Is Oral Minoxidil really worth the hair it gives you?

[Norwoody]

I just started oral castor oil so I reserve comment on that but people like Norwoody that I respect think it might help and it is cheap and healthful. Just watch the blow-outs--you really have to watch the dosage. I thought that my body might adapt more but definitely ~15ml has been too much for me gastrically.

SO true. I had a blowout a week ago because I used two teaspoons instead of the usual one lol. I would advise anyone to start out at something like 2-3mL and then you can titrate up from there.

 

[JaneyElizabeth]

Ah yes, I forgot about keto.

I don't think keto is a big deal unless a person has access to nothing else. I think it primarily works by lowering inflammation by decreasing the accumulation of yeast by-products on the scalp. Like many things, if it works for you, you notice it and I didn't notice much but it was always used in the shadow of finasteride/min.

 

[Isneezedsohard]

I think that is the dream protocol for a cis-guy. If you want to be obsessive, you could add Keto two percent and/or a sulfur-based shampoo, and start using retin-A on your hairline and any thin spots plus under the eyes to prevent minoxidil eye syndrome or whatever one calls it, if it exists.

I recommend against AA's like spironolactone for basically everybody. If someone wants to use an AA, then I recommend reductase inhibitors like you are already using, or medroxyprogesterone acetate or provera, which lowers testosterone much more straightforwardly than do medications like spironolactone, cyproterone acetate or bicalutamide. The latter three have a variety of side-effects and might be more feminizing and strength-debilitating than estrogen without anything comparable to the same hair benefits of estrogens.

I just started oral castor oil so I reserve comment on that but people like Norwoody that I respect think it might help and it is cheap and healthful. Just watch the blow-outs--you really have to watch the dosage. I thought that my body might adapt more but definitely ~15ml has been too much for me gastrically.

Yeah-- ive had crazy shits on oral castor oil. Stuff is no joke.

 

[Isneezedsohard]

You are all so helpful! It's nice finding a community that is so supportive!

 

[Norwoody]

Additionally, I do think castor oil can work well topically, perhaps even better IMO, but for me it wasn't worth it because it's practically impossible to wash out. Ended up causing a few pimples on the scalp because of that. Hair quality did seem to improve though.

 

[Norwoody]

I don't think keto is a big deal unless a person has access to nothing else. I think it primarily works by lowering inflammation by decreasing the accumulation of yeast by-products on the scalp. Like many things, if it works for you, you notice it and I didn't notice much but it was always used in the shadow of finasteride/min.

I agree. I've questioned it. I've went off and on and I don't think it makes much of a difference other than controlling scalp oil and itch. I've been using it right after needling though and it seems to work much better when timed up like that. Instead of a few hours of decreased oil and itch, it turns into 1-2 days of protection for me in the past few weeks.

 

[JaneyElizabeth]

Additionally, I do think castor oil can work well topically, perhaps even better IMO, but for me it wasn't worth it because it's practically impossible to wash out. Ended up causing a few pimples on the scalp because of that. Hair quality did seem to improve though.

I tried it topically also and it reminded me very much of polysorbate 80 in terms of consistency but even harder to wash out. It is difficult to wash off and even get off your hands. I wouldn't want to sleep in it because it is too messy although I used to sleep with polysorbate 80 in at times.

 

[Norwoody]

Yeah I think it would work best if small amounts were mixed into a carrier like KB or PG. Fluridil has grapeseed oil in it but it's not greasy at all because it's such a small amount.

 

[JaneyElizabeth]

You are all so helpful! It's nice finding a community that is so supportive!

Hey, that day before my 20th birthday when I first noticed the incipient bald spot so high on my crown as to be invisible from the front, it just floored me. I knew at that moment that my life was over as I had lived it and had expected to continue living it and it was horrible. I also remember the feeling of helplessness in that back then, nothing helped, not exercise, biotin, diet, massage, you name it.

I don't want anyone to feel that pain if it's avoidable. It's like they say. It's even worse in a sense for those who had great juvenile hair that we treasured even beyond the fear of losing it. My identity was wrapped up in my hair and for those who grew up in the wake of the Beatles, hair became even more huge as an aspect of our lives to fret over yes but also to take joy in. I loved my hair and trans or not, I am still an XY and I get the pain. It's a brotherhood.

 

[Isneezedsohard]

Hey, that day before my 20th birthday when I first noticed the incipient bald spot so high on my crown as to be invisible from the front, it just floored me. I knew at that moment that my life was over as I had lived it and had expected to continue living it and it was horrible. I also remember the feeling of helplessness in that back then, nothing helped, not exercise, biotin, diet, massage, you name it.

I don't want anyone to feel that pain if it's avoidable. It's like they say. It's even worse in a sense for those who had great juvenile hair that we treasured even beyond the fear of losing it. My identity was wrapped up in my hair and for those who grew up in the wake of the Beatles, hair became even more huge as an aspect of our lives to fret over yes but also to take joy in. I loved my hair and trans or not, I am still an XY and I get the pain. It's a brotherhood.

Were you just pretty much boned in the 80's if you lost your hair?

 

[JaneyElizabeth]

Were you just pretty much boned in the 80's if you lost your hair?

Man, I was looking into the hair club at 20 and that was pretty bleak. I have posted on my thread about how something called polysorbate 60/80 saved me from despair and gave me hope. I had already looked into getting a prescription for estrogen and got rejected by the doctor and ended up finding the polysorbates on late night infomercials. They got shut down by the FDA later, these companies but these products worked really well to slow hair loss so luckily I had that and that restored some of my confidence and helped with the feeling of powerlessness. Rubbing something into our heads has therapeutic benefits on its own even beyond the massage benefits because it is similar to exercise or other ritual that provides control.

 

[Isneezedsohard]

Woof. I can't imagine what things will look like in another 20-30 years. I'll bet well look back and think "I cant believe we were doing XYZ"

 

[JaneyElizabeth]

Woof. I can't imagine what things will look like in another 20-30 years. I'll bet well look back and think "I cant believe we were doing XYZ"

I hesitate to say because so much of this is hormonally-based for whites and much of it might be on a hair-trigger, making it difficult to find non-hormonal solutions which is why oral minoxidil is such a big deal. I continue to think though, that without the estrogenic skin effects, that for older people, significant hair restoration that is cosmetically significant also is going to be challenging. I doubt that many people will be able to experience the joy of a female/juvenile hairline without estrogen as they move away from their teen years. People mention hair count all of the time but increased time in anagen might be the most important change/improvement.

We also have to remember that baldness is not a disease for white males but really rather is a sort of joint function in which beard growth commences and increases and scalp hair growth decreases, almost in unison during the mid to late teens.

 

[Isneezedsohard]

I hesitate to say because so much of this is hormonally-based for whites and much of it might be on a hair-trigger, making it difficult to find non-hormonal solutions which is why oral minoxidil is such a big deal. I continue to think though, that without the estrogenic skin effects, that for older people, significant hair restoration that is cosmetically significant also is going to be challenging. I doubt that many people will be able to experience the joy of a female/juvenile hairline without estrogen as they move away from their teen years. People mention hair count all of the time but increased time in anagen might be the most important change/improvement.

We also have to remember that baldness is not a disease for white males but really rather is a sort of joint function in which beard growth commences and increases and scalp hair growth decreases, almost in unison during the mid to late teens.

Genes are such a b**ch. All the dudes on my dads side are bald. Like... slick bald. It's annoying having to fight against your own damn DNA

 

[Norwoody]

People mention hair count all of the time but increased time in anagen might be the most important change/improvement.

Spot on. This is why I suggested on another thread somewhere that minoxidil can be also used as a "maintenance drug". Naturally I was scoffed at lol.

 

[Isneezedsohard]

Spot on. This is why I suggested on another thread somewhere that minoxidil can be also used as a "maintenance drug". Naturally I was scoffed at lol.

Damn... I think I gotta hop on oral min. I gotta convince a Doctor tho lol. I'm not trying to order from Thailand or whatever. That sh*t sketches me out

 

[-Synergy-]

Good luck getting anything over 2mg from a doctor. The highest I was able to get was 1mg.

Thinking the other day about hair, treatments, and the best way to organize stuff. I realized that while taking 0.25mg oral minoxidil I started having slight troubles breathing after 2 weeks. However, I have been microneedling my scalp to a depth of 0.5mm to 1mm and applying minoxidil. After a month of microneedling + minoxidil I feel no sides at all. I’m using Kirkland foam melted down to liquid btw. Could it really be possible that less than 0.25mg topical minoxidil is going systemic? It has to be if I’m not having sides?

 

[BetaBoy]

After a month of microneedling + minoxidil I feel no sides at all

Because you aren't going to get anywhere near the same level of sulfurylation from what is effectively IV administered minoxidil vs first pass oral administration.

 

[Derelict]

Good luck getting anything over 2mg from a doctor. The highest I was able to get was 1mg.

Thinking the other day about hair, treatments, and the best way to organize stuff. I realized that while taking 0.25mg oral minoxidil I started having slight troubles breathing after 2 weeks. However, I have been microneedling my scalp to a depth of 0.5mm to 1mm and applying minoxidil. After a month of microneedling + minoxidil I feel no sides at all. I’m using Kirkland foam melted down to liquid btw. Could it really be possible that less than 0.25mg topical minoxidil is going systemic? It has to be if I’m not having sides?

Such low dosages are meant for women not men, find another doctor or order online, from 5 to 10mg is the optimal dosage for men suffering from hair loss, study showed 5mg to be superior and well tolerated compared to 2.5mg etc.

 

[Norwoody]

It all helps, so even if you can only get 1mg I'd say it's worth it. Could combine it with topical+derma and work real well.

As far as the effectiveness of certain dosages, of course it's going to be dependent on a lot of things. But if I were to make a general tier:

maintenance / step up from topical: about 2.5mg or less
chance of noticeable regrowth: about 5mg minimum
temporary blast phases / aggressive balding: 10mg or more