hair mchair
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cosmo gene said:
Sounds like a good idea. Where do you get these tribulus formulations? You have a website link?
Long Term Side Effects
- Thread starter agbulk
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Sounds like a good idea. Where do you get these tribulus formulations? You have a website link?
These are the contents of tribestan
Tribulus Terrestris Extract: 250mg
Microcell: 193mg
Cabosil(Aerosil): 100mg
Polyplasdone XL(Crospovidon): 40m
Polyvinylpyrrolidone: 30mg
Talc: 12mg
Film Coating: 10mg
Magnesium Stearate: 5mg
Is there anything present here that will decrease your estrogen content?
Company swears it does decrease excess estrogen
If Tribestan is so powerful and increases your own testosterone production, does it aromatize? Can you get "gyno" from taking it?
Absolutely not. In fact, the opposite is true. Tribestan may normalize estrogen levels in the body. If your estrogen levels are too high, it will decrease them to normal levels. And if they are too low, Tribestan will raise them to normal levels. Most people are leery of heightened estrogen levels, but if they are too low they can go into a catabolic state more easily.
Tribulus Terrestris Extract: 250mg
Microcell: 193mg
Cabosil(Aerosil): 100mg
Polyplasdone XL(Crospovidon): 40m
Polyvinylpyrrolidone: 30mg
Talc: 12mg
Film Coating: 10mg
Magnesium Stearate: 5mg
Is there anything present here that will decrease your estrogen content?
Company swears it does decrease excess estrogen
If Tribestan is so powerful and increases your own testosterone production, does it aromatize? Can you get "gyno" from taking it?
Absolutely not. In fact, the opposite is true. Tribestan may normalize estrogen levels in the body. If your estrogen levels are too high, it will decrease them to normal levels. And if they are too low, Tribestan will raise them to normal levels. Most people are leery of heightened estrogen levels, but if they are too low they can go into a catabolic state more easily.
Trilidon
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Clomiphene(Clomid) and tampoxiphen citrate (Nolvadex) and Anastrozole(Arimidex) - here are some descriptions for you guys. I did a ton of research so im ready when I go to my urologist or endo also did research on reversing this stupid problem, which the younger you are seems hopeful.
--Clomid--
by Bill Roberts - Clomid is the anti-estrogen of choice for improving recovery of natural testosterone production after a cycle, improving testosterone production of endurance athletes, and is also effective in reducing risk of gynecomastia during a cycle employing aromatizable steroids.
While it has been claimed that Clomid "stimulates" production of LH and therefore of testosterone, in fact Clomid’s activity is achieved not by stimulation of the hypothalamus and pituitary, but by blocking their inhibition by estrogen.
Clomid is a mixed estrogen agonist/antagonist (activator/blocker) which, when bound to the estrogen receptor, puts it in a somewhat different conformation (shape) than does estradiol. The estrogen receptor requires binding of an estrogen or drug at its binding site and also the binding of any of several cofactors at different sites. Without the binding of the cofactor, the estrogen receptor is inactive. Different tissues use different cofactors. Some of these cofactors are able to bind to the estrogen receptor/Clomid complex, but others are blocked due to the change in shape. The result is that in some tissues Clomid acts as an antagonist -- the cofactor used in that tissue cannot bind and so the receptor remains inactive -- and in others Clomid acts as an agonist (activator), because the cofactors used in that tissue are able to bind.
Clomid is an effective antagonist in the hypothalamus and in breast tissue. It is an effective agonist in bone tissue, and for improving blood cholesterol.
Clomid also has the property of reducing the adverse effect of exercise-induced damage of muscle tissue. This is very significant for endurance athletes but is not very significant, if at all significant, with reasonable weight training. Clomid does not perceptibly affect gains of the weight trainer either favorably or adversely in my experience.
The drug seems to have estrogenic effects on mood, which can be beneficial (improving relationships with women by improving empathy) or can yield depression or PMS-like symptoms, but for most users there is no significant effect either way.
The claim that duration of intake should not exceed 10-14 days is incorrect. Clinical studies with male patients have been for periods of a year or longer. This error probably originates from the fact that, for use in women, due to the menstrual cycle there would obviously be no point in trying to stimulate ovulation all four weeks of the month. Thus, use in women is limited to 10-14 days. That limitation is not because of toxicity.
Clomid is in fact useful throughout a cycle if aromatizable drugs are being used. I do think however that to be conservative, one should use it no more than 2/3 of the time throughout the year or a little less.
--Nolvadex--
by Bill Roberts - Nolvadex is very comparable to Clomid, behaves in the same manner in all tissues, and is a mixed estrogen agonist/antagonist of the same type as Clomid. The two molecules are also very similar in structure.
It is not correct that Nolvadex reduces levels of estrogen: rather, it blocks estrogen from estrogen receptors and, in those tissues where it is an antagonist, causes the receptor to do nothing.
The claim that Nolvadex reduces gains should not be taken too seriously. The fact is that any number of bodybuilders have made excellent gains while using Nolvadex. The belief that it reduces gains seems to stem from the fact that the scientific literature reports a slight reduction in IGF-1 (individuals using anabolic steroids were not studied though) from use of Nolvadex. Thus, Dan Duchaine reported that it reduces IGF-1 and therefore reduces gains. However, if this effect exists at all, it must be very minor, due to the excellent gains that many have made, and from the fact that no one has noticed any such thing from Clomid, which has the same activity profile.
However, I would not be surprised if one were to tell a steroid user that Clomid reduced his gains, he would immediately become afraid that Clomid reduced his gains (please note that no one I have ever heard of has noticed this.) Not having been so misled, however, he would not conclude this from his results. But if an authority publishes that such an effect occurs, whether it does or not it can become self-fulfilling by biasing the user.
The fact that Nolvadex will reduce water retention may result in the user agreeing that gains are less, since weight gain is less, thus reinforcing the bias.
Anastrozole(Arimidex)
by Bill Roberts - Anastrozole (Arimidex) is the aromatase inhibitor of choice. The drug is appropriately used when using substantial amounts of aromatizing steroids, or when one is prone to gynecomastia and using moderate amounts of such steroids. Arimidex does not have the side effects of aminoglutethimide (Cytadren) and can achieve a high degree of estrogen blockade, much moreso than Cytadren. It is possible to reduce estrogen too much with Arimidex, and for this reason blood tests, or less preferably salivary tests, should be taken after the first week of use to determine if the dosing is correct.
As an aromatase inhibitor, Arimidex's mechanism of action -- blocking conversion of aromatizable steroids to estrogen -- is in contrast to the mechanism of action of anti-estrogens such as clomiphene (Clomid) or tamoxifen (Nolvadex), which block estrogen receptors in some tissues, and activate estrogen receptors in others. During a cycle, if using Arimidex, there is generally no need to use Clomid as well, but (as mentioned in the section on Clomid) there may still be benefits to doing so.
Arimidex is quite expensive, costing approximately $9 per milligram. With moderate doses of testosterone 0.5 mg/day is usually sufficient and in some cases may be too much.
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Anyway, once they find the cause of your hormone problem, IF its secondary hypogonadism they might be able to jumpstart your testes basically..
They do this using clomid and HCG(Human Chorionic Gonadrotropin)
HCG basically has the same effect on your body as LH which tells the testes to start making more testosterone.
Just a thought... the " average" for testosterone is rather low considering it takes into account elderly men and 500lb couch potatos, if its around 400 or 450 and your not 60, something isnt right in my opinion.
If the Impotence is estrogen related I think nolvadex would probably work better then clomid, it frees up receptor sites better then clomid, is cheaper, no vision side effects, and has smaller doses.
yep, anyway, its early, so if I said something stupid sorry =P
--Clomid--
by Bill Roberts - Clomid is the anti-estrogen of choice for improving recovery of natural testosterone production after a cycle, improving testosterone production of endurance athletes, and is also effective in reducing risk of gynecomastia during a cycle employing aromatizable steroids.
While it has been claimed that Clomid "stimulates" production of LH and therefore of testosterone, in fact Clomid’s activity is achieved not by stimulation of the hypothalamus and pituitary, but by blocking their inhibition by estrogen.
Clomid is a mixed estrogen agonist/antagonist (activator/blocker) which, when bound to the estrogen receptor, puts it in a somewhat different conformation (shape) than does estradiol. The estrogen receptor requires binding of an estrogen or drug at its binding site and also the binding of any of several cofactors at different sites. Without the binding of the cofactor, the estrogen receptor is inactive. Different tissues use different cofactors. Some of these cofactors are able to bind to the estrogen receptor/Clomid complex, but others are blocked due to the change in shape. The result is that in some tissues Clomid acts as an antagonist -- the cofactor used in that tissue cannot bind and so the receptor remains inactive -- and in others Clomid acts as an agonist (activator), because the cofactors used in that tissue are able to bind.
Clomid is an effective antagonist in the hypothalamus and in breast tissue. It is an effective agonist in bone tissue, and for improving blood cholesterol.
Clomid also has the property of reducing the adverse effect of exercise-induced damage of muscle tissue. This is very significant for endurance athletes but is not very significant, if at all significant, with reasonable weight training. Clomid does not perceptibly affect gains of the weight trainer either favorably or adversely in my experience.
The drug seems to have estrogenic effects on mood, which can be beneficial (improving relationships with women by improving empathy) or can yield depression or PMS-like symptoms, but for most users there is no significant effect either way.
The claim that duration of intake should not exceed 10-14 days is incorrect. Clinical studies with male patients have been for periods of a year or longer. This error probably originates from the fact that, for use in women, due to the menstrual cycle there would obviously be no point in trying to stimulate ovulation all four weeks of the month. Thus, use in women is limited to 10-14 days. That limitation is not because of toxicity.
Clomid is in fact useful throughout a cycle if aromatizable drugs are being used. I do think however that to be conservative, one should use it no more than 2/3 of the time throughout the year or a little less.
--Nolvadex--
by Bill Roberts - Nolvadex is very comparable to Clomid, behaves in the same manner in all tissues, and is a mixed estrogen agonist/antagonist of the same type as Clomid. The two molecules are also very similar in structure.
It is not correct that Nolvadex reduces levels of estrogen: rather, it blocks estrogen from estrogen receptors and, in those tissues where it is an antagonist, causes the receptor to do nothing.
The claim that Nolvadex reduces gains should not be taken too seriously. The fact is that any number of bodybuilders have made excellent gains while using Nolvadex. The belief that it reduces gains seems to stem from the fact that the scientific literature reports a slight reduction in IGF-1 (individuals using anabolic steroids were not studied though) from use of Nolvadex. Thus, Dan Duchaine reported that it reduces IGF-1 and therefore reduces gains. However, if this effect exists at all, it must be very minor, due to the excellent gains that many have made, and from the fact that no one has noticed any such thing from Clomid, which has the same activity profile.
However, I would not be surprised if one were to tell a steroid user that Clomid reduced his gains, he would immediately become afraid that Clomid reduced his gains (please note that no one I have ever heard of has noticed this.) Not having been so misled, however, he would not conclude this from his results. But if an authority publishes that such an effect occurs, whether it does or not it can become self-fulfilling by biasing the user.
The fact that Nolvadex will reduce water retention may result in the user agreeing that gains are less, since weight gain is less, thus reinforcing the bias.
Anastrozole(Arimidex)
by Bill Roberts - Anastrozole (Arimidex) is the aromatase inhibitor of choice. The drug is appropriately used when using substantial amounts of aromatizing steroids, or when one is prone to gynecomastia and using moderate amounts of such steroids. Arimidex does not have the side effects of aminoglutethimide (Cytadren) and can achieve a high degree of estrogen blockade, much moreso than Cytadren. It is possible to reduce estrogen too much with Arimidex, and for this reason blood tests, or less preferably salivary tests, should be taken after the first week of use to determine if the dosing is correct.
As an aromatase inhibitor, Arimidex's mechanism of action -- blocking conversion of aromatizable steroids to estrogen -- is in contrast to the mechanism of action of anti-estrogens such as clomiphene (Clomid) or tamoxifen (Nolvadex), which block estrogen receptors in some tissues, and activate estrogen receptors in others. During a cycle, if using Arimidex, there is generally no need to use Clomid as well, but (as mentioned in the section on Clomid) there may still be benefits to doing so.
Arimidex is quite expensive, costing approximately $9 per milligram. With moderate doses of testosterone 0.5 mg/day is usually sufficient and in some cases may be too much.
------------------------------------------------------------------
Anyway, once they find the cause of your hormone problem, IF its secondary hypogonadism they might be able to jumpstart your testes basically..
They do this using clomid and HCG(Human Chorionic Gonadrotropin)
HCG basically has the same effect on your body as LH which tells the testes to start making more testosterone.
Just a thought... the " average" for testosterone is rather low considering it takes into account elderly men and 500lb couch potatos, if its around 400 or 450 and your not 60, something isnt right in my opinion.
If the Impotence is estrogen related I think nolvadex would probably work better then clomid, it frees up receptor sites better then clomid, is cheaper, no vision side effects, and has smaller doses.
yep, anyway, its early, so if I said something stupid sorry =P
I'd been on finasteride 1.25mg/day for about 3 years. The side effects came on very gradually and I was single for a long time too so didn't notice anything wrong.
Thanks for the info on reducing estrogen, now all I've got to do is convince a doctor to let me try these meds. Most doctors don't even understand that estrogen has an effect on libido or potency!
Thanks for the info on reducing estrogen, now all I've got to do is convince a doctor to let me try these meds. Most doctors don't even understand that estrogen has an effect on libido or potency!