Funding Desmond to go to World Hair Congress 2014 in South Korea!

[JZA70]

Stem cell therapy is ridiculously safe. Nobody has qualms about ingesting pills (finasteride) and people still dont know what the long term risks are with chemicals, but they're completely opposed to using YOUR OWN cells for organ regeneration. It's bizarre.

Yes sir, quite some interesting people on this forum.

 

[dreamermerlin]

Yes sir, quite some interesting people on this forum.

It's not bizzare at all. When you get cancer, it's also YOUR cells that go erratic.
I wouldn't disconsider the risks. Surely the "cell regeneration" therapy is only in its beginings, nobody knows the long-term risks, so i would be more than cautious to declare it safe.
I don;t want to say the method is very risky , but we don't know yet.
If they already did it, why does it take so long to be available for the public? It is exactly the potential risks, i think.

If you get some DNA corruption and cancerous cells start to form, it would take years to develop, so we can't declare the safety just that fast.
Go and document, stem cells have also the abilty to develop into cancer cells, they are also implied in tumours.

http://ludwigcenter.stanford.edu/overview/theory.html

As you see, it appears to be also the stem cells that sustain the cancer. Why do you think cancers are that bad and when they start to grow almost nothing can stop it??

For the moment it is not "ridiculously safe" at all. Actually, i think this is the main concern that makes it take so long: safety. You can't "play" with body cells and body DNA in a "petri dish" and then inject it intop your body that care-free...

Don't you get: the body's immune system actually has work to do almost everyday with "corrupted" cells. When cells multuply and divide, since there are billions of them into the body, errors may appear, and they do appear. If body's immune system is strong, it kills the corrupted cells. So i wonder, when the cell division happens in a petri-dish, who would assure destroying bad cells? Wouldn't it be possible that they don't get killed, and actually start ti multiply in a hair follcile, then you put the hair follcile into your head, and it may be to late for the immune system to kill all the bad cells there, some may "escape" and from that to a tumour it's only a step.
Of course, you wouldn't feel anything for the moment, and maybe a couple of years, till the tumour starts to grow big and multiply. Did you know that a tumour is only detectable even on a CT scan only when there are at least millions of cancer cells grouped together? Till then it is unnoticeable...
It's not that simple and it's not a kid's game with this cell multiplication.

 

[JZA70]

A whole wall of useless text. :shakehead:

 

[Python]

A whole wall of useless text. :shakehead:

There is nothing else to talk about really. Everything that can be said ha been said before. For the first time in hairloss forums across Telogen Effluvium Internet, we are at a standstill regarding a possible cure in the near future. Anything close to a cure is most likely 10 years away.

So there is nothing left to do but to argue, I'm afraid. The only thing we can do is to go with the crowdfunding campaign, everything else is pointless to discuss. The war is over soldier, you just don't know it yet.

 

[isishearmyplea]

war is over?? anyway yes we should all focus upon the crowdfunding campaign, people will be busy discussing the posts (by desmond) for a few months, after that , yes we should devote some time and energy on the crowdfunding campaign.

I play this online MOBA game, and people have amassed 6 million dollars for the yearly competition. I mean wtf man, kids and young adults are able to raise so much money for some hobby and here we are. once started, i think we ll be amazed by the money raised. i hope i am right.

 

[dreamermerlin]

A whole wall of useless text. :shakehead:

How superficial...

 

[2young2retire]

hellouser we need a time frame dont we?

hair congress ended and we all bitter and sad.

i am doing sth now for my hair but what on th long run . what if stopes responding or what if 1000000 ifs.

guys what is the conclusion of WHG 2014?

ascientist aaron grdner said hairs are colourless. hair this hair that?
so they didnt find a cure in the labs yet?

holy@@@@@@

 

[bushbush]

When you get cancer, it's also YOUR cells that go erratic.

Exactly, when people proclaim that stem cells are completely safe, they should consider this.

 

[hellouser]

Exactly, when people proclaim that stem cells are completely safe, they should consider this.

And why are people proclaiming pills are safe? We already know finasteride does cause permanent erectile dysfunction, reduced libido, gynecomastia, testicular pain. Up to 8% of people have erectile dysfunction: http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC140032/

And we're going to pretend like that is SAFE and then tell everyone to use it?

 

[dreamermerlin]

And why are people proclaiming pills are safe? We already know finasteride does cause permanent erectile dysfunction, reduced libido, gynecomastia, testicular pain. Up to 8% of people have erectile dysfunction: http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC140032/

And we're going to pretend like that is SAFE and then tell everyone to use it?

Yes, there are risks, but as you know, no risk, no gain.
Even when you drive home there is a risk that another driver could kill you, but this doesn't mean you won't drive anymore, does it?
And, by the way, erectile disfunction can be caused by several other factors, it's not only finasteride who does it.
There are many man with ED who didn't took a single mg of finasteride ever. And even some cases of ED are psychological.
It's a bit odd.
I mean, there are countelss studeis telling that drinking alcohol /smoking can bring you severe diseases, yet people drink and smoke .

And about the study in the link, as i see, it is about using finasteride for prostate hyperplasia, a condition mostly found in older men, maybe after 50-60, and guess what, at that ages, sexual potency is lower, and it is easier to get ED. If not, i assume v**** woudln't have to be invented, isn't it?
Oh, and never mind the dose: for prostate, is 5 mg, for hair, is 1 mg, and as some forum members showed, even 0.5-0.2 mg/day can maintain hair.
Do you have a study about finasteride effects on people aged 20-30-40? That would be more concludent!
They did studies with man of various ages, but i don;t know, did they tell what is the average age of the guys who got ED? Maybe it was just the older of them, and, you know, when you;re old, your dick doesn't do a great job anymore.

So that's how it goes with "Are we pretendng it is safe"?
What about driving a car? Thousands of people die in car accident s every year, in fact everyday some people die or get seriously injured in car accident, so, please answer me a question:
"are we pretending driving a car to work/home/vacation is SAFE"?

Even walking on a street, is it safe? Maybe a driver can lose control of his car, get off the street straight to you and kill you, i've seens cases.
So, what's completely safe in this world??

 

[JZA70]

Yes, there are risks, but as you know, no risk, no gain.

So why are you b1tching about stem cells then ?

 

[hellouser]

Yes, there are risks, but as you know, no risk, no gain.
Even when you drive home there is a risk that another driver could kill you, but this doesn't mean you won't drive anymore, isn't it?
And, by the way, erectile disfunction can be caused by several other factors, it's not only finasteride who does it.
There are many man with ED who didn't took 1 mg of finasteride ever. And even some cases of ED are psychological.
It's a bit odd.
I mean, there are countelss studeis telling that drinking alcohol /smoking can bring you severe diseases, yet people drink and smoke .

And about the study in the link, as i see, it is about using finasteride for prostate hyperplasia, a condition mostly found in older men, maybe after 50-60, and guess what, at that ages, sexual potency is lower, and it is easier to get ED. If not, i assume v**** woudln't have to be invented, isn't it?
Oh, and never mind the dose: for prostate, is 5 mg, for hair, is 1 mg, and as some forum members showed, even 0.5-0.2 mg/day can maintain hair.
Do you have a study about finasteride effects on people aged 20-30-40? That would be more concludent!
They did studies with man of various ages, but i don;t know, did they tell what is the average age of the guys who got ED? Maybe it was just the older of them, and, you know, when you;re old, your dick doesn't do a great job anymore.

So that's how it goes with "Are we pretendng it is safe"?
What about driving a car? Thousands of people die in car accident s every year, in fact everyday some people die or get seriously injured in car accident, so, please answer me a question:
"are we pretending driving a car to work/home/vacation is SAFE"?

Even walking on a street, is it safe? Maybe a driver can lose control of his car, get off the street straight to you and kill you, i've seens cases.
So, what's completely safe in this world??

This is a perfect example of a straw man argument.

 

[dreamermerlin]

So why are you b1tching about stem cells then ?

Can't compare stem cells to finasteride.
finasteride is available for aprox 20 years, it's pretty sure it doesn't kill people .
About cell multiplication and stem cells, things are different. In fact, as you proved above, you have no idea what a stem cell is, and that stem cells can be good regenerating tissues, but they can also be bad, cancer also uses stem cells big time to spread fast through the whole body and to grow tumours.
Trust me, i would be very happy for stem cells to work and to be safe and to solve our hair problems, but as i read from researchers, there are cancer risks.
I said "risks", that's why the clinical trials are for: to evaluate safety, in fact, the first phase of every trial is about safety, then comes efficacy,

- - - Updated - - -

This is a perfect example of a straw man argument.

I thinks the arguments are fine...if not, feel free to tell what it is wrong.
That study clearly is about finasteride for PROSTATE, and as i know 20-30 year old guys don't have enlarge prostate, do they??
Then, people in that study took 5 mg, not 1 mg as for hair loss.
Where am i wrong here?

 

[JZA70]

Can't compare stem cells to finasteride.

Well lets not compare anything. You said "there are risks, but as you know, no risk, no gain."

Why don't you practice what you preach buddy boy ?

 

[dreamermerlin]

Well lets not compare anything. You said "there are risks, but as you know, no risk, no gain."

Why don't you practice what you preach buddy boy ?

Omg, are you serious?? And do you have any logic?
Let me be clear: before starting finasteride i've read very well its side effects, and being that it's available for 20 years, i had no problem taking it, and fast forward 4 years after that, things are fine, i had no problems.
What i want to say, there may be a risk with finasteride, but it's minor and i assumed it.

With the stem cells, on the other part, that is something very very new, so we don;t know the risks. I used to be very enthusiast about this stem cells, until i read some articles and saw there may be risks with them. Temporary Ed from finasteride would be a completely joke versus a possible cancerous tumour as a "side-effect" of follicle cloning.
So let's be patient: firstly let them implant 10.000 follciles grown in a lab to a human head, and wait a couple of years to see if the hair grows, if it stays, etc, if it doesn't happen anything with the person, and only after that we can say that "stem cell therapy is ridiculously safe".

 

[uncomfortable man]

Hmm, quite strange, i assume in different countries there are different attitudes towards bald people.
In my country for example, nobody gives a damn if someone elese is bald.
Respect? I even think bald people are more respected than Nw0 3 cm forehead "monkeys". Really! Nobody has a problem respecting bald citizens, as long as they ar worth respect, if you are bald and a jerk, nobody would respect you.
Here people are respected for their character, for what they are, not for the quantity of hair on their heads.
People know baldness is genetic and someone who is bald simply inherited some genes, it is not his choice to be without hair, what's that hard??

So if you're bald there is no problem someone would not respect you as a human being, or in your profession.
Aaa, maybe being bald you can't have acces to the hottest girls/women, but, to be sincere, i see everyday multiple examples of bald guys with attractive females. They may lack hair, but surely they have other qualities.

I think you have the perspective you have because you are relatively insulated from the influences of western culture where you live, in Romania. It's like Fred who lives in Amsterdam (I think)... the first time he was really mocked for baldness was yeeears after it happened to him and only when he traveled outside his safe bubble into a culture that is way more hostile to my kind, the bald. You have to move to the United States (try southern California) to feel the difference in attitudes.... it's another world my friend. A world where so many people look down on us and treat us like crap. It's real, I'm telling you. But you need to live here (or at least visit) long enough to experience it yourself. Then maybe you can understand what guys like Hellouser and me are actually talking about.

 

[hellouser]

I think you have the perspective you have because you are relatively insulated from the influences of western culture where you live, in Romania. It's like Fred who lives in Amsterdam (I think)... the first time he was really mocked for baldness was yeeears after it happened to him and only when he traveled outside his safe bubble into a culture that is way more hostile to my kind, the bald. You have to move to the United States (try southern California) to feel the difference in attitudes.... it's another world my friend. A world where so many people look down on us and treat us like crap. It's real, I'm telling you. But you need to live here (or at least visit) long enough to experience it yourself. Then maybe you can understand what guys like Hellouser and me are actually talking about.

Western societies are awful towards baldness, you're right about that, but it's at its absolute worst in Los Angeles, Miami (extremely superficial city), New York and Toronto. Balding in any of these cities is extremely painful. I've had people laugh, attack and insult me on a Toronto chat forum over just my receded hairline by both men and women. I am lucky its never gotten to that point in public but the disgusting attitudes towards balding men here are very, VERY real. One of my closest friends said she'd never date a bald guy and yet she is only in Calgary with multiple sclerosis (you'd think she'd let some things slide given her own situation). A coworker of mine in Toronto once mocked a bald guy and I asked her 'whats wrong baldness?' and she said 'Whats NOT wrong with baldness?'. I was watching game 6 NBA western conference finals between San Antonio and Oklahoma City at my best friend's house. His girlfriend was laughing at Manu Ginobili's bald spot. She specifically said 'Oh my, they keep showing that poor guy's bald spot! Hahaha!'

Wanting our hair back is not about vanity... it's just to be seen and treated as a NORMAL person and have the SAME opportunities as anyone else. Though keep in mind, the people here privileged to have hair typically laugh at those without hair but when they find out someone wants to treat their hair loss, they tell them they're vain. But WHAT makes them laugh at baldness if it isn't their own vanity?

I used to live in Greece before my parents moved to Canada. Despite the economy, I really do wish we stayed there. The western world really is a disgusting place, its extremely superficial and materialistic.

 

[Python]

Western societies are awful towards baldness, you're right about that, but it's at its absolute worst in Los Angeles, Miami (extremely superficial city), New York and Toronto. Balding in any of these cities is extremely painful. I've had people laugh, attack and insult me online over just my receded hairline by both men and women. I am lucky its never gotten to that point in public but the disgusting attitudes towards balding men here are very, VERY real. One of my closest friends said she'd never date a bald guy and yet she is only in Calgary with multiple sclerosis (you'd think she'd let some things slide given her own situation). A coworker of mine in Toronto once mocked a bald guy and I asked her 'whats wrong baldness?' and she said 'Whats NOT wrong with baldness?'. I was watching game 6 NBA western conference finals between San Antonio and Oklahoma City at my best friend's house. His girlfriend was laughing at Manu Ginobili's bald spot. She specifically said 'Oh my, they keep showing that poor guy's bald spot! Hahaha!'

Wanting our hair back is not about vanity... it's just to be seen and treated as a NORMAL person and have the SAME opportunities as anyone else. Though keep in mind, the people here privileged to have hair typically laugh at those without hair but when they find out someone wants to treat their hair loss, they tell them they're vain. But WHAT makes them laugh at baldness if it isn't their own vanity?

I used to live in Greece before my parents moved to Canada. Despite the economy, I really do wish we stayed there. The western world really is a disgusting place, its extremely superficial and materialistic.

+1

Women do feel like they're doing us a favor by dating us and we have to put up with their crap because they can leave us so fast. It is flat out discusting how were treated. Diseases are looked at with humility and comprehension because one can feel someone's pain, for example, a cancer patient. But baldness has this burden of being the only disease that is not only acceptable to mock, but also encorouraged. Yet we can't do a damn thing and when we do, we get laughed at either way.

I have lived in Los Angeles my whole life and I can say that this place is so bad. You are a criminal if you're bald, simple as that.

 

[dreamermerlin]

Very sorry to find people are that superficial and nasty in America/Canada.
You're right, in Europe is not that way.

 

[Sparky4444]

One of my closest friends said she'd never date a bald guy and yet she is only in Calgary with multiple sclerosis (you'd think she'd let some things slide given her own situation). A coworker of mine in Toronto once mocked a bald guy and I asked her 'whats wrong baldness?' and she said 'Whats NOT wrong with baldness?'. I was watching game 6 NBA western conference finals between San Antonio and Oklahoma City at my best friend's house. His girlfriend was laughing at Manu Ginobili's bald spot. She specifically said 'Oh my, they keep showing that poor guy's bald spot! Hahaha!'

Really?? Really?? These people are the ones who are hurting, not you...well, you are, but you can change that...again, these are the kind of people whose approval you want, then you're getting exactly what you ask for...

...just wait for your friends girl to pop out a couple of kids, her tit's sagging, her pussy stretched out, her looks failing here....then what???

fvcking grow up