Italian Hair Loss Lotion To Hit The Market In 2016
- Thread starter paleocapa89
- Start date
There seems to be a lot of confusion here about DHT but most of this info is here with a little searching, but I'ill try to address two points here.
Firstly, regarding systemic DHT inhibition from taking topical S-Equol, yes it can happen but you have to look at the numbers. For example a 5% monixodil solution is 50mg per application, the new topical finasteride people where going on about a while back was something like 20mg if I recall correctly. However the amounts that actually get absorbed into the skin is a very small fraction of what is applied and the systemic amount a fraction of that fraction. So the 0.25mg of S-equol per application as described in the patent is really small with the amount that goes systemic is going to be really small also.
Secondly, about DHT level in blood serum, scalp etc. Note that DHT and T are present in non-balding hair follicles, in a balding follicles DHT is elevated around 200% and T reduced by 50% or so and DHT in scalp hair is also around 200% of normal.
Now finasteride will reduce blood serum DHT to 30% and but scalp DHT levels drop to around 100% of normal, why is that? Because your hair follicle is generating 5aR that converts T->DHT and it seems that Finasteride can not stop T->DHT in the follicle, which I know to many seasoned contributors is quite controversial.
The logic behind this is that your scalp DHT should drop to serum DHT levels if Finasteride was doing it's job completely, however as the your own hair follicles are still producing DHT your scalp DHT only goes down to the normal level.
For most people this will be enough to stop or slow down balding, however Finasteride does this by not tackling the root cause of follicle 5ar production but by decimating your blood DHT levels there by reducing the overall DHT that attaches to the AR receptor in your hair. It is also the reason why topical finasteride has to go systemic for results.
Now, getting back to S-Equol. S-Equol inhibits DHT by attaching itself to the molecule so that it cant fit onto the androgen receptor. The hope is, that whilst 5ar inhibitors do not seem to work in the follicle, S-Equol may stop the resulting DHT produced inside the DP cells in the follicle from attaching to the androgen receptor. If this is the case then it could explain why only 0.25mg is required.
Firstly, regarding systemic DHT inhibition from taking topical S-Equol, yes it can happen but you have to look at the numbers. For example a 5% monixodil solution is 50mg per application, the new topical finasteride people where going on about a while back was something like 20mg if I recall correctly. However the amounts that actually get absorbed into the skin is a very small fraction of what is applied and the systemic amount a fraction of that fraction. So the 0.25mg of S-equol per application as described in the patent is really small with the amount that goes systemic is going to be really small also.
Secondly, about DHT level in blood serum, scalp etc. Note that DHT and T are present in non-balding hair follicles, in a balding follicles DHT is elevated around 200% and T reduced by 50% or so and DHT in scalp hair is also around 200% of normal.
Now finasteride will reduce blood serum DHT to 30% and but scalp DHT levels drop to around 100% of normal, why is that? Because your hair follicle is generating 5aR that converts T->DHT and it seems that Finasteride can not stop T->DHT in the follicle, which I know to many seasoned contributors is quite controversial.
The logic behind this is that your scalp DHT should drop to serum DHT levels if Finasteride was doing it's job completely, however as the your own hair follicles are still producing DHT your scalp DHT only goes down to the normal level.
For most people this will be enough to stop or slow down balding, however Finasteride does this by not tackling the root cause of follicle 5ar production but by decimating your blood DHT levels there by reducing the overall DHT that attaches to the AR receptor in your hair. It is also the reason why topical finasteride has to go systemic for results.
Now, getting back to S-Equol. S-Equol inhibits DHT by attaching itself to the molecule so that it cant fit onto the androgen receptor. The hope is, that whilst 5ar inhibitors do not seem to work in the follicle, S-Equol may stop the resulting DHT produced inside the DP cells in the follicle from attaching to the androgen receptor. If this is the case then it could explain why only 0.25mg is required.
- Reaction score
- 217
I've read that FIDIA's patent again. And it seems to me that the liposomal delivery is a main key.
'The present invention overcomes the limits of the state of the art through liposome formulations containing PGE1 precursors stable at room temperature, storable in a liquid, semi-solid or solid form, directly applicable without preventive preparation and absolutely free of any kind of side effect related to the use of an actual drug. Clinical trials that were carried out further demonstrated a surprisingly higher efficacy of the products described herein in comparison with what is known, so as to make their use possible at concentrations markedly lower than those of already known products.'
'The present invention overcomes the limits of the state of the art through liposome formulations containing PGE1 precursors stable at room temperature, storable in a liquid, semi-solid or solid form, directly applicable without preventive preparation and absolutely free of any kind of side effect related to the use of an actual drug. Clinical trials that were carried out further demonstrated a surprisingly higher efficacy of the products described herein in comparison with what is known, so as to make their use possible at concentrations markedly lower than those of already known products.'
resu
Senior Member
- Reaction score
- 1,345
The sides should be less pronounced maybe since S-Equol is blocking the DHT in the bloodstream from binding into the receptors versus inhibiting 5ar from converting testosterone to DHT which is what finasteride does. In the future we could switch S-Equol to CB and not worry about sexual side effects.
Guys, apparently there's feedback from some participants in the trials.
Can anyone speaking Italian translate this?
Allora ragazzi vi aggiorno io: Se volete vedere queste notizie andate su facebook e cliccate nome Jole Serreli (mi raccomando non rompetele le scatole perchè si è già lamentata che molti l'hanno aggiunta o mandato messaggi e vuole essere lasciata in pace). la conversazione risale al 30 luglio e vi cito le frasi più importanti :
"I capelli rasati ... Sono tantissimi vi risparmio la foto"
" La lozione Fidia è più efficiente della lozione Brotzu. Sicuramente sono stati fatti degli accorgimenti importanti
ora vediamo se spuntano robusti "
uno chiede l'uscita del prodotto FIDIA e lei risponde "Mi hanno detto 2017 tenete duro ! Ne varrà la pena"
Uno dice così"Grazie seu gentilissima a darci gli aggiornamenti, quindi direi che funziona su tutte le alopecie" e lei risponde "Io ci credo ! L ho cercato è arrivato ! Io non mi sono arresa ! Noi alopecia universale abbiamo diritto a una cura !"
"Ma vi rendete conto ? 5 anni che non vedo tanti peli"
Uno le chiede perchè stia parlando di una lozione di FIDIA quando lui sapeva che usava la lozione Brotzu e lei risponde "La lozione che ora mi ha consegnato Prof Brotzu è stata creata in laboratorio dall'azienda !"
Uno le chiede di ternerlo aggiornato e lei risponde "Ci siamo Quasi ...
sarai informato su tutto "
MI RACCOMANDO NON CONTATTATELA PERCHE' DA QUELLO CHE HO CAPITO L'HANNO DISTURBATA TROPPO
fate come me e andate di tanto in tanto sul suo profilo che lei parlando con i suoi amici aggiorna la sua situazione
Can anyone speaking Italian translate this?
Allora ragazzi vi aggiorno io: Se volete vedere queste notizie andate su facebook e cliccate nome Jole Serreli (mi raccomando non rompetele le scatole perchè si è già lamentata che molti l'hanno aggiunta o mandato messaggi e vuole essere lasciata in pace). la conversazione risale al 30 luglio e vi cito le frasi più importanti :
"I capelli rasati ... Sono tantissimi vi risparmio la foto"
" La lozione Fidia è più efficiente della lozione Brotzu. Sicuramente sono stati fatti degli accorgimenti importanti
uno chiede l'uscita del prodotto FIDIA e lei risponde "Mi hanno detto 2017 tenete duro ! Ne varrà la pena"
Uno dice così"Grazie seu gentilissima a darci gli aggiornamenti, quindi direi che funziona su tutte le alopecie" e lei risponde "Io ci credo ! L ho cercato è arrivato ! Io non mi sono arresa ! Noi alopecia universale abbiamo diritto a una cura !"
"Ma vi rendete conto ? 5 anni che non vedo tanti peli"
Uno le chiede perchè stia parlando di una lozione di FIDIA quando lui sapeva che usava la lozione Brotzu e lei risponde "La lozione che ora mi ha consegnato Prof Brotzu è stata creata in laboratorio dall'azienda !"
Uno le chiede di ternerlo aggiornato e lei risponde "Ci siamo Quasi ...
MI RACCOMANDO NON CONTATTATELA PERCHE' DA QUELLO CHE HO CAPITO L'HANNO DISTURBATA TROPPO
fate come me e andate di tanto in tanto sul suo profilo che lei parlando con i suoi amici aggiorna la sua situazione
Then I'll update you guys: If you want to see this news go to facebook and click name Jole Serreli (Do not break them because the boxes have already complained that many have added or sent messages and wants to be left alone). the conversation goes back to July 30, and I quote the most important sentences:
"I shaved hair ... the photo I'll spare you lots"
"The Fidia lotion is more efficient than Brotzu lotion. Definitely have been made of the important measures Now let's see if sprouting robust"
one asks the output of the product FIDIA and she replies "I was told in 2017 hold on! It will be worth"
One says so "Thanks seu gracious in giving us updates, so I would say that it works on all alopecia" and she answers, "I believe! L I tried is here! I do not I surrendered! We alopecia universalis have a right to a cure! "
"Do you realize? 5 years since I saw many hairs"
One asks why he's talking about a lotion FIDIA when he knew that he used the Brotzu lotion and she replies "The lotion which now handed me Prof Brotzu was created in the laboratory by the company!"
One of the updated and she asks to keep it going responds "We Almost ... [IMG] will be informed on everything"
MI recommend NOT Contact her WHY 'FROM WHAT I UNDERSTAND THEY DISTURBED TOO
do like me from time to time and go on his profile she talking to her friends updates its situation
Just used google translate so it's a little rough
but I'm even more excited for this!
"I shaved hair ... the photo I'll spare you lots"
"The Fidia lotion is more efficient than Brotzu lotion. Definitely have been made of the important measures Now let's see if sprouting robust"
one asks the output of the product FIDIA and she replies "I was told in 2017 hold on! It will be worth"
One says so "Thanks seu gracious in giving us updates, so I would say that it works on all alopecia" and she answers, "I believe! L I tried is here! I do not I surrendered! We alopecia universalis have a right to a cure! "
"Do you realize? 5 years since I saw many hairs"
One asks why he's talking about a lotion FIDIA when he knew that he used the Brotzu lotion and she replies "The lotion which now handed me Prof Brotzu was created in the laboratory by the company!"
One of the updated and she asks to keep it going responds "We Almost ... [IMG] will be informed on everything"
MI recommend NOT Contact her WHY 'FROM WHAT I UNDERSTAND THEY DISTURBED TOO
do like me from time to time and go on his profile she talking to her friends updates its situation
Just used google translate so it's a little rough
but I'm even more excited for this!
- Reaction score
- 27
Younger guys get ready for some big news soon. #hopeful
What about Guys over 30 who still have a lot of hair...
With 1 or 2 years of regrowth I'd be more than happy, would be a cure for me.
I'm sure it will still work, if he's saying 5 years regrowth for guys under 30 I'm sure you could get 1-2 years at least. He only said it works best for guys under 30 it could still work well for you if you haven't lost/been losing hair for long.
I don't get this age thing anyway? Shouldn't balding at a younger age, which is mostly more aggressive be harder to treat? Or are follicles dying faster when balding occurs later? I don'T get it?
Me, I held my hair for 15 years with finasteride, but took a hit this year. Hope this gets me back to where I was.
Btw, this Jole Serelli is also 40 years old. So it's not only working for the superyoung, at least for AA.
Me, I held my hair for 15 years with finasteride, but took a hit this year. Hope this gets me back to where I was.
Btw, this Jole Serelli is also 40 years old. So it's not only working for the superyoung, at least for AA.
- Reaction score
- 270
ya it's hard to read and it sounds like she's saying it's working well, and I think better than what Brotzu was reporting. and that it will be here 2017!
Flamingflaps
Established Member
- Reaction score
- -10
Haha. What happens when you turn 30 for this not to work anymore? It's a little bit silly. I turned 30 this year - I must be screwed. If only this lotion came out a year earlier!
You could be a 25 year old guy who's been losing hair rapidly since 18, or 35 year old guy with very slow male pattern baldness and in the very early stages. Who would do better on the treatment then? These guesstimates also don't take into consideration past treatment profiles.
You could be a 25 year old guy who's been losing hair rapidly since 18, or 35 year old guy with very slow male pattern baldness and in the very early stages. Who would do better on the treatment then? These guesstimates also don't take into consideration past treatment profiles.
Well when you're young that means you haven't been balding for long so your follicles can be saved before they "die". It even seems that younger guys respond better to min and even finasteride as well (although that could just be my observation).
Also he has never said it won't work for guys over 30, just that it will work better for guys under 30 and they can expect the best results.
That's what I was thinking. I always thought that regrowth is determined by the state of the follicles not the point in life the begin to fall.
You can go from full head of hair at 20 to bald at 25. On the other hand, my dad has been loosing hair for 30 years and he's still got hair left.
- Reaction score
- 270
So is brotzu and fida similar ? When fida releasd ? Is fida what shes on
It's the same lotion, maybe fidia just has better equipment/better quality ingredients that caused a slight improvement but who knows. and yes this is supposed to be someone from fidias trial
Someone should send this lady a few questions on behalf of this forum without mentioning her by name (on here). It's possible she could give us more information about the male Androgenetic Alopecia trial participants and how they are faring.
