Time To Give Up On Everything

[kawnshawn]

I've tried it all man. CRTH2 antagonists in particular (OC,Seti, TM) only work in 2/3rds of the population due to genetics. We see this in smaller percentage for Finasteride also. For most people, dutasteride+RU should be enough. People in the hair loss community will say that those two together will halt Androgenetic Alopecia. But it completely depends on the individuals response to these drugs. I'm guessing a lot of it is genetic and comes down to phenotype variations, as we can see with studies on Finasteride and Setipiprant. dutasteride may also be a stronger 5AR inhibitor but it will also work for more genetic variations. But there will still be a select few that don't respond at all - to any hairloss drug.

Of course, you can go down the spironolactone/CypA road. Maybe even topical Enzalutamide rather than RU. But that's the point where you are pretty much guaranteed feminizing/anti-androgen side effects. Then you truly have to question whether you value your hair above your health.

Hey Dench, do you have a source about CRTH2 antagonist and finasteride only working in a certain amount of the population due to genetics? Might explain a lot for my situation

 

[Wolf Pack]

Glad your getting good advice, very tough. On a side note I would say it doesn't matter about shedding frequency. You want to take regular pictures with similar lighting, hair length to determine progression.

 

[Clearingout]

There has to be something else Buck,
That's why I starting trying to research into RU58841.
It's meant to be such a powerful anti-androgen that people use 20mg and it works for them. You and I are in the high range dosages with what we've been using.

Don't give up man, there will be something that will help.
How did the stemoxydine go?

 

[jgray201]

I genuinely believe that you need to give it more time, especially since you have added and mixed around with treatments as this always has the potential to cause shedding. But its incredibly difficult to see so many hairs falling and do nothing. You could try adding a CRTH2 antagonist, you could try OC as this is something that dissolves really well in neogenic. I have been using this for close to 6 months now. You may also feel a bit better knowing that you are covering more bases and it might be easier to stick on a regimen for say a year.

 

[abcdefg]

IMO once you start a new treatment you shouldnt even be on here until the 1 year mark minimum maybe even 1 and half. The stuff takes a long long time to work. You cant pop propecia and after 4 days say it made your hair worse and toss it in the garbage. Im sure some people do, but its silly. 6 months isnt enough time you could be in the middle of a shed which explains the huge amounts of hairs, and then it gets better hopefully months later. You have to just have faith your doing all you can, but it works in terms of years not days or weeks.

 

[buckthorn]

IMO once you start a new treatment you shouldnt even be on here until the 1 year mark minimum maybe even 1 and half. The stuff takes a long long time to work. You cant pop propecia and after 4 days say it made your hair worse and toss it in the garbage. Im sure some people do, but its silly. 6 months isnt enough time you could be in the middle of a shed which explains the huge amounts of hairs, and then it gets better hopefully months later. You have to just have faith your doing all you can, but it works in terms of years not days or weeks.

thanks man, I was on finasteride for an entire year. I lost about half of what I had left within that time. I have been on RU five months, and if it wasn't for the fact that I carry a similar perspective as you, I would have dropped it within one month. I don't think it's working because I am having horrible scalp sensations, burning, crawling, etc... and still losing a ton of hair. I think it's reasonable to expect a reduction in shedding by this point... but, nothing. Still very excessive shedding and serious hair loss.

 

[Afro_Vacancy]

thanks man, I was on finasteride for an entire year. I lost about half of what I had left within that time. I have been on RU five months, and if it wasn't for the fact that I carry a similar perspective as you, I would have dropped it within one month. I don't think it's working because I am having horrible scalp sensations, burning, crawling, etc... and still losing a ton of hair. I think it's reasonable to expect a reduction in shedding by this point... but, nothing. Still very excessive shedding and serious hair loss.

I'm honestly curious if someone like yourself, with very severe scalp itch, can get a reduction in itch by carefully using Paul Mitchell Tea Tree Oil Shampoo/Conditioner. It has to stay in your hair for five minutes.

I use it and it makes my scalp feel great, but I've never had severe scalp itch, mild at worst.

 

[Bagels]

good luck to you. similar situation. finasteride gave me tons of sides. started RU recently. not really noticing much effect yet but adding seti/pge2 soon. I'm committed to trying all 3 consistently for a year.

Maybe you'd be best just shaving it, getting used to the look, but just continue treatments and try to hold on to what you can until better stuff comes along. I certainly dont want to commit to the time/money on RU/seti/pge2 forever, but just until the next thing comes along. Pulmagen, samumed etc. Either way, its probably always going to be the combination of treatments that do it for us, not one magic product.

 

[PappinAce]

indeed, I do Roberto. I don't blame myself. You can't really blame anyone, unless you want to become miserable and continually blame some God, however, we know that will lead nowhere. haha. I just started legit dutasteride from Murray Ave. .5mg/day, four days ago. I don't know if I should stay on it though. I mean, if one really has a rapid progression of Androgenetic Alopecia on finasteride, then logically, at least in my case, dutasteride should probably f*ck you even worst? I don't know. I was doing o.k. on just 5% minoxidil, losing it, but not nearly as fast. I would be content with JUST using minoxidil, however, I feel that finasteride has permanently sent my testosterone into overdrive. I have been off for five months now, and my libido is still notably higher than normal.

I really hope the dutasteride works for you bro! Is it your first time trying it? Generally with anti-androgens, dutasteride is the fall back for non-finasteride responders, and tends to work. I'll be saying my anti-DHT prayers for you tonight

 

[abcdefg]

The scalp sensations are never good, but its probably still best to stay on the finasteride. You never know if it would been worse had you not used it. It has nowhere to go but up right? I would keep using it and just give more time because even if you drop finasteride its just going to keep worse anyway. On finasteride there is always a chance with time you get some regrowth or it gets better. Without finasteride you know what to expect

 

[Thespain]

I am nearing the end of trying to treat my male pattern baldness as well. Everything I try has either ripped my skin to shreds or given me Telogen Effluvium. Sucks but I guess it's just the way it is.

 

[halycon]

I know that feeling. I'm getting no results, only sides from finasteride. It's game over for me.

Your follicles are probably test sensitive as well in which case you should try CB/RU

 

[buckthorn]

update - 9 days into dutasteride and my scalp went F*CKING CRAZY. I mean, like nothing I ever experienced. Like a bunch of insects chewing each other apart and shooting AK's inside my tissue. I dropped that sh*t cold and will never take it again. I know that feeling to a lesser extent with finasteride. Oral AA's f*ck me so bad it's ridiculous. Time to settle for minoxidil, stemox and oral castor oil. I may also continue RU at a low concentration and EOD.

 

[Afro_Vacancy]

update - 9 days into dutasteride and my scalp went F*CKING CRAZY. I mean, like nothing I ever experienced. Like a bunch of insects chewing each other apart and shooting AK's inside my tissue. I dropped that sh*t cold and will never take it again. I know that feeling to a lesser extent with finasteride. Oral AA's f*ck me so bad it's ridiculous. Time to settle for minoxidil, stemox and oral castor oil. I may also continue RU at a low concentration and EOD.

I'm still curious how tea tree oil shampoo/conditioner would affect a very sensitive scalp like yours.
https://www.amazon.com/Mitchell-Tea...aul+mitchell+tea+tree+oil+shampoo+conditioner

Which stemox are you using?

 

[buckthorn]

I'm still curious how tea tree oil shampoo/conditioner would affect a very sensitive scalp like yours.
https://www.amazon.com/Mitchell-Tea...aul+mitchell+tea+tree+oil+shampoo+conditioner

Which stemox are you using?

I like tea tree oil. I alternate it with regenepure. I am using neogenic.

 

[buckthorn]

The scalp sensations are never good, but its probably still best to stay on the finasteride. You never know if it would been worse had you not used it. It has nowhere to go but up right? I would keep using it and just give more time because even if you drop finasteride its just going to keep worse anyway. On finasteride there is always a chance with time you get some regrowth or it gets better. Without finasteride you know what to expect

I kindly disagree with this. If, after an entire year, finasteride continues to give you horrendous scalp inflammation, then it simply does not work for you. This is never a symptom of good things.

 

[buckthorn]

I kindly disagree with this. If, after an entire year, finasteride continues to give you horrendous scalp inflammation, then it simply does not work for you. This is never a symptom of good things.

I still have about 30-40% density, in a strictly diffuse pattern across the entire top of my head. It can definitely get worst. My theory is that by cutting OUT finasteride, I may be able to regrow about 10% of the 30% I lost in the last year. I think I am a good responder to minoxidil, and that RU and 15% works very well for my hair line. I will continue to dermaroll, use minoxidil religiously and supplement with castor oil and other supplements.

 

[Spellbinder]

I kindly disagree with this. If, after an entire year, finasteride continues to give you horrendous scalp inflammation, then it simply does not work for you. This is never a symptom of good things.

@buckthorn what if I have no scalp imflammation, just shedding right on next day after I started finasteride and I am 2 months on it now. So it might be working, right? Even if I don't see any increased density in hair or existing small hair starts growing. How long should I approximately wait for results if I am a good finasteride responder or a bad responder at least? 4 months? more? What is the average waiting period? Do you know? I also used minoxidil 5% liquid 7 months now, and I think I just maintened what I had with it, can't say for sure though or may be it slowed things down a bit, dunno exactly, but I never had a single shed while on minoxidil only.

 

[buckthorn]

@buckthorn what if I have no scalp imflammation, just shedding right on next day after I started finasteride and I am 2 months on it now. So it might be working, right? Even if I don't see any increased density in hair or existing small hair starts growing. How long should I approximately wait for results if I am a good finasteride responder or a bad responder at least? 4 months? more? What is the average waiting period? Do you know? I also used minoxidil 5% liquid 7 months now, and I think I just maintened what I had with it, can't say for sure though or may be it slowed things down a bit, dunno exactly, but I never had a single shed while on minoxidil only.

1) it's 100% impossible for ANYTHING to make you shed the day after you use it. Hell, you won't shed until 3-4 months, after the hair that was sent into telogen is ejected and falls out.

2) Most people say wait 10-12 months to fully assess the impact finasteride is having on you. I agree. You may have periods of shedding, but remember, in order to regrow a stronger hair fiber, you need to lose the old one. Hair cycles. Google the hair cycle and read up on anagen, telogen and catagen and this will start to make more sense.

3) Relax, take the medication and forget about it. Don't look for baby hairs, you won't see them. They start off VERY fine and unnoticeable in most cases. Also, stop counting hairs you lose. THE ONLY WAY to evaluate whether it's working or not, is to take pics every few months. Hang in there!

 

[Spellbinder]

1) it's 100% impossible for ANYTHING to make you shed the day after you use it. Hell, you won't shed until 3-4 months, after the hair that was sent into telogen is ejected and falls out.

2) Most people say wait 10-12 months to fully assess the impact finasteride is having on you. I agree. You may have periods of shedding, but remember, in order to regrow a stronger hair fiber, you need to lose the old one. Hair cycles. Google the hair cycle and read up on anagen, telogen and catagen and this will start to make more sense.

3) Relax, take the medication and forget about it. Don't look for baby hairs, you won't see them. They start off VERY fine and unnoticeable in most cases. Also, stop counting hairs you lose. THE ONLY WAY to evaluate whether it's working or not, is to take pics every few months. Hang in there!

@buckthorn thanks bro )), I am planning to switch to dutasteride right away, because I literally have no sides at all with finasteride 2 months already and my current hair situation is really critical, people say I am close to nv5-6 already. F**k, I can't believe how quickly it went in just 2 years