Very Impressive Dermarolling And Minxodil Results - From Tressless

[layabout]

guys, I need to bring up something that I don't think we've mentioned before in this thread but may be crucial as an adjunct to our microneedling regimen project:

Vitamin K2.

100mcg a day to prevent systemic calcification.

Idk about dermal absorption rate but maybe we could include K2 in some kind of topical along with minoxidil to speed things up as well as taking it internally, since there is no risk of overdose

 

[overpourgoodfortune]

@layabout - agreed. Vitamin deficiencies - especially D for folks in Northern latitudes is already a known problem. With it being an important pre-req for hair growth, the importance behind K2 is also there... at least most reading seems to suggest. You don't want D without K2 - otherwise it could contribute to excess calcification. Yet, if you're deficient in D - you need to do something about it... so that means take K2 with it.

 

[ToLGuy]

Agreed. All this bro-science stuff is a bit much - but there are many variables to hair loss. Genetics is only one... since my results are so wrong based on my current state.

Many variables are under our control, or at least many which we should at least have on our radars. Stress and diet are no joke. My thinning has rapidly increased in the last 10 years. Of course in those 10 years has come marriage, house, kids, and progressively more stresses at work. With kids showing up things have gotten much worse - but of course sleep and exercise have been at all time terrible levels.

For any solution to be effective - I think you need to have a reasonable environment for that to succeed as well. That includes reasonably good diet, sleep, stress levels, etc.

Luckily for me... the young kids are starting to sleep better, so I'm getting more sleep. My job has changed so while not without stress won't involve nearly as much. With the kids allowing me to sleep and with my work being from home typically... exercise can increase again.

I do think that many variables are involved in Androgenetic Allopecia, but sadly, the genetic ones (the ones we CAN'T control) have the most strong effect, I'd say over 95% of the problem. That's why you can find guys with a very shitty and unhealthy lifestyle, yet with f*****g full heads of hair until the day of their deaths. On the other hand, we can have the best possible lifestyle ever, yet if we have the AA genes, we will still lose hair no matter what. We have some non-genetic variables that are under our control and that we can optimize, but at best it will only slow down the unavoidable hairloss. I know it's not fair, it doesn't sound nice.... But the universe doesn't care about us tiny humans and we have to deal with it.

I really hope stabbing our scalps can neutralize this sh*t in the long term. Right now it seems that this thread has surpassed the previous one in terms of number of subjects and commitment. 5 years ago it was a bunch of impatient dudes quitting at the 3 month mark. Only a tiny minority kept going beyond that. Most important and novel thing here is to evaluate the long term effect. I hope there are many of us still needling at the 1 year mark.

 

[rizaster]

guys, I need to bring up something that I don't think we've mentioned before in this thread but may be crucial as an adjunct to our microneedling regimen project:

Vitamin K2.

100mcg a day to prevent systemic calcification.

Idk about dermal absorption rate but maybe we could include K2 in some kind of topical along with minoxidil to speed things up as well as taking it internally, since there is no risk of overdose

@Arrade and i posted on this a few pages back. Ive been on K2 MK7 for past two years, cant say if it has helped or not, but to your point, it doesnt hurt and its really good for your heart.

 

[Arrade]

guys, I need to bring up something that I don't think we've mentioned before in this thread but may be crucial as an adjunct to our microneedling regimen project:

Vitamin K2.

100mcg a day to prevent systemic calcification.

Idk about dermal absorption rate but maybe we could include K2 in some kind of topical along with minoxidil to speed things up as well as taking it internally, since there is no risk of overdose

Emu oil is k2

 

[layabout]

@layabout - agreed. Vitamin deficiencies - especially D for folks in Northern latitudes is already a known problem. With it being an important pre-req for hair growth, the importance behind K2 is also there... at least most reading seems to suggest. You don't want D without K2 - otherwise it could contribute to excess calcification. Yet, if you're deficient in D - you need to do something about it... so that means take K2 with it.

Fortunarely there are very many quality D3+K2 supplement formulations.

 

[sportsguy97]

The data does seem to say that but i would wager that on a longer timeline the needle gains and and maintenance would pull head of min if growth factors are as unlimited as we hope. I do both tho and apply immediately i love that sting

Agreed and that’s what I think is main difference. With needling we may be able to compound on results.... minoxidil alone obviously things eventually go backward prob cause of fibrosis.

Obviously the two combined are more effective. As we saw with some examples though.... (especially with 2young). Needling itself long term not only regrew.... but he maintained once he stopped.

 

[layabout]

I think finasteride + Min + Microneedling would be the IDEAL treatment (nizoral is overrated, and there are better hair loss specific shampoos)

That is the real three pronged approach: finasteride for getting rid of pesky DHT, Min 1x daily for the vasodilation and rapid regrowth activator, and needling weekly as the calcification/fibrosis eliminator.

I wish I could tolerate finasteride, maybe I will try a .25mg dose EOD sometime next month.

 

[bigjimmy]

I think finasteride + Min + Microneedling would be the IDEAL treatment (nizoral is overrated, and there are better hair loss specific shampoos)

That is the real three pronged approach: finasteride for getting rid of pesky DHT, Min 1x daily for the vasodilation and rapid regrowth activator, and needling weekly as the calcification/fibrosis eliminator.

I wish I could tolerate finasteride, maybe I will try a .25mg dose EOD sometime next month.

I’m the same with finasteride, I’m still tempted to try it again in a lower dose topical though.
I’m actually about to add a minoxidil compound with azelaic acid, hydrocortisone, tretinoin and progesterone.

 

[BaldAndBalder]

6 sessions in, every 15 days roughly. No minoxidil. 1.75ish mm.
Small hair sprouting on the hairline, but nothing groundbreaking.
Still to early to tell about top density, I'm a diffuse thinner and currently still not noticing cosmetic improvement, but it's still very early on.
Basically just 2.5 months in, I hope to see some real progress between 6 and 12 month mark.

Just keep at it people, I'm losing hair since 2008, so I dont expect 10 years of loss to reverse quickly.

Please take before and after pictures.

 

[JWM2]

Been wounding for almost 2 months now. Have been on the big 3 for over 20 years, so wounding with 1.5 mm once a week is the only new addition to my regimen.

Temples have thinned quite a bit, but hair down the center appears to be thicker. Go figure. Going to give it a little more time, and if temples keep vanishing (more so) I might stop wounding and opt for Somebody's approach of light rolling once a day to give that a try.

Edited to add: I just order some plastic dauber applicator bottles. Dr. Lee used to sell these and said he felt they were the best way to apply liquid minoxidil without having it run or get on your fingers etc. Going to start pouring my generic minoxidil into these and give it a shot for awhile.

 

[Armando Jose]

I have battled hairloss since the age of 18.
In 1989 accidentally I read about Rogaine in a German Lifestyle magazine. Purchased it in the US the same year during a holiday.
In 1990 it became available in France so I sourced from there.
In 1999 I started with Propecia. In 2010 with Avodart.
Now, I hope that microneedling and Trinov plus Avodart will finally returns my happiness as far as hair is concerned.
No idea how I would feel then.
Almost like the jackpot in the lotto..I guess

Good luck pal, but I am wondering which hair you had? have you diagnosed of Androgenetic Alopecia?
there no is preventive meds for it,

 

[sportsguy97]

I think finasteride + Min + Microneedling would be the IDEAL treatment (nizoral is overrated, and there are better hair loss specific shampoos)

That is the real three pronged approach: finasteride for getting rid of pesky DHT, Min 1x daily for the vasodilation and rapid regrowth activator, and needling weekly as the calcification/fibrosis eliminator.

I wish I could tolerate finasteride, maybe I will try a .25mg dose EOD sometime next month.

I can't as well. I know the majority of people can, but i won't ever touch that drug again.

I'm just of the mindset its tough for dht created inflammation to attack the hair follicles if the wound healing process is happening over several weeks. Combine needling, minoxidil and an anti inflammatory type lifestyle when not needling.

The encouraging thing is the people in the studies stopping and maintaining results. Again though were very early, hopefully we read more positives as we hit the one year mark for all.

 

[Drextez]

If you guys take finasteride, just remember that any natural fullheads will have more DHT than you. They dont need to block DHT because it dosent give them scalp calcification fibrosis.

Finasteride will prevent the accumulation of fibrosis since it blocks 5a reductase.... it cant possibly ''not work''.

Finasteride wont break up fibrosis that is already there, so you will still need to do microneedling.

But you might run into some side effects since DHT is pretty much essential for males. I dont beleive its worth the risk.

I still think min+microneedling is the best if done properly and longterm

 

[Rudi]

Good luck pal, but I am wondering which hair you had? have you diagnosed of Androgenetic Alopecia?
there no is preventive meds for it,

I never worried about it. I just looked at my dad and my grandfather..and I realized its hereditary hairloss. I was just lucky that the medication became available when I needed it. Especially Avodart as Propecia was losing efficacy.
It really stuffed up a lot of confidence in my life. At least these days young guys can access different treatments. In addition, information is available on the web. Nothing of that when I was young. And when you battle it as a young man it is very traumatic. It affects you for the rest of your life.

 

[Rudi]

Of course no microneedling those days...

 

[sportsguy97]

You sure? If so, that's very good and in line with other anecdotes.

Well listen we've only had a few cases. But i believe someone private messaged 2 young and he said he kept most of what he got even though he hasn't needled in a bit. I could have sworn the studies mentioned once the guys stopped they maintained for months after. Right now though i am speaking in theory. Obviously we need alot more data to back things up.

If you guys take finasteride, just remember that any natural fullheads will have more DHT than you. They dont need to block DHT because it dosent give them scalp calcification fibrosis.

Finasteride will prevent the accumulation of fibrosis since it blocks 5a reductase.... it cant possibly ''not work''.

Finasteride wont break up fibrosis that is already there, so you will still need to do microneedling.

But you might run into some side effects since DHT is pretty much essential for males. I dont beleive its worth the risk.

I still think min+microneedling is the best if done properly and longterm

Thats my thing. If it takes a while for DHT based fibrosis to build up. Maybe needling less frequently (say once a month) is enough to continue to stimulate growth factors/break up fibrosis and at least maintain. Thats why i was saying even if people don't get their desired results, it would still be beneficial to at least needle once in a while to get all the potential benefits. Again its all in theory at this point.

 

[Bill_Russo]

You sure? If so, that's very good and in line with other anecdotes.

They followed up the patients for 18 months after procedure and the results were sustained:
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4458936/

All patients showed a response of + 2 to + 3 on standardized 7-point evaluation scale. The response in the form of new hair growth started after 8-10 sessions. The patients’ satisfaction was more than 75% in three patients and more 50% in one patient, on patients’ subjective hair growth assessment scale. The obtained results were sustained post procedure during 18 months follow-up period.

 

[baldco]

Been wounding for almost 2 months now. Have been on the big 3 for over 20 years, so wounding with 1.5 mm once a week is the only new addition to my regimen.

Temples have thinned quite a bit, but hair down the center appears to be thicker. Go figure. Going to give it a little more time, and if temples keep vanishing (more so) I might stop wounding and opt for Somebody's approach of light rolling once a day to give that a try.

Edited to add: I just order some plastic dauber applicator bottles. Dr. Lee used to sell these and said he felt they were the best way to apply liquid minoxidil without having it run or get on your fingers etc. Going to start pouring my generic minoxidil into these and give it a shot for awhile.

I am happy that you are seeing some growth and thickness on the crown. I am 4 months into it and have lost significant ground on both temples and crown. I find this so strange since my temples were in pretty good shape before starting derma. I am encouraged by the fact that some people here are having better luck than me and convinced to me to keep going for another two months. If I don't see any results and continue to thin at this pace, might as well just throw in the towel and shave it off... Bummer I was doing ok on big three before I decided to go this route. Good Luck either ways and keep us updated.

 

[Bill_Russo]

I am happy that you are seeing some growth and thickness on the crown. I am 4 months into it and have lost significant ground on both temples and crown. I find this so strange since my temples were in pretty good shape before starting derma. I am encouraged by the fact that some people here are having better luck than me and convinced to me to keep going for another two months. If I don't see any results and continue to thin at this pace, might as well just throw in the towel and shave it off... Bummer I was doing ok on big three before I decided to go this route. Good Luck either ways and keep us updated.

Sad to hear that, man... Not gonna say it's a good sign or anything like that, cause I don't actually know, but I do hope it gets better. God speed, bud.

On a side note, I should really stop browsing for gymnastics equipment, cause I run into sh*t like this and realize I don't have money to buy it: https://www.amazon.com/d/Ab-Trainers/Iron-Cross-Gymnastics-Strength-Trainer/B0079K7DGI