High Estrogen Levels

[PolarBear]

Hey Yeddie,

last night I found conversion factors on the Internet, and converted the value on my own.

It turned out that my estradiol level in old units is 87,17 pg/mL.

According to the article about hormones on lef.org, the acceptible range for a man of any age should be 10 – 30 pg/mL, and by no way someone's value should exceed the highest limit.

It seems that my estradiol level is almost 3x greater than maximum acceptible number according to lef.org.

I have big time troubles with erections and libido, and my sexuality is desensitized in number of ways.

Also, my total testosterone is below 500 ng/dl, and acceptible range according to lef.org is 500 - 827.

 

[azsand]

Estrogen

McHair,

Like you, I seem to maintain or start symptoms AFTER quitting Propecia. This is the second time in 6 years that I have taken and then quit taking Propecia and experienced very strong roseca for months AFTERWARDS. I have several other symptoms that are also often associated with estrogen dominance, which I question if I have. However, my libido is still pretty good.

Strange things I am experiencing include:

• -VERY red eyes, 24/7
  -Ocular rosecea (bumps on eyelids)
  -Visible blood vessels under the eyes
  -Unexpected changes in mood that sometimes come on strong and for no apparent reason.

Maybe coincidence, but that fact I experienced the same thing after quitting the first time has me suspicious. Need to get my hormones checked.

 

[goldenbears]

this is mentioned in another thread...but it seems like super mariforte with chrysin helps to reduce estrogen levels and increase testosteron levels. ive been trying to find more information about this whole deal...

 

[drinkrum]

Chrysin is snake-oil. If you want to effectively reduce your estrogen count, use Arimidex or Femara.

Hair,

It's quite weird that you still have high estrogen still after quitting finasteride. 10 months past. You used dutasteride also, correct? Or am I thinking of someone else?

D.

 

[tpeter]

DRINKRUM,


I know you had high Estrogen as well Like me, did you use any of those drugs to get it down? If so what did you use, did it work? and where did you buy it. Also did you notice any changes when your estrogen went down. Mine is at like 215 or something i cant remember exactly. I do have my TES at like 900+ though but need to get the estrogen down.

 

[drinkrum]

My test. was 799 -- est. at 212. Arimidex will do the trick, but the exact dosing is tricky. The first week on Arimidex at the dosage of 0.25 mg every-other-day sent my libido surging. I also got a few pimples on my shoulders and upper back.

Arimidex might contradict the positive effects on hair from finasteride, so be careful. Your test. is already high, and Arimidex will increase them further. Shouldn't be a big problem, but start out slow and figure out what your dosage needs to be.

Another drug that will work is Femara. Both run at the same high price.

D.

 

[drinkrum]

Out of curiosity, how long have you been on finasteride and how old are you, tpeter?

How have your results been on finasteride.?

D.

 

[hair mchair]

Chrysin is snake-oil. If you want to effectively reduce your estrogen count, use Arimidex or Femara.

Hair,

It's quite weird that you still have high estrogen still after quitting finasteride. 10 months past. You used dutasteride also, correct? Or am I thinking of someone else?

D.

I only used finasteride. Never used dutasteride.

It is strange that my estrogen levels are so high 10 months after quitting. My theory is that Propecia messed up my hypothalamus-pituitary-testicular axis. I'm gonna go see this guy Dr. Shippen who has experience dealing with guys with finasteride-induced sexual dysfunction.

My estrogen levels are lower than yours, but your testosterone is much higher than mine (I'm at 424). That might explain why my symptoms are so friggin bad.

How is the Arimidex working for you drinkrum? Just got mine today. I plan on using .5 mg twice a week for now.

 

[hair mchair]

It turned out that my estradiol level in old units is 87,17 pg/mL.

According to the article about hormones on lef.org, the acceptible range for a man of any age should be 10 – 30 pg/mL, and by no way someone's value should exceed the highest limit.

It seems that my estradiol level is almost 3x greater than maximum acceptible number according to lef.org.

I have big time troubles with erections and libido, and my sexuality is desensitized in number of ways.

Also, my total testosterone is below 500 ng/dl, and acceptible range according to lef.org is 500 - 827.

Polar Bear is in the same boat as me. High estrogen levels, low testosterone levels. A very bad combination for sexual function.

 

[drinkrum]

Bump up your dosage hair -- at least for the first couple of weeks. Try 0.50 every-other-day. Arimidex is very potent ... you will probably see what I mean after a couple of doses.

I will pass judgement on Arimidex after I get my hormones tested. I've been on it for a month. Started out at 0.50 mg/week -- now going with 0.25 every-other-day.

D.

 

[drinkrum]

It turned out that my estradiol level in old units is 87,17 pg/mL.

According to the article about hormones on lef.org, the acceptible range for a man of any age should be 10 – 30 pg/mL, and by no way someone's value should exceed the highest limit.

It seems that my estradiol level is almost 3x greater than maximum acceptible number according to lef.org.

I have big time troubles with erections and libido, and my sexuality is desensitized in number of ways.

Also, my total testosterone is below 500 ng/dl, and acceptible range according to lef.org is 500 - 827.

Polar Bear is in the same boat as me. High estrogen levels, low testosterone levels. A very bad combination for sexual function.

A drug like Arimidex or Femara will raise testosterone and reduce estrogen significantly. It will also cause your body to start producing more testosterone naturally -- so it's not like steroids (where you inject artifical test. in your body).

Hair, please keep me updated about Dr. Shippen. I can give my further contact details if you'd like. We're only 5 min. from each other by car.

D.

 

[hair mchair]

Bump up your dosage hair -- at least for the first couple of weeks. Try 0.50 every-other-day. Arimidex is very potent ... you will probably see what I mean after a couple of doses.

I will pass judgement on Arimidex after I get my hormones tested. I've been on it for a month. Started out at 0.50 mg/week -- now going with 0.25 every-other-day.

D.

You really think I should use more than .5 mg twice a week? I was planning on starting out small and then increasing the dosage gradually if I don't see results. What would you recommend?

One thing I'm afraid of is that my body will compensate for the Arimidex by increasing estrogen production and/or decreasing testosterone production. Have you ever heard of this happening?

Did your libido settle back down after the first week or so? Is it higher now than pre-Arimidex???

 

[Rudiratlos]

Hair...your body will not compensate...making more estrogen...
(and less testosteron)
..this is not possible becoz ..u inhibit/block Aromatase (that breaks down testosteron in estradiol) very effectivly...(much more effective than finast blocks 5a-reductase)

MOST AROMATSE activity is in your FAT tissue....only about 20 % is made by the testis..(normal BMI)
besides..Estradiol and testosteron bind to the same receptor...your hypothalomus doesnt "know" the difference between Test and Estradiol..thats why increasing estrogen/estradiol...will overtime decrease testosteron...(SHBG plays an important role to)
taking Arimidex will lower estrogen...and therefore will increase testosteron..(AND LH AND FSH)

BUT guys.. Take arimidex only to restore normal estrogen levels...and try to keep estrogen levels low by a good diet and low body mass index...

Hair (and the others how tested their test and estrogen levels)....
what is Your BMI...(AGAIN if its high...than losing wheight will help to keep estrogen levels low..when returned to normal)

 

[drinkrum]

Bump up your dosage hair -- at least for the first couple of weeks. Try 0.50 every-other-day. Arimidex is very potent ... you will probably see what I mean after a couple of doses.

I will pass judgement on Arimidex after I get my hormones tested. I've been on it for a month. Started out at 0.50 mg/week -- now going with 0.25 every-other-day.

D.

You really think I should use more than .5 mg twice a week? I was planning on starting out small and then increasing the dosage gradually if I don't see results. What would you recommend?

One thing I'm afraid of is that my body will compensate for the Arimidex by increasing estrogen production and/or decreasing testosterone production. Have you ever heard of this happening?

Did your libido settle back down after the first week or so? Is it higher now than pre-Arimidex???

Hair,

If _anything_ you will increase your body's natural production of testosterone. Estrogen is derived directly from testosterone and is converted via the aromatase enzyme. By fooling your body into thinking it has less estrogen, it will unintelligently produce more testosterone (since it thinks the extra test. will convert into est.).

So this bodes well for someone like you, who has both high est. and low test., rather than someone like me, who has high est. but normal test.

Try out a higher dose and how you react to it. Even 0.50 mg EOD might not be enough for someone in your situation in the beginning, based on the lowering of estrogen with anastrozole in clinical studies (the dosage was 1.0 mg/day). But MrTelogen, who used the same 1 mg/day for 23 days basically baselined his estrogen count (to zero). If I were you, I would try 1 mg/day for a week and then 0.50/day for a week and then 0.25/day for a week. If you notice you're responding very well, then cut the dosage.

D.

 

[drinkrum]

Hair...your body will not compensate...making more estrogen...
(and less testosteron)
..this is not possible becoz ..u inhibit/block Aromatase (that breaks down testosteron in estradiol) very effectivly...(much more effective than finast blocks 5a-reductase)

MOST AROMATSE activity is in your FAT tissue....only about 20 % is made by the testis..(normal BMI)
besides..Estradiol and testosteron bind to the same receptor...your hypothalomus doesnt "know" the difference between Test and Estradiol..thats why increasing estrogen/estradiol...will overtime decrease testosteron...(SHBG plays an important role to)
taking Arimidex will lower estrogen...and therefore will increase testosteron..(AND LH AND FSH)

BUT guys.. Take arimidex only to restore normal estrogen levels...and try to keep estrogen levels low by a good diet and low body mass index...

Hair (and the others how tested their test and estrogen levels)....
what is Your BMI...(AGAIN if its high...than losing wheight will help to keep estrogen levels low..when returned to normal)

I'm 8% body fat -- something like 20 BMI.

D.

 

[danthemanstewart]

so were these high levels of estrogen that you guys are talking about caused by the finasteride? and did the estrogen return to normal after you got off the finasteride?

also, someone said something about getting a shot of testosterone or something...isn't that part of the problem of hairloss in the first place?

 

[Rudiratlos]

I'm 8% body fat -- something like 20 BMI.

D.[/quote]

thats very very good....

what does your Doctor say about this!... the big problem
in your case is the ratio testosteron : estradiol ...is not good...
most likely this causes your libido problems...
your BMI is low...so thats not the problem..!..
so lowering your estradiol (by using aromatize inhibitor) ... less estradiol bindts to hyptohalomus -->. more GnrH more LH more testosteron (more DHT ...not more estradiol becoz its blocked)..

point out to your dockter that your test:estradiol ratio is to low..and that thats know to cause sexual problems.. you dont have high BMI nor are u an alcoholic.. (so not lifestyle related ..)
its likely that after 2 weeks your ratio is restored.. and will remain good when u stop taking arimidex..(becoz low bodyfat).

he should help you...
there are some research artikels about restoring testosterone:estradiol ratiol

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/quer ... t=Abstract

RESULTS: After 2 weeks of therapy with anastrazole, levels of testosterone, luteinizing hormone, and estradiol had returned to normal. No effect was noted on premature ejaculation


http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/quer ... t=Abstract
Men who are infertile with a low serum testosterone-to-estradiol ratio can be treated with an aromatase inhibitor. With treatment, an increase in testosterone-to-estradiol ratio occurred in association with increased semen parameters. Anastrozole and testolactone have similar effects on hormonal profiles and semen analysis. Anastrazole appears to be at least as effective as testolactone for treating men with abnormal testosterone-to-estradiol ratios,

GOOD luck man..
(dockters SUCK)

 

[drinkrum]

Good stuff Rudiratlos. I don't believe, however, that one can maintain a good test:estradiol ratio if they stop taking Arimidex.

D.

 

[PolarBear]

Hi Rudilatos!

It seems that you are well qualified to talk about estradiol and how to recude it.

My estradiol is abnormaly high (3x more than highest limit), and my testosterone total count is below recommended lowest limit.

I am definitely preparing myself to visit endo and use Armidex.

Do you think it should work well in my case, and 2) do you think that the results (if they occur) should remain throughout time?
tnx

 

[Rudiratlos]

Good stuff Rudiratlos. I don't believe, however, that one can maintain a good test:estradiol ratio if they stop taking Arimidex.

D.

Well I really really do believe that its possible...(esspecialy in your case)

that is becos test and estradiol bindt to the same receptor in the hyptohalomus...
if test (or estradiol or both) are high a lot off receptors are occupied. so de hypothalomus reduces GnRH production...GnRH causes LH production
LH causes testosteron production (and indirect estradiol production [aromatse])...

that is why testosteron users get problems with their hypo axis and stop producing LH and TEst (and get smal testis)

to keep it easy (THIS IS VERY SIMPLIFIED..)
say normal testosteron : estradiol ratio is 100:50 (=150)
u have t:e 75:75 (=150)... so you hypthalomus doesnt scence anything wrong...so by inhibiting aromatse this happens
u get 75: 25 ratio...then your hypo think he !that`s not good...starts producing LH---> and LH causes your testis to produce more testosteron
(normale your test is converted to estradiol and dht also but the estradiol pathway is blocked)

so test is raising until normal (becoz your Hypo continues until its 150 again)
so after say 2 weeks...you wil hav T:E 125:25 ...
(so raised test lowerd estradiol..and probably raised DHT.)

so then u discontinue...arimidex.. the test wich is somewhat elevated will turn into estradiol returning it to normale values (100:50)

you have low BMI dont drink a lot a alcohol...so u dont have more than normal aromatize activity so..no problem (remeber most aromatse activity is in fat tissue)

EXCEPT when u continue finasteride use the EXTRA test..can be converted in estrogen...(so discontinue fiansteride use..after arimidex..or take arimidex once every.....?????? 4months>?????...u have to monitor when estradiol levels raise above normal again...
but without finasteride..and a healthy lifestyle...its unlikely that your estrogen levels rise again!....