying it on a damp scalp or with a little dermaroller of 0,5mm...
xxenergyxx
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@Wesley: are u talking about ASCJ-9 maybe? :wow:
Anyway used topical could be a good idea but I wouldn't take it oral.
I don't think it's a good thing the degradation of estrogen receptors inside body.
Anyway used topical could be a good idea but I wouldn't take it oral.
I don't think it's a good thing the degradation of estrogen receptors inside body.
wesleyBelgium
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yep...
dont think about the other guy that tested this, his version of china was not
the good version, chemical code was different... i checked it
no , not internal , i feel some sides of it with just 2x a day 0,75 ml topically...
i use between 1,2 and 1,4ml daily , depends on how much time i have lefts when i go to sleep...
but the sides are not bad : more energy , clear in the head , fatburning
getting more dryer, less bodyfat , great stuff, but it makes sleeping difficult sinds it allways gives you energie...
applying every day will keep the receptors damaged...
well the estrogenuptake will still work but will just take less estrogen...
for blocking gyno this would be verry intresting... maybe it explains a bit the energieboost ?
its still verry experimental for the moment
yeah its verry expencive , talking about 621 euro with shipping in for 50mg...
and 50mg is almost nothing....
i use 4mg every 10 days...
it will be cheaper when it gets fda approved... in 3 years minimum
will see what it does , i hope results dont take to long , 6 and 7 april is the day they do my hairtransplant of 2500 - 3000 fue..
would be great if the clinic saw massive improvement...unk:
would save some grafts also for maybe in the future a followup hair transplant...
dont think about the other guy that tested this, his version of china was not
the good version, chemical code was different... i checked it
no , not internal , i feel some sides of it with just 2x a day 0,75 ml topically...
i use between 1,2 and 1,4ml daily , depends on how much time i have lefts when i go to sleep...
but the sides are not bad : more energy , clear in the head , fatburning
getting more dryer, less bodyfat , great stuff, but it makes sleeping difficult sinds it allways gives you energie...
applying every day will keep the receptors damaged...
well the estrogenuptake will still work but will just take less estrogen...
for blocking gyno this would be verry intresting... maybe it explains a bit the energieboost ?
its still verry experimental for the moment
yeah its verry expencive , talking about 621 euro with shipping in for 50mg...
and 50mg is almost nothing....
i use 4mg every 10 days...
it will be cheaper when it gets fda approved... in 3 years minimum
will see what it does , i hope results dont take to long , 6 and 7 april is the day they do my hairtransplant of 2500 - 3000 fue..
would be great if the clinic saw massive improvement...
unk: would save some grafts also for maybe in the future a followup hair transplant...
xxenergyxx
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So you bought it here: http://www.caymanchem.com/app/template/ ... b/data/a/z
Didn't u ask to a chemist a galenic preparation?Maybe it should be very cheaper...
Didn't u ask to a chemist a galenic preparation?Maybe it should be very cheaper...
wesleyBelgium
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nope its not from there...
its with a friend that lives in india, from a chemicalcompany there....
its verry hard to come by , verry limited
if you find a cheaper source then 621 euro for 50mg , let me know
and nope , cayman does not sell this....
they deliver it only for the human trails...
if you find better source for the stuff let me know... china is normally not verry expencive , but finding the company that can produce this is hard....
seek a searchengine on : dimethoxy Curcumin
and look carefully at the result , demethoxy curcumin is not the right stuff...
it needs to be : DIMETHOXY , not demethoxy ....
but where going off-topic :whistle:
anybody els eating white button mushrooms ??unk:
its with a friend that lives in india, from a chemicalcompany there....
its verry hard to come by , verry limited
if you find a cheaper source then 621 euro for 50mg , let me know
and nope , cayman does not sell this....
they deliver it only for the human trails...
if you find better source for the stuff let me know... china is normally not verry expencive , but finding the company that can produce this is hard....
seek a searchengine on : dimethoxy Curcumin
and look carefully at the result , demethoxy curcumin is not the right stuff...
it needs to be : DIMETHOXY , not demethoxy ....
but where going off-topic :whistle:
anybody els eating white button mushrooms ??
unk: