How Dutasteride utterly destroyed my hair and why you shouldn't take it

[nachos]

Are studies sacred texts? Aren't my pictures enough evidence to you that something is wrong? What about the thousands of guys who experienced the same sh*t as me and have pictures to confirm it as well, should we all just f*** off because "WHERE'S MUH STUDIES"

This scientism shitty mindset is so poisonous to society

Stop acting like your namesake. It’s really annoying. I’m not saying there’s not something else at play, but it’s been shown that testosterone is not an issue for hair loss. To ignore the data is just silly. It has BEEN tested quite a few times in quite a few studies. Again, I’m not saying there’s not something else at play, but what I am saying, it’s not testosterone, at fault.

You sound idiotic to try and mock studies and data that have shown that testosterone has no impact on male pattern baldness. Studies have basis. And to try and mock studies as if they’re meaningless makes you look foolish.

 

[Caillou]

Stop acting like your namesake. It’s really annoying. I’m not saying there’s not something else at play, but it’s been shown that testosterone is not an issue for hair loss. To ignore the data is just silly. It has BEEN tested quite a few times in quite a few studies. Again, I’m not saying there’s not something else at play, but what I am saying, it’s not testosterone, at fault.

You sound idiotic to try and mock studies and data that have shown that testosterone has no impact on male pattern baldness.

Then the studies are wrong, simple as that. I would rather trust reality and my own eyes than some statistics and shitty theories on paper

Scientists don't know why hair loss even exists or what truly causes it, they don't know how the DHT paradox works, they can't even produce a single treatment (not cure) that works for hair without many side effects (minoxidil and finasteride were discovered by accident and have many side effects), they don't know sh*t and that's why we're on these forum in the first place

Scientists 100 years ago used to preach with "studies" about how smoking is healthy and why pregnant women should take it, they were advocating and selling cocaine in pharmacies and recommending to use DDT to keep flies away from babies

I don't believe in scientists since they're not immune from mistakes and bullshit, and i don't give a sh*t what they say if it doesn't align with the reality that i can see and touch on daily basis

 

[nachos]

Then the studies are wrong, simple as that. I would rather trust reality and my own eyes than some statistics and shitty theories on paper

Scientists don't know why hair loss even exists or what truly causes it, they don't know how the DHT paradox works, they can't even produce a single treatment (not cure) that works for hair without many side effects (minoxidil and finasteride were discovered by accident and have many side effects), they don't know sh*t and that's why we're on these forum in the first place

Scientists 100 years ago used to preach with "studies" about how smoking is healthy and why pregnant women should take it, they were advocating and selling cocaine in pharmacies and recommending to use DDT to keep flies away from babies

I don't believe in scientists since they're not immune from mistakes and bullshit, and i don't give a sh*t what they say if it doesn't align with the reality that i can see and touch on daily basis

You don’t believe “in” scientists, you believe scientists because they have the data to back it up. Because dutasteride may not work for you, you assume it’s testosterone at fault? It could be a myriad of different things and yet you assume it’s testosterone when it could be a number of things... Your ignorance and lack of ability to understand the significance of data and science astounds me. You’re not worth responding to. I can’t take what you say seriously with such ignorance. We’re done.

 

[Caillou]

You don’t believe “in” scientists, you believe scientists because they have the data to back it up. Your ignorance and lack of ability to understand the significance of data and science astounds me. You’re not worth responding to. I can’t take what you say seriously with such ignorance. We’re done.

Yeah the scientists 100 years ago also had "data" and "studies" that smoking is healthy and cocaine is harmless and DDT should be used directly on humans lol

You sound like on the verge of cognitive dissonance due to knowing that your entire worldview is built on something so fragile like "data" and "studies" which both have always contained lots of bullshit

 

[stressftw]

Seems like a shock loss to me (effluvium)


U should see things by realistic perspective and try to not panic now

If ur shedding 300 strands a day, u are clearly under some type of shock loss that is not related to male pattern baldness

We can assume that Dutasteride triggered this shock loss, it doesnt mean it accelerated your male pattern baldness or that it wasnt working for inhibit follicle miniaturization.
What u have to focus now, is to recover the ground u have lost. Every sistemic medication u put on your body now can exagerate that hair loss response.


U are in a fucked up position now.

Duta couldve trigged a temporary telogen effluvium, but its indeed keeping your miniaturized hairs safe from dht damage

There is no point taking duta if its keeping your sensitive hairs safe at the expense of making you lose even more ground through effluvium

Option 1: U can keep taking it and wait for the temporary loss to subside(a possibility),

Option 2: Quit cold turkey.

If u quit cold turkey, miniaturized hairs that u have lost through this shed will probably have a faster cycle, thus die sooner.
At the very best case scenario u get back to the baseline which was causing you trouble already.


I wouldnt switch from duta to finasteride if i was you. I would get 100% clean of meds and wait this shock loss get back to normal.

Then u can start to think switching to finasteride

 

[Caillou]

If u quit cold turkey, miniaturized hairs that u have lost through this shed will probably have a faster cycle, thus die sooner.

Thanks for your comment, but does this mean that the hair i lost, even if it comes back, will be lost again faster than the time it was genetically predisposed for to fall?

Do they have shorter life expectancy now in other words?

 

[nachos]

Yeah the scientists 100 years ago also had "data" and "studies" that smoking is healthy and cocaine is harmless and DDT should be used directly on humans lol

You sound like on the verge of cognitive dissonance due to knowing that your entire worldview is built on something so fragile like "data" and "studies" which both have always contained lots of bullshit

Dude. Most of what was found and studied in the past, through science and data, still holds true today. Very very little, in comparison, had been found to be “wrong”. You’re making wild assumptions out of ignorance. What you’re arguing is like trying to argue that covid vaccines always cause death because of the few who have died, after taking it, due to other reasons. You’re looking at outliers that may have a multitude of other potential factors. There’s always going to be new findings in different areas over time. With what we know about testosterone right now, it’s pretty cut and dry that it doesn’t have any direct correlation to male pattern baldness, aside from its transition to DHT. We “know” that. We’re not missing any pieces in that regard, unlike other studies in which we may come to a conclusion from just our current understandings It’s not just something we’re assuming. There’s been shown absolutely no direct correlation to male pattern baldness from testosterone alone. What we don’t know, is if there are any other reasons/causes for male pattern baldness or hair loss.

Again, you don’t have any idea what you’re arguing and you’re trying to argue something that could have a multitude of reasons, and you’re assuming it’s testosterone. You are arguing like one of those Qanon idiots. “Oh my god, covid kills because I know one person who died months after getting the vaccine! I don’t know if it was related or not but aaaah it must be the vaccine!”

there are a myriad of reasons as to why hair loss can continue that aren’t related at all to testosterone. To assume it’s testosterone, when that’s been one of the few things that had been SCIENTIFICALLY SHOWN NOT to cause or exacerbate male pattern baldness, alone, makes you look like a moron. You’re not even taking into account the multitude of possible OTHER reasons that could be at play. You’re assuming the one thing we know DOESNT cause it, causes it. You’re an idiot.

to “not believe in the studies”, as you say, makes you look stupid.


okay. Now we’re done. You really aren’t worth my time if you can’t even muster up the proper ability to articulate thought and argue with logic and comprehension.

 

[whatintheworld]

I’ve been researching this and absolutely no studies I’ve found have concluded that hair loss can be caused by testosterone. Unless you can provide me a peer-reviewed source for this, it’s just gibberish bs spread about way too much on this forum. Every study I’ve seen and read have shown absolutely zero correlation between testosterone (besides DHT) and hair loss.

Let me give you an article to read: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4174066/

In essence: It is a multi-faceted disease. It’s not the amount of testosterone or DHT that causes baldness; it’s the sensitivity of your hair follicles. That sensitivity is determined by genetics. The AR gene makes the receptor on hair follicles that interact with testosterone and DHT. If your receptors are particularly sensitive, they are more easily triggered by even small amounts of DHT. So, hair loss occurs more easily as a result. Other genes may also play a part.

 

[whatintheworld]

The point is that, you would think if only DHT was the reason, then dutasteride would actually be the cure to this condition. But this is clearly not the case, when we see the situation with OP and many, many other accounts.

If you did any more research into male pattern baldness you would see there are many, many factors: tension in the scalp, inflammation, cranial structure, PGD2/PGE2 levels, of course Testosterone/DHT, genetic sensitivity to androgens, etc.

It is a cascade of factors, that in some people, when you disrupt your body's natural homeostasis by means of finasteride or dutasteride, you can have unexpected, negative consequences.

 

[whatintheworld]

Does Injected Testosterone Cause Baldness?

Hair loss experts Dr. Matthew Lopresti and Dr. Robert Leonard share their on whether anabolic steroids such as testosterone cause baldness.

www.hairdr.com

"We at Leonard Hair Transplant Associates are often asked whether anabolic steroids such as testosterone cause baldness. Injected testosterone has been used for many decades to increase muscle mass as well as for other medical reasons like hypogonadism, where the body manufactures too little of this hormone.

It is commonly known the DHT (dihydrotestosterone) is the biochemical culprit of androgenetic alopecia or male pattern baldness. If a person has the genetic predisposition to having DHT turn off the hair growth cycle at some predetermined time, then hair will undergo miniaturization and the balding process will become evident with thinner and thinner hair.

Our experience is that if one injects testosterone to restore normal testosterone levels, then there is little concern for it to cause baldness. However, if one injects testosterone that leads to much higher testosterone levels in the blood stream, then we have seen it to accelerate the natural process of male pattern hair loss leading to thinner hair sooner than nature would have had it happen. This increase, we have often observed, can be significant and rather rapid, depending on how much and how often it is injected."

 

[nachos]

Does Injected Testosterone Cause Baldness?

Hair loss experts Dr. Matthew Lopresti and Dr. Robert Leonard share their on whether anabolic steroids such as testosterone cause baldness.

www.hairdr.com

"We at Leonard Hair Transplant Associates are often asked whether anabolic steroids such as testosterone cause baldness. Injected testosterone has been used for many decades to increase muscle mass as well as for other medical reasons like hypogonadism, where the body manufactures too little of this hormone.

It is commonly known the DHT (dihydrotestosterone) is the biochemical culprit of androgenetic alopecia or male pattern baldness. If a person has the genetic predisposition to having DHT turn off the hair growth cycle at some predetermined time, then hair will undergo miniaturization and the balding process will become evident with thinner and thinner hair.

Our experience is that if one injects testosterone to restore normal testosterone levels, then there is little concern for it to cause baldness. However, if one injects testosterone that leads to much higher testosterone levels in the blood stream, then we have seen it to accelerate the natural process of male pattern hair loss leading to thinner hair sooner than nature would have had it happen. This increase, we have often observed, can be significant and rather rapid, depending on how much and how often it is injected."

All this says is that it turns into DHT and baldness occurs. This has nothing stated regarding testosterone by itself, with DHT taken out of the equation.

or is this in response to the original thread?

 

[whatintheworld]

All this says is that it turns into DHT and baldness occurs. This has nothing stated regarding testosterone by itself, with DHT taken out of the equation.

or is this in response to the original thread?

Re-read the last paragraph.

DHT is the primary culprit as it is a stronger androgen than testosterone. That does not mean that increased testosterone itself cannot have an effect, it is all dependent on an individual's particular sensitivity level.

 

[whatintheworld]

Further, from the earlier link that I posted:

In summary, the theory points out that the pressure on the hair follicles is buffered by the surrounding subcutaneous fat tissue and young dermis that is capable of keeping itself well hydrated. As one ages, thickness of the subcutaneous fat tissue and the volume of the dermis decreases,11,12 that is, the buffer decreases and consequently the pressure on the hair follicles increases. Another factor that is well known to cause thinning of subcutaneous fat tissue much more rapidly than aging is testosterone.13–16 With the onset of puberty, subcutaneous fat tissue starts to decrease instantaneously at an early age in the male due to increase in testosterone levels.17,18 Estrogen protects the cushioning tissues until after menopause in the female.19–24 And, testosterone effected reduction in subcutaneous fat tissue normally does not happen in the female at all.

 

[Reciprocity]

I think you simply are a non-responder to dutasteride.

 

[Caillou]

I think you simply are a non-responder to dutasteride.

Not only a non responder, but dutasteride massacred my hairline

I wish if dutasteride simply did nothing or just maintained

 

[Diffused_confidence]

Hey @Caillou I found something you might want to listen to.

Skip to 44:50. The guy asks about taking Avodart (dutasteride) and there is a discussion about how it typically comes with a massive shed. Not sure if this would interest you or not. I listen to these guys when I go to bed on weekends. You get nuggets of info here and there.

 

[Reciprocity]

Not only a non responder, but dutasteride massacred my hairline

I wish if dutasteride simply did nothing or just maintained

I think dutasteride simply did nothing for you and that this is simply your natural hairloss because I cannot fathom how something like dutasteride is supposed to accelerate hairloss.

 

[NoDiggity30]

There is no cure for baldness, and science doesn't even know exactly what causes it. So in my eyes, every hair loss study should be taken with a bucket of salt. There are weird and obscure treatments which have shown promise (e.g. microneedling/saw palmetto/castor oil) which no one can prove or disprove. dutasteride falls under that category. I don't believe one product works for everyone and can infact be a massive hindrance to some people due to their genetic make up.
I have not seen even a single anecdotal post of someone who was losing ground on finasteride, so took dutasteride and recovered loads of hair. Happy to be proven wrong but it sounds like BS for me. If finasteride didn't work, dutasteride certainly won't.

 

[Reciprocity]

The mechanism of action for dutasteride is the same as finasteride. I don't know how you can lump it together with stuff like castor oil.

 

[Caillou]

I think dutasteride simply did nothing for you and that this is simply your natural hairloss because I cannot fathom how something like dutasteride is supposed to accelerate hairloss.

f*****g bullshit, you don't lose 60% of your hair in 2 months through male pattern baldness

The denial on these forums about this kind of reaction to treatments is laughable