TheLastHairbender's story
- Thread starter TheLastHairbender
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TheLastHairbender
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Thanks guys! There is hair growing all over the vertex now too where it was nearly slick bald before. They aren't the white downy hair suggested by minoxidil either, but average sized dark hairs about 1/2 inch long...not sure if I just missed them in the fuzzy stage or if the minoxidil hasn't done its job yet and this is all from the finasteride. If I could absolutely confirm that was the case then I'd be tempted to drop the minoxidil and just maintain on finasteride...I'd prefer not to exchange healthy hair for 'minoxidil hair' that I need to constantly apply that crap to maintain. But since I can't tell for sure I'll just keep doing what I'm doing, no point in blundering good results. Can't wait for my three month update at the end of this month!
TheLastHairbender said:
CONGRATS ON THE GROWTH!!
was wondering how I can follow in that success
here is my story
viewtopic.php?f=61&t=68094
look forward to your help. cheers.
TheLastHairbender
Established Member
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Hey everyone! It’s time for my 3 month update and boy do I have good news! It has been a hair explosion for me over the past month, primarily within the past three weeks (from month 2.25 - 3). I could not be any happier!!! I already have thicker hairs than I've ever had in my life...not as thick of total coverage, but looking at each individual strand they are strong, thick, and dark. Even in my mid-teens I had weak, thin hairs. After 2-3 months on finasteride all of my hairs appear to be much stronger and thicker than they've ever been, plus the coverage is improving so I'm truly ecstatic. Without further ado:
Three Month Update
Date: 08/24/2011
Topics: Pictures, Frontal Minoxidil Update, Spironolactone Update, Ketoconazole 2%
I typically like to give the descriptive information about changes to my regimen first, but I'm just so damn excited to post pictures let's get right into it. And my apologies for not cropping out the loo this time, no time to waste editing pics now that I have hair!!!!
Pictures
Six, from back to front, with flash-off:
Six more, back-to-front, with flash-on:
And two of the temples:
EDIT: wtf? My temple pics got deleted from my picasa somehow, and the backups are lost via an unrelated dropbox fail. Oops! They weren't that impressive anway, the temples are lagging the crown and vertex but I only started applying minoxidil there within the past month. Hopefully they'll catch up but in the meatime I'm looking for any ideas or anecdotes about growth at the temples, so chime in if you have anything to say about that!
I mean I am really happy. I'm sorry to gloat in front of many of you struggling with hair loss, but I cannot tell you how great it feels to respond positively to treatment. It feels amazing to look in a mirror and see more hair than I ever remember having. I honestly feel like my male pattern baldness is not even an issue anymore and I don’t feel inhibited by hair loss one bit now that I’m at a point where my hair loss pattern could be considered normal for someone at 26.
Cost:
And I can’t believe how inexpensive it has been to get to this point! There are so many expensive hair loss treatments out there that you wouldn’t believe how inexpensively it has been to generate these results. I’ve been summing my total costs for hair loss products to date and would you believe that I got these results for under $100? Finasteride over these 3 months was $18, spironolactone $32, minoxidil $40, and nizoral $9. $99 total. It’s freaking unbelievable. And all of which is available at Wal-Mart. I can see the banner ad now: How I cured my hairloss in 3 months for under $100 with things I got at Wal-Mart. I bet 99% of people would write it off as a hoax but it’s completely freaking true (actually I got the finasteride from ASU pharmacy but I could have gotten it at walmart and I might next time just to say I did).
Speed of growth:
My hair is definitely growing faster too. I have been on a regular monthly haircut schedule and I’m getting past the usual point of haircut a week or two before the appt. Perhaps it’s the MSM, as this is a known property. It’s actually a bit counterproductive, as I look better with short hair and more haircuts just means more inconvenience and more money. If I knew I could cut the MSM without jeopardizing my results I probably would, but at this point I’m not taking any chances.
Sheds:
It’s a bit interesting because I still haven’t had a shed! As I’ve noted I completely stopped shedding hair months before I decided to get on treatment. During age 24-25 I was on no treatments and shedding aggressively, hundreds of hairs every day. I work on the computer and every hour I’d have to blow dozens of hairs off my keyboard and desk. Every two weeks I’d have to clean where the carpet meets the wall in my bedroom and office because so much shed hair would accumulate there…even worse than any girl’s place I’ve ever seen. But that had all stopped about six months before I started treatment. Seriously, nothing. Nothing on my keyboard, my floor, my pillow, in the shower, on my towel, I could even really ruffle my hair aggressively and only see one or two hairs come out. The shedding had completely stopped and hasn’t started up again since I’ve been on treatments. Perhaps there is a tiny bit more shedding, sometimes I’ll see one or two hairs in the sink after I wet my hair and scalp to apply minoxidil, but nothing like what others here have described as a shed. I actually don’t mind seeing those few hairs in there at all either, they are so damn thick and dark now that it actually feels great seeing them compared to the tiny wisps of fuzz I’d see before that were practically indistinguishable from cat hair.
Just to note exactly everything I’ve been doing over the past three months:
And that’s it! At least we know there is something in there growing hair…and I think we all know what it is. It’s just so counterintuitive but true…so many people think that some tonic or tincture or natural remedy applied topically will somehow stimulate hair follicles and make them start growing. It’s a classic proximity-to-problem issue in healthcare – laypeople believe that any solution must come close in proximity to the problem. When actually it’s a hormone regulator that works internally over a period of months to deliver the desired result. It just runs contrary to what so many apothecaries would have you believe, and is really a testament to science over folklore. Although there are historical examples of folk remedies outperforming the then-state-of-the-art technologies in certain areas, I believe that hair loss in the present day is not one of those examples.
More informative updates:
I should note first that on 8/4 I upped my biotin intake to 5mg/day, as I’ve read about many people in Europe using this exclusively as a treatment for male pattern baldness. I was taking 1.5mg in the AM, 2mg mid-day, and 1.5mg at night, but I recently picked up 5mg capsules for cheaper so I’ll now just take one of those at mid-day. I also added one more fish oil pill at mid-day with the biotin for a total intake of 900mg total EPA/DHA, closer to the typical 1g/day. I’m now totally comfortable with the supplement intake: daily multivitamin, 900mg EPA/DHA fish oil, 5mg biotin, 3g MSM. Efficient, effective, inexpensive.
Frontal Minoxidil Update
As I noted since last month, I’ve taken Captain Combover’s suggestion to start applying minoxidil all over my thinning areas, which includes the very top and temples. It definitely uses a lot more product, I’ve been going through a can in 2-3 weeks rather than a full month, but an extra $7.50 a month is a small price to pay for better results.
I should note that I could definitely feel it the first few times I increased the application. I had been generally side-effect free on everything until I started lathering my head with minoxidil. I could feel it in my face and eyes, not a stinging from direct contact but a puffiness and swelling from the inside out. It’s definitely a characteristic feeling that’s easy to recall but hard to describe. One night it was really bad and I could feel it throughout my whole body, I had a shortness of breath, hypotension, arrhythmia, and maybe even a slight myocardial infarction…I could hardly stay standing and got dizzy very easily. I had to lay down in bed and could hardly move until I fell asleep a few minutes later. I had told my girlfriend to keep an eye on me because I ‘suddenly felt very sick’ (she doesn’t know I’m on any treatments – or at least doesn’t let on that she does, which is more likely because I reek of minoxidil every morning and night). In retrospect I was lathering the Rogaine Foam on too generously and have been able to reduce the amount I use while still getting all-over coverage. It was a bit of a scare but a gentle reminder that after 3 months without side effects I’m still not superhuman, and it’s even a bit reassuring to know exactly where my limits are, which will help my decisions in the future.
Spironolactone Update
Next, I want to say that I actually really, really like the spironolactone. Even if it didn’t have any physiological effect at all it’s something very gentle and I can do it frequently whenever I feel like doing something for my hair, which gives me a positive boost of attitude and makes me feel like there’s something continually at work. Since last month I’ve been applying it religiously twice a day and on a few occasions throwing some on mid-day if I know I’m just going to be around the house. I’ve actually gotten really good at styling my hair using just spironolactone. It’s about the consistency of American Crew Forming Cream and after it dries for about an hour I can style my hair exactly the same as using forming cream, so I’ve actually been able to eliminate that product from my cabinet at a savings of $20 every three months or so. So spironolactone is total win for me – blocks DHT, includes Retin-A, feels good, and is actually a great styling aid!
Ketoconazole 2%
Before I noticed that I was having such great results I was thinking of other ways to kick my regimen in the butt. One simple one was to switch up to 2% ketoconazole shampoo as many around here use. Anything above 1% requires a prescription here in the US, but luckily I have a great relationship with my doctor. I’m going to be a 'doctor' myself in six months (research Ph.D., nothing exciting) so he is comfortable writing me a prescription for anything I email him about and leaving it at the pharmacy, very convenient. I picked up a bottle of 2% keto shampoo (expensive, $20 for 4 oz!) by Perrigo and have planned to start using it after posting this update, so as to keep additions to the regimen easy to track over time. I don’t expect much to change, but why not push the keto shampoo to the max? I’ll let you guys know how it goes.
Ok this thing is going over 5 pages in Word so it’s time to wrap it up. I was going to post about the Retin-A cream and Folligen spray I just picked up but I’ll save that post, and their implementation, for a later date. I just want to include as much relevant information as I can for those who stumble across this searching for answers. I remember the late nights I’d spend 6-8 hours reading old posts on HairLossTalk.com and just wishing that people were more descriptive about the little things. Hopefully I can include enough complete information in this thread to save you time searching for every little thing that pops into your head as it did mine. That said, still use search!
Abhi - I still don't see your story posted yet! Get it up there so you're accountable to all of us for continuing your regimen. For me the things that have helped me fight hairloss outside of the meds are:
Ahmeda - Thanks so much for the kind words, and I'm truly honored you asked for help replicating these results. You've been at it awhile so I should rightly be taking advice from you. I've replied to your thread and encourage you to try out topical spironolactone to support the faltering finasteride at blocking DHT. I’m happy to answer any questions you have to the best of my limited ability.
Thanks again everyone for looking! Hopefully you too can go from this:
to this:
Three Month Update
Date: 08/24/2011
Topics: Pictures, Frontal Minoxidil Update, Spironolactone Update, Ketoconazole 2%
I typically like to give the descriptive information about changes to my regimen first, but I'm just so damn excited to post pictures let's get right into it. And my apologies for not cropping out the loo this time, no time to waste editing pics now that I have hair!!!!
Pictures
Six, from back to front, with flash-off:
Six more, back-to-front, with flash-on:
And two of the temples:
EDIT: wtf? My temple pics got deleted from my picasa somehow, and the backups are lost via an unrelated dropbox fail. Oops! They weren't that impressive anway, the temples are lagging the crown and vertex but I only started applying minoxidil there within the past month. Hopefully they'll catch up but in the meatime I'm looking for any ideas or anecdotes about growth at the temples, so chime in if you have anything to say about that!
I mean I am really happy. I'm sorry to gloat in front of many of you struggling with hair loss, but I cannot tell you how great it feels to respond positively to treatment. It feels amazing to look in a mirror and see more hair than I ever remember having. I honestly feel like my male pattern baldness is not even an issue anymore and I don’t feel inhibited by hair loss one bit now that I’m at a point where my hair loss pattern could be considered normal for someone at 26.
Cost:
And I can’t believe how inexpensive it has been to get to this point! There are so many expensive hair loss treatments out there that you wouldn’t believe how inexpensively it has been to generate these results. I’ve been summing my total costs for hair loss products to date and would you believe that I got these results for under $100? Finasteride over these 3 months was $18, spironolactone $32, minoxidil $40, and nizoral $9. $99 total. It’s freaking unbelievable. And all of which is available at Wal-Mart. I can see the banner ad now: How I cured my hairloss in 3 months for under $100 with things I got at Wal-Mart. I bet 99% of people would write it off as a hoax but it’s completely freaking true (actually I got the finasteride from ASU pharmacy but I could have gotten it at walmart and I might next time just to say I did).
Speed of growth:
My hair is definitely growing faster too. I have been on a regular monthly haircut schedule and I’m getting past the usual point of haircut a week or two before the appt. Perhaps it’s the MSM, as this is a known property. It’s actually a bit counterproductive, as I look better with short hair and more haircuts just means more inconvenience and more money. If I knew I could cut the MSM without jeopardizing my results I probably would, but at this point I’m not taking any chances.
Sheds:
It’s a bit interesting because I still haven’t had a shed! As I’ve noted I completely stopped shedding hair months before I decided to get on treatment. During age 24-25 I was on no treatments and shedding aggressively, hundreds of hairs every day. I work on the computer and every hour I’d have to blow dozens of hairs off my keyboard and desk. Every two weeks I’d have to clean where the carpet meets the wall in my bedroom and office because so much shed hair would accumulate there…even worse than any girl’s place I’ve ever seen. But that had all stopped about six months before I started treatment. Seriously, nothing. Nothing on my keyboard, my floor, my pillow, in the shower, on my towel, I could even really ruffle my hair aggressively and only see one or two hairs come out. The shedding had completely stopped and hasn’t started up again since I’ve been on treatments. Perhaps there is a tiny bit more shedding, sometimes I’ll see one or two hairs in the sink after I wet my hair and scalp to apply minoxidil, but nothing like what others here have described as a shed. I actually don’t mind seeing those few hairs in there at all either, they are so damn thick and dark now that it actually feels great seeing them compared to the tiny wisps of fuzz I’d see before that were practically indistinguishable from cat hair.
Just to note exactly everything I’ve been doing over the past three months:
Daily multivitamin, 600mg Omega-3s, 1mg biotin, 3mg MSM added halfway
1.25 mg finasteride – ¼ generic proscar every morning
5% Rogaine Foam every morning and night
5% Spironolactone – every night for first two months, morning and night since
1% Nizoral shampoo 2-4 times a week
And that’s it! At least we know there is something in there growing hair…and I think we all know what it is. It’s just so counterintuitive but true…so many people think that some tonic or tincture or natural remedy applied topically will somehow stimulate hair follicles and make them start growing. It’s a classic proximity-to-problem issue in healthcare – laypeople believe that any solution must come close in proximity to the problem. When actually it’s a hormone regulator that works internally over a period of months to deliver the desired result. It just runs contrary to what so many apothecaries would have you believe, and is really a testament to science over folklore. Although there are historical examples of folk remedies outperforming the then-state-of-the-art technologies in certain areas, I believe that hair loss in the present day is not one of those examples.
More informative updates:
I should note first that on 8/4 I upped my biotin intake to 5mg/day, as I’ve read about many people in Europe using this exclusively as a treatment for male pattern baldness. I was taking 1.5mg in the AM, 2mg mid-day, and 1.5mg at night, but I recently picked up 5mg capsules for cheaper so I’ll now just take one of those at mid-day. I also added one more fish oil pill at mid-day with the biotin for a total intake of 900mg total EPA/DHA, closer to the typical 1g/day. I’m now totally comfortable with the supplement intake: daily multivitamin, 900mg EPA/DHA fish oil, 5mg biotin, 3g MSM. Efficient, effective, inexpensive.
Frontal Minoxidil Update
As I noted since last month, I’ve taken Captain Combover’s suggestion to start applying minoxidil all over my thinning areas, which includes the very top and temples. It definitely uses a lot more product, I’ve been going through a can in 2-3 weeks rather than a full month, but an extra $7.50 a month is a small price to pay for better results.
I should note that I could definitely feel it the first few times I increased the application. I had been generally side-effect free on everything until I started lathering my head with minoxidil. I could feel it in my face and eyes, not a stinging from direct contact but a puffiness and swelling from the inside out. It’s definitely a characteristic feeling that’s easy to recall but hard to describe. One night it was really bad and I could feel it throughout my whole body, I had a shortness of breath, hypotension, arrhythmia, and maybe even a slight myocardial infarction…I could hardly stay standing and got dizzy very easily. I had to lay down in bed and could hardly move until I fell asleep a few minutes later. I had told my girlfriend to keep an eye on me because I ‘suddenly felt very sick’ (she doesn’t know I’m on any treatments – or at least doesn’t let on that she does, which is more likely because I reek of minoxidil every morning and night). In retrospect I was lathering the Rogaine Foam on too generously and have been able to reduce the amount I use while still getting all-over coverage. It was a bit of a scare but a gentle reminder that after 3 months without side effects I’m still not superhuman, and it’s even a bit reassuring to know exactly where my limits are, which will help my decisions in the future.
Spironolactone Update
Next, I want to say that I actually really, really like the spironolactone. Even if it didn’t have any physiological effect at all it’s something very gentle and I can do it frequently whenever I feel like doing something for my hair, which gives me a positive boost of attitude and makes me feel like there’s something continually at work. Since last month I’ve been applying it religiously twice a day and on a few occasions throwing some on mid-day if I know I’m just going to be around the house. I’ve actually gotten really good at styling my hair using just spironolactone. It’s about the consistency of American Crew Forming Cream and after it dries for about an hour I can style my hair exactly the same as using forming cream, so I’ve actually been able to eliminate that product from my cabinet at a savings of $20 every three months or so. So spironolactone is total win for me – blocks DHT, includes Retin-A, feels good, and is actually a great styling aid!
Ketoconazole 2%
Before I noticed that I was having such great results I was thinking of other ways to kick my regimen in the butt. One simple one was to switch up to 2% ketoconazole shampoo as many around here use. Anything above 1% requires a prescription here in the US, but luckily I have a great relationship with my doctor. I’m going to be a 'doctor' myself in six months (research Ph.D., nothing exciting) so he is comfortable writing me a prescription for anything I email him about and leaving it at the pharmacy, very convenient. I picked up a bottle of 2% keto shampoo (expensive, $20 for 4 oz!) by Perrigo and have planned to start using it after posting this update, so as to keep additions to the regimen easy to track over time. I don’t expect much to change, but why not push the keto shampoo to the max? I’ll let you guys know how it goes.
Ok this thing is going over 5 pages in Word so it’s time to wrap it up. I was going to post about the Retin-A cream and Folligen spray I just picked up but I’ll save that post, and their implementation, for a later date. I just want to include as much relevant information as I can for those who stumble across this searching for answers. I remember the late nights I’d spend 6-8 hours reading old posts on HairLossTalk.com and just wishing that people were more descriptive about the little things. Hopefully I can include enough complete information in this thread to save you time searching for every little thing that pops into your head as it did mine. That said, still use search!
Abhi - I still don't see your story posted yet! Get it up there so you're accountable to all of us for continuing your regimen. For me the things that have helped me fight hairloss outside of the meds are:
Desire
HairLossTalk.com
Willpower
Ahmeda - Thanks so much for the kind words, and I'm truly honored you asked for help replicating these results. You've been at it awhile so I should rightly be taking advice from you. I've replied to your thread and encourage you to try out topical spironolactone to support the faltering finasteride at blocking DHT. I’m happy to answer any questions you have to the best of my limited ability.
Thanks again everyone for looking! Hopefully you too can go from this:
to this:
Hoi Thelasthairbender,
First of all, thats amazing success !!!!!! I absolutely admire the way you have planned and executed your regimen so successfully. Hats off to you.
The best part is that you have documented it so extensively that anyone like me, searching for help can find all the answers in your story.
Here is the link to my story
viewtopic.php?f=28&t=68260
Please suggest what do you think about my regimen. People are suggesting that it might be too late for me, but i feel its worth a shot.
On a different note, u spreekt nederlands ?
Met vriendelijke groet,
Abhi.
First of all, thats amazing success !!!!!! I absolutely admire the way you have planned and executed your regimen so successfully. Hats off to you.
The best part is that you have documented it so extensively that anyone like me, searching for help can find all the answers in your story.
Here is the link to my story
viewtopic.php?f=28&t=68260
Please suggest what do you think about my regimen. People are suggesting that it might be too late for me, but i feel its worth a shot.
On a different note, u spreekt nederlands ?
Met vriendelijke groet,
Abhi.
THFC2011
New Member
- Reaction score
- 0
Congratulations, that is some amazing regrowth in such a short space of time. Whatever your doing don't stop because it's certainly working. :bravo:
I have a question for you about finasteride. Have you had any side effects so far from it? Also did you wean onto it or did you just start taking it every day?
I'm asking because I'm considering taking the plunge and getting on finasteride myself but the potential side effects terrify me. The last thing I need is getting ED and low libido to compound the rest of my problems.
I have a question for you about finasteride. Have you had any side effects so far from it? Also did you wean onto it or did you just start taking it every day?
I'm asking because I'm considering taking the plunge and getting on finasteride myself but the potential side effects terrify me. The last thing I need is getting ED and low libido to compound the rest of my problems.
TheLastHairbender
Established Member
- Reaction score
- 5
Thanks guys for all the positive encouragement. You're right, it definitely feels great.
THFC - my experience with finasteride has been extremely positive to date. I haven't suffered any side effects. I had a slight ache in one teste for several hours on one day, and can very rarely feel a momentary dull sensation in that same teste, once every two weeks maybe, but I wouldn't consider that 'suffering' from side effects, and can't attribute it directly to the finasteride either. In fact it has been quite the opposite of suffering: I have never loved taking a pill so much.
Now I'm not going to tell you to start taking finasteride. I leave open the possibility that there is something sinister taking place in the background that isn't immediately perceptible, and I don't want to be responsible for giving bad advice if that comes to light afterward, but for those of us willing to take that chance to save and recover our hair - it feels freaking great to have something that works!
Regarding the sexual side effects - well I'm not trying to have kids in the next ten years so the reported decrease in semen volume doesn't really bother me, that could even be viewed as a benefit. And your concerns about ED and low libido? In my case it has been quite the opposite. All I have to do is look in the mirror or think about my hair. I don't know how you could possibly have low libido when seeing yourself with a full head of hair. I have been sexually turbocharged since noticing such improvements, and noting that my newfound hair may be temporary and short-lived, I'm doing everything I can to maximize its value while it lasts. Low libido? They must be kidding.
The only sexual side effect I've suffered from finasteride is that there's only one of me to go around.
Your profile notes that you've had sebhorreic dermatitis - maybe you should look into Aminexil. It has been reported to clear up that condition with six weeks of use every six months. It's a bit expensive - about $150 for the six week treatment, but has been shown in the EU to successfully treat SD. I might give that a try before jumping on finasteride, which, like you've noted, may not help if your hair loss isn't male pattern baldness related, I really just don't know. Finding the best treatment plan for your particular hair loss will take a bit more research. Unfortunately it's not an area where I have any particular expertise.
Best wishes either way and keep us posted with the results of anything you try. It will help the next guy who comes along with your condition find the optimal treatment plan. Thanks for reading, good luck!
And thanks to the rest of you as well, more updates coming soon, I can't wait to see what month #4 brings.
THFC - my experience with finasteride has been extremely positive to date. I haven't suffered any side effects. I had a slight ache in one teste for several hours on one day, and can very rarely feel a momentary dull sensation in that same teste, once every two weeks maybe, but I wouldn't consider that 'suffering' from side effects, and can't attribute it directly to the finasteride either. In fact it has been quite the opposite of suffering: I have never loved taking a pill so much.
Now I'm not going to tell you to start taking finasteride. I leave open the possibility that there is something sinister taking place in the background that isn't immediately perceptible, and I don't want to be responsible for giving bad advice if that comes to light afterward, but for those of us willing to take that chance to save and recover our hair - it feels freaking great to have something that works!
Regarding the sexual side effects - well I'm not trying to have kids in the next ten years so the reported decrease in semen volume doesn't really bother me, that could even be viewed as a benefit. And your concerns about ED and low libido? In my case it has been quite the opposite. All I have to do is look in the mirror or think about my hair. I don't know how you could possibly have low libido when seeing yourself with a full head of hair. I have been sexually turbocharged since noticing such improvements, and noting that my newfound hair may be temporary and short-lived, I'm doing everything I can to maximize its value while it lasts. Low libido? They must be kidding.
The only sexual side effect I've suffered from finasteride is that there's only one of me to go around.
Your profile notes that you've had sebhorreic dermatitis - maybe you should look into Aminexil. It has been reported to clear up that condition with six weeks of use every six months. It's a bit expensive - about $150 for the six week treatment, but has been shown in the EU to successfully treat SD. I might give that a try before jumping on finasteride, which, like you've noted, may not help if your hair loss isn't male pattern baldness related, I really just don't know. Finding the best treatment plan for your particular hair loss will take a bit more research. Unfortunately it's not an area where I have any particular expertise.
Best wishes either way and keep us posted with the results of anything you try. It will help the next guy who comes along with your condition find the optimal treatment plan. Thanks for reading, good luck!
And thanks to the rest of you as well, more updates coming soon, I can't wait to see what month #4 brings.
I'm not kidding, the second I saw your most recent pictures I said "oh my god" out loud. Truly shocked at how much hair you've grown back. Congrats I truly mean that. I'm going to stick with my current regimen for the next couple of months before I see some regrowth with the big 3, but you've inspired me to add MSM and spironolactone at some time down the road (probably when my hair is thick enough so that I don't get the wet looking effect making my hair look thin when I apply it).
ps congrats on the PhD, what is your area of research?
ps congrats on the PhD, what is your area of research?
TheLastHairbender
Established Member
- Reaction score
- 5
hugeleap said:
Thanks so much hugeleap!!! It's great to hear, and I'm very glad to have the chance to provide information and possibly some hope to other guys with male pattern baldness. I mean I was getting really bad - and if I can have life-changing results like these in only 3 months, then the hairline-obsessed NW2's out there should be very reassured by what the big 3 can do (I say that with love for you lucky bastards!)
I think the main thing in my case is that although I was pretty deep into NW5 I hadn't been there very long. I started treatment within a year of the major natural shed that wiped out most of the hair between the crown and the forelock. That visible scalp in the middle of the upside-down "Y" shaped area hadn't been visible for very long, which I believe contributed to the treatments quickly gaining the traction to reverse course on male pattern baldness. It's a testament to the fact that the sooner you get on treatment, at least with respect to the anti-androgens, the better your chances for achieving good results.
For your treatment plan:
I'm a strong advocate for the spironolactone. Many people will say, 'yeah, spironolactone, maybe it does a little something but it's not finasteride or minoxidil'. They're right - it is not finasteride or minoxidil, but you can get 9 months' worth for under $90, so for less than $10/month, if it does anything at all it's probably worth it. I just like the feeling now, it's cool and refreshing, and gives my hair just the right amount of tackiness to be style-able. I haven't found it to give a wet, thin look like you described, it's closer to the consistency of pudding. Melted rogaine foam, on the other hand, does turn my hair into that sloppy wet mess for 30 minutes though.
Regarding the MSM, I really don't know what to say. I'm taking it and I'm growing hair so it's hard to put down, but it's growing really fast now, faster than I can keep up with on haircuts. If there's one thing I wish I could cut and keep the results it would be the MSM - it's a huge pill to take twice a day, makes the hair grow out really fast, to the point of making it look worse most of the time, and is actually kinda expensive for use as a secondary supplement at about $15/month. But noting the possibility that the MSM provides a spark to transition hairs into the anagen phase, I won't risk cutting it out at this point.
It may also be worth noting that the results did start improving almost immediately upon switching up from 1mg biotin to 5mg biotin a day, spaced out 1.5mg in the AM, 2mg afternoon, and 1.5mg PM. This was right at about 2 1/4 months into finasteride and minoxidil though, so the coincidental timing of benefits from those things may just be making the biotin look good. Either way, with the ease of just taking a pill and for about $5/month, the biotin stays at 5mg.
Stick with it buddy, you're going to love seeing that head start filling in this fall!
TheLastHairbender
Established Member
- Reaction score
- 5
I also just wanted to put in a quick plug for a new thread I just created to pick my next treatment. Basically I have Retin-A and Folligen on standby, and I'm not sure which to integrate first. Explained inside:
viewtopic.php?f=11&t=68433&p=640622#p640622
I'd love to hear what you guys think, I'll seriously consider your input when making the decision, and of course keep you posted with the outcome and progress here. Thanks!
viewtopic.php?f=11&t=68433&p=640622#p640622
I'd love to hear what you guys think, I'll seriously consider your input when making the decision, and of course keep you posted with the outcome and progress here. Thanks!
T
TravisB
Guest
HairBender, congrats for your results, that's great regrowth in a short time! With this speed, in a year or two you could be few levels back on the Norwood scale. I see you see a sh*tload of treatments (minoxidil, finasteride, Retin-A, spironolactone, Copper Peptides).
Question for everyone - do you think finasteride itself (without minoxidil) can give regrowthlike that? Did someone have big success with finasteride only?
Question for everyone - do you think finasteride itself (without minoxidil) can give regrowthlike that? Did someone have big success with finasteride only?
TheLastHairbender
Established Member
- Reaction score
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For what it's worth, I do believe finasteride is responsible for most of the improvement. I say that because I have had noticeable gains in areas where I had only been applying minoxidil for two-to-three weeks, directly behind the forelock for example. So my belief is that you can have good results without minoxidil, especially if your goal is merely to maintain, rather than add, hair.
But why not use a ketoconazole shampoo too? It's a simple addition that has a lot of support among success stories. If you have dry scalp or some condition that prevents you from using a keto shampoo, then I would still be more comfortable using finasteride alone than nothing, just keep in mind that you're looking for maintenance of your existing hair. You really can't expect to do much better than that without a growth promoter like minoxidil, and probably shouldn't expect to do much better anyway - regrowth is just a bonus. A really, really, really nice bonus.
But why not use a ketoconazole shampoo too? It's a simple addition that has a lot of support among success stories. If you have dry scalp or some condition that prevents you from using a keto shampoo, then I would still be more comfortable using finasteride alone than nothing, just keep in mind that you're looking for maintenance of your existing hair. You really can't expect to do much better than that without a growth promoter like minoxidil, and probably shouldn't expect to do much better anyway - regrowth is just a bonus. A really, really, really nice bonus.
Thanks for the reply it means a lot.
I'm heading back to uni tomorrow and will be taking all my hair loss stuff with me (nizoral, minoxidil, finasteride) so I'll wait to add anything else until the winter break and I'm back home. I'm glad you've kinda warned me about the MSM. The problem I get is when the hair on the sides of my head grows faster than the top and it ends up looking ridiculous and puffed. I feel like MSM will only add to that issue. I'm more willing to try the biotin if you say its been helping with the thickness and overall quality of your hair. I'm also going to start the spironolactone at winter break, more for my hairline, as I think it will give me an additional boost.
As for your hair you seem like you've done a huge amount of reading on the subject already so it would be rather frivolous to offer any suggestions. I will say though that I'm excited to see how everything looks at the 4 month mark, after you get your latest haircut and hopefully the new hair has evened out with the old hair at that time. Your results thus far are impressive to say the least! Good job dude!
Until the next update...
I'm heading back to uni tomorrow and will be taking all my hair loss stuff with me (nizoral, minoxidil, finasteride) so I'll wait to add anything else until the winter break and I'm back home. I'm glad you've kinda warned me about the MSM. The problem I get is when the hair on the sides of my head grows faster than the top and it ends up looking ridiculous and puffed. I feel like MSM will only add to that issue. I'm more willing to try the biotin if you say its been helping with the thickness and overall quality of your hair. I'm also going to start the spironolactone at winter break, more for my hairline, as I think it will give me an additional boost.
As for your hair you seem like you've done a huge amount of reading on the subject already so it would be rather frivolous to offer any suggestions. I will say though that I'm excited to see how everything looks at the 4 month mark, after you get your latest haircut and hopefully the new hair has evened out with the old hair at that time. Your results thus far are impressive to say the least! Good job dude!
Until the next update...
TheLastHairbender
Established Member
- Reaction score
- 5
Hey hugeleap, thanks so much for staying in touch. I actually just got that haircut yesterday and man, does it ever look great, just like a normal head of hair with some recession at the temples. What a far cry from the tiny wisp of hair on top I had just as recently as June. I'll try to take some pics in the next few days.
It's a good thing you're taking the big 3 back to school with you. It's a bit of a pain to apply the topicals every morning and night, but I've found that once you build it into your lifestyle it isn't so bad. And once you start seeing improvement then it becomes total non-issue.
You've described my feelings on MSM precisely. I have the exact same problem you describe:
Mine too - the horseshoe around the hair loss area just seems to grow thicker and faster than the rest of the hair, making it look much worse by comparison. This was an issue even before hair loss, the hair on top has just never grown with the same speed and thickness as it does where the top meets the sides. I've wanted to negotiate something with my haircut-guy to come in every two weeks, in between full haircuts, just to trim this area down. I can't say for sure, but it sure seems like the MSM has exacerbated this issue. It could be the finasteride making it grow more quickly too so I hesitate to draw universal conclusions from one point observation in which multiple treatments were used, but for whatever reason I have the indication that it's the MSM. Making hair grow longer more quickly is a well-known property of the stuff. The problem is that even if I was sure it was the MSM, I couldn't be sure the MSM wasn't having other positive effects as well, like increasing the anagen/telogen ratio, in which case I'd be happy to deal with the rapid lengthening. It's a tough choice to make. If you're as desperate for results as I was, and don't mind spending another $10-$20/month on a supplement known to have stimulating properties on hair and which is thought to be good for your joints too then I'd say go for it.
The biotin comes highly recommended though, as does the spironolactone. I just switched to one 5mg biotin pill once a day as the price was much lower, but I have to say I preferred taking three smaller doses throughout the day. It's generally better to take water-soluble vitamins more frequently in lower doses (theoretical support), plus I saw the most aggressive regrowth when taking it spread over three doses (empirical support). You know I love spironolactone too, just remember it's thought to be a long-term maintenance thing rather than a quick improvement thing, but I've had such quick results that I just don't know - it may have more near term benefits than people give it credit for.
Details aside, you're doing it as well as you possibly can. Stick to the plan, don't miss any doses, and continue taking regular pics and learning more about additional options for long-term growth and maintenance. I'm currently neck-deep in the copper peptide debate in looking for another angle to supplement my existing treatments. I'm excited to write at length about what I've found and how I'll be integrating a product with this technology into my regimen (although I haven't quite settled on exactly which product that's going to be: Tricomin, Folligen, Proxiphen-N, or a custom AHK-Cu solution.)
Thanks again for the support and for staying in touch, good luck at Uni this semester, keep us posted!
It's a good thing you're taking the big 3 back to school with you. It's a bit of a pain to apply the topicals every morning and night, but I've found that once you build it into your lifestyle it isn't so bad. And once you start seeing improvement then it becomes total non-issue.
You've described my feelings on MSM precisely. I have the exact same problem you describe:
Mine too - the horseshoe around the hair loss area just seems to grow thicker and faster than the rest of the hair, making it look much worse by comparison. This was an issue even before hair loss, the hair on top has just never grown with the same speed and thickness as it does where the top meets the sides. I've wanted to negotiate something with my haircut-guy to come in every two weeks, in between full haircuts, just to trim this area down. I can't say for sure, but it sure seems like the MSM has exacerbated this issue. It could be the finasteride making it grow more quickly too so I hesitate to draw universal conclusions from one point observation in which multiple treatments were used, but for whatever reason I have the indication that it's the MSM. Making hair grow longer more quickly is a well-known property of the stuff. The problem is that even if I was sure it was the MSM, I couldn't be sure the MSM wasn't having other positive effects as well, like increasing the anagen/telogen ratio, in which case I'd be happy to deal with the rapid lengthening. It's a tough choice to make. If you're as desperate for results as I was, and don't mind spending another $10-$20/month on a supplement known to have stimulating properties on hair and which is thought to be good for your joints too then I'd say go for it.
The biotin comes highly recommended though, as does the spironolactone. I just switched to one 5mg biotin pill once a day as the price was much lower, but I have to say I preferred taking three smaller doses throughout the day. It's generally better to take water-soluble vitamins more frequently in lower doses (theoretical support), plus I saw the most aggressive regrowth when taking it spread over three doses (empirical support). You know I love spironolactone too, just remember it's thought to be a long-term maintenance thing rather than a quick improvement thing, but I've had such quick results that I just don't know - it may have more near term benefits than people give it credit for.
Details aside, you're doing it as well as you possibly can. Stick to the plan, don't miss any doses, and continue taking regular pics and learning more about additional options for long-term growth and maintenance. I'm currently neck-deep in the copper peptide debate in looking for another angle to supplement my existing treatments. I'm excited to write at length about what I've found and how I'll be integrating a product with this technology into my regimen (although I haven't quite settled on exactly which product that's going to be: Tricomin, Folligen, Proxiphen-N, or a custom AHK-Cu solution.)
Thanks again for the support and for staying in touch, good luck at Uni this semester, keep us posted!
TheLastHairbender
Established Member
- Reaction score
- 5
Thanks Capt. I give you a lot of credit for the results I've had in front, and I've been noting as much all around the board. Without your intervention I would probably still be applying it only to the crown.
Whether the regrowth is finasteride or minoxidil I guess I really can't say. I'm just glad that one of the two (or both) is working! It does seem that I either skipped or failed to notice the vellus hair stage, as the new growth is definitely more terminal than vellus. Then again I have only noticed new growth starting at about 5mm, I never saw any stubbly terminal hairs sprouting, so the actual mechanics of it remain a mystery to me. I'm going to try to temper my desire to recklessly say it's one thing or another, as this experiment hasn't been conducted scientifically enough to make such a distinction.
For those of you reading this, all I can say confidently is that some combination of finasteride, minoxidil, keto shampoo, topical spironolactone, multivitamin, Omega-3s, biotin, and MSM have generated results for me.
Thanks again Capt. for the great advice and the constant moral support!
Whether the regrowth is finasteride or minoxidil I guess I really can't say. I'm just glad that one of the two (or both) is working! It does seem that I either skipped or failed to notice the vellus hair stage, as the new growth is definitely more terminal than vellus. Then again I have only noticed new growth starting at about 5mm, I never saw any stubbly terminal hairs sprouting, so the actual mechanics of it remain a mystery to me. I'm going to try to temper my desire to recklessly say it's one thing or another, as this experiment hasn't been conducted scientifically enough to make such a distinction.
For those of you reading this, all I can say confidently is that some combination of finasteride, minoxidil, keto shampoo, topical spironolactone, multivitamin, Omega-3s, biotin, and MSM have generated results for me.
Thanks again Capt. for the great advice and the constant moral support!
rwhairlosstalk
Experienced Member
- Reaction score
- 13
Way To Go! Great success! Don't stop keep it up!
