Anyone else wishes they were a skeleton?

[Caillou]

The identification of jinns seems almost paganistic and polytheistic but none of the three explain who or what angels are and how strong they are. Purportedly, Satan's power among many Christians equals almost that of God with the same types of minions which are of course depicted ridiculously in movies and the like and pictures of hell and heaven.

Can you elaborate on that please? We believe that Jinns are sentient beings sharing the world with us, but they're not better than us or worthy of worship, they're also obligated to worship God, and they get into contact with so many humans through occultism, kabbalah, sufism, magick, etc.


Angels are beings made solely for God's service and worship and they have no other use, but i'm pretty sure they're strong enough seeing as just one angel managed to utterly obliterate the 2 cities of Sodom and Gomorrah with millions of people living in them in a very short period of time

 

[JaneyElizabeth]

Can you elaborate on that please? We believe that Jinns are sentient beings sharing the world with us, but they're not better than us or worthy of worship, they're also obligated to worship God, and they get into contact with so many humans through occultism, kabbalah, sufism, magick, etc.


Angels are beings made solely for God's service and worship and they have no other use, but i'm pretty sure they're strong enough seeing as just one angel managed to utterly obliterate the 2 cities of Sodom and Gomorrah with millions of people living in them in a very short period of time

Hmm. Thought in Christianity about the angels seems less developed. Angels apparently have free will and apparently, Satan and one third of the angelic host chose to depart from heaven. There are two important Archangels, Gabriel who delivers news, and Michael who is the chief angelic warrior. You seem not to deny the existence of the occult similar to some Jews. Christians are split but the better view is that the occult does not exist in terms of divination or contacting spirits or the dead or conjuring or spells. I don't believe in occult practices in terms of results. Many people try though. I am fundamentalist in that belief. I won't do a Ouija board ever nor any seance which makes me slightly superstitious but for me it is Bayesian. Why chance what I could be wrong about versus avoiding the situation completely. I won't watch those ghosts shows on television but I love movies about ghosts since they are pretend not dark green moving figures.

 

[Caillou]

Hmm. Thought in Christianity about the angels seems less developed. Angels apparently have free will and apparently, Satan and one third of the angelic host chose to depart from heaven. There are two important Archangels, Gabriel who delivers news, and Michael who is the chief angelic warrior. You seem not to deny the existence of the occult similar to some Jews. Christians are split but the better view is that the occult does not exist in terms of divination or contacting spirits or the dead or conjuring or spells. I don't believe in occult practices in terms of results. Many people try though. I am fundamentalist in that belief. I won't do a Ouija board ever nor any seance which makes me slightly superstitious but for me it is Bayesian. Why chance what I could be wrong about versus avoiding the situation completely. I won't watch those ghosts shows on television but I love movies about ghosts since they are pretend not dark green moving figures.

We don't really believe in "Satan" like in Christianity, or that he was an angel. Satan is a word that comes from Arabic word "Shaytan", which means any rebellious being spreading evil and corruption. So for examples, many humans and Jinns can be called "Satan" as well, even if they're not Lucifer himself. We believe that Iblis - Lucifer - was the first of the Jinns and he used to live with Angels in heavens imitating them in their worship until he rose to their place, even though he's a different being than them. When Adam was created, God ordered all the angels to prostrate in front of Adam's body as a way to appreciate God's best creation. But Lucifer refused, and got consumed with pride and jealousy, so he got kicked out from Heavens and vowed to lead humans astray until the end of times, and that's why he's considered the ultimate symbol of pride and rebellion, as he was the first prideful and rebellious being in all of existence


[Allah] said, "What prevented you from prostrating when I commanded you?" [Satan] said, "I am better than him. You created me from fire and created him from clay [i.e., earth]." .. [Allah] said, "Descend from it [i.e., Paradise], for it is not for you to be arrogant therein. So get out; indeed, you are of the debased." .. [Satan] said, "Reprieve me until the Day they are resurrected." .. [Allah] said, "Indeed, you are of those reprieved." .. [Satan] said, "Because You have put me in error, I will surely sit in wait for them [i.e., mankind] on Your straight path. .. Then I will come to them from before them and from behind them and on their right and on their left, and You will not find most of them grateful [to You]." .. [Allah] said, "Depart from it [i.e., Paradise], reproached and expelled. Whoever follows you among them - I will surely fill Hell with you, all together."

 

[JaneyElizabeth]

Catholics absolutely believe in a permanent suffering. They also believe in purgatory, quoting (can't remember which) one of the 7books that "Us" Protestants omitted from "our" bible.

I grew up with a Catholic Bible in the house which might mention purgatory. It had cool color pictures of things like Abraham about to murder his son Issac and maybe Adam and Even naked save her hair covering her hair.

Catholics have limbo and purgatory and Mariology, all of which offend Christians except mainline Christians who tend to follow Catholic doctrine like Anglicans and Lutherans and they have essentially rights to all rites in all three churches. But in the Anglican tradition, hell is not a point of emphasis nor is having convents or monasteries. Catholics used to have doctrines about food but it was more so like very strong suggestions not to eat meat on Fridays or Lent. Fundamentalist churches basically don't observe Lent or Ash Wednesday. The Episcopalian Church is dying here and dying in England. The greatest thing for Catholics and now fundamentalists was when Spain and Portugal conquered and baptized all of the natives in Spanish/Portuguese realms like also in the Philippines, named for Felipe which is obscured by the English spelling. Without conquest, both Islam and Christianity would be much smaller in terms of population numbers. Jewish and Islamic beliefs are very similar to Arianism and had that not been such a huge part of Christian history, Jews and Muslims might have be regarded as Christians under Arianism but who knows. The German tribes in Spain and Portugal were belligerently Catholic and fought out the Moors over a period of 700 years. Jews generally can be seen as part of Christian tradition and Islamic tradition regarding the people of the Book who were not required to change their religion with differing tax effects at different times.

 

[JaneyElizabeth]

We don't really believe in "Satan" like in Christianity, or that he was an angel. Satan is a word that comes from Arabic word "Shaytan", which means any rebellious being spreading evil and corruption. So for examples, many humans and Jinns can be called "Satan" as well, even if they're not Lucifer himself. We believe that Iblis - Lucifer - was the first of the Jinns and he used to live with Angels in heavens imitating them in their worship until he rose to their place, even though he's a different being than them. When Adam was created, God ordered all the angels to prostrate in front of Adam's body as a way to appreciate God's best creation. But Lucifer refused, and got consumed with pride and jealousy, so he got kicked out from Heavens and vowed to lead humans astray until the end of times, and that's why he's considered the ultimate symbol of pride and rebellion, as he was the first prideful and rebellious being in all of existence


[Allah] said, "What prevented you from prostrating when I commanded you?" [Satan] said, "I am better than him. You created me from fire and created him from clay [i.e., earth]." .. [Allah] said, "Descend from it [i.e., Paradise], for it is not for you to be arrogant therein. So get out; indeed, you are of the debased." .. [Satan] said, "Reprieve me until the Day they are resurrected." .. [Allah] said, "Indeed, you are of those reprieved." .. [Satan] said, "Because You have put me in error, I will surely sit in wait for them [i.e., mankind] on Your straight path. .. Then I will come to them from before them and from behind them and on their right and on their left, and You will not find most of them grateful [to You]." .. [Allah] said, "Depart from it [i.e., Paradise], reproached and expelled. Whoever follows you among them - I will surely fill Hell with you, all together."

That's all fascinating. Satan in English/Christianity seems to mean deceiver. But they are obviously cognates. I am still trying to place the Jinn because they seem similar to the idea of not aliens but people living here on a different plane or wavelength. I am reading about Ishmael. What about sources and source verification and also why do many stories differ slightly related to common characters like Abraham, Ishmael, Christ and the prophets? Islam seems more or less identical to Mormonism in terms of sources and revelation of scriptures and I make no value judgment but what parts of your religious tradition are more so tribal than really scriptural?

What is your first language? English?

 

[JaneyElizabeth]

There appear to have been two monumental battles close together historically that changed Christian history. The first is 1492 when the Catholic kings finally controlled all of Spain. Portugal had achieved this far earlier but they both had new energy to focus on conquest elsewhere and then the Turks were stopped near Austria which might have been a pincer movement but Spain probably controlled most of Spain but Andalusia far earlier. Charles Martel obviously saved Christianity since the Northern countries had not been evangelized yet and people in Iceland held out to the bitter end. Yeah Vikings.

 

[JaneyElizabeth]

Let's note also that the name Ishmael is related to God apparently in Semitic and like Isra-el, you have Ishma-el which is at least a second name of God in the earliest Jewish sources. So El probably was a common term related to chief God or god closely associated with chief God or prophet.

 

[Caillou]

That's all fascinating. Satan in English/Christianity seems to mean deceiver. But they are obviously cognates. I am still trying to place the Jinn because they seem similar to the idea of not aliens but people living here on a different plane or wavelength. I am reading about Ishmael. What about sources and source verification and also why do many stories differ slightly related to common characters like Abraham, Ishmael, Christ and the prophets? Islam seems more or less identical to Mormonism in terms of sources and revelation of scriptures and I make no value judgment but what parts of your religious tradition are more so tribal than really scriptural?

What is your first language? English?

My first language is Arabic. I believe myself that aliens are interdimensional beings - aka Jinns - The Pentagon already released a report 2 months ago confirming the existence of Unidentified Flying Objects, and i think we're approaching a really interesting future. I also believe that those aliens or Jinns did actually contact humanity before, and especially the ancient cultures. The "Gods" and entities depicted by ancient cultures all share striking similarities to one another despite us having no evidence that those ancient cultures managed to get in contact with each others. But that's my personal theory anyway and it doesn't have to be true


For sources, we Muslims depend only on Quran and verified Hadiths. And i can assure you that you will find no contradictions or confusion if you depend on these two sources to understand Islam correctly


May God guide you to the light and straight path someday

 

[Caillou]

Let's note also that the name Ishmael is related to God apparently in Semitic and like Isra-el, you have Ishma-el which is at least a second name of God in the earliest Jewish sources. So El probably was a common term related to chief God or god closely associated with chief God or prophet.

Ishmael is the father of Arabs, son of Abraham, and brother of Jacob who is the father of Jews. That's why Arabs and Jews are considered cousins

 

[JaneyElizabeth]

My first language is Arabic. I believe myself that aliens are interdimensional beings - aka Jinns - The Pentagon already released a report 2 months ago confirming the existence of Unidentified Flying Objects, and i think we're approaching a really interesting future. I also believe that those aliens or Jinns did actually contact humanity before, and especially the ancient cultures. The "Gods" and entities depicted by ancient cultures all share striking similarities to one another despite us having no evidence that those ancient cultures managed to get in contact with each others. But that's my personal theory anyway and it doesn't have to be true


For sources, we Muslims depend only on Quran and verified Hadiths. And i can assure you that you will find no contradictions or confusion if you depend on these two sources to understand Islam correctly


May God guide you to the light and straight path someday

I don't believe anything in Islam goes against my beliefs or the functional beliefs of most Christians that Jesus is more prophet than god. Fundamentalist go the other direction and emphasize that Jesus and Jehovah are the same. The doctrine of the trinity is a church doctrine not found in the Orthodox tradition and similarly most Christians do not differ form the scriptural beliefs of Muslims in practice. Your views about the mystic sound less impossible or unlikely given the structure that you present for them. Do you have the Quran which is usually Koran for us but they are obviously again cognates that mean the same, and Hadiths memorized? How common is that? Memorizing the Bible is possible for people with memory schemes like Jerry Lucas but for most, it's far too long.

 

[JaneyElizabeth]

Ishmael is the father of Arabs, son of Abraham, and brother of Jacob who is the father of Jews. That's why Arabs and Jews are considered cousins

As I peruse, it seems that Jews much more so than Muslims emphasize the differences between themselves from other groups during ancient times. Islam and Christianity are evangelic religions spread greatly by the sword compared to Eastern religions but we have more testosterone. Aramaic or Syriac seem bridges between Arabic and Levant Semitic.

 

[Caillou]

I don't believe anything in Islam goes against my beliefs or the functional beliefs of most Christians that Jesus is more prophet than god. Fundamentalist go the other direction and emphasize that Jesus and Jehovah are the same. The doctrine of the trinity is a church doctrine not found in the Orthodox tradition and similarly most Christians do not differ form the scriptural beliefs of Muslims in practice. Your views about the mystic sound less impossible or unlikely given the structure that you present for them. Do you have the Quran which is usually Koran for us but they are obviously again cognates that mean the same, and Hadiths memorized? How common is that? Memorizing the Bible is possible for people with memory schemes like Jerry Lucas but for most, it's far too long.

The Quran is memorized by millions of Muslims as it's considered one of the greatest things in Islam to memorize it, though it's not really an obligation like prayers. There are also a good amount of Muslims who managed to memorize both the Quran and thousands of verified Hadiths at the same time because they spent decades studying them, and unlike Christianity, this was not uncommon at all among Muslims - though nowadays it's actually quite uncommon but still exists -

 

[Caillou]

As I peruse, it seems that Jews much more so than Muslims emphasize the differences between themselves from other groups during ancient times. Islam and Christianity are evangelic religions spread greatly by the sword compared to Eastern religions but we have more testosterone. Aramaic or Syriac seem bridges between Arabic and Levant Semitic.

I don't really want to get more into that since this is a subject so sensitive to some that it could get me banned, but the Jews have started emphasizing the difference between them and other groups ever since the Talmud came into existence with the concept of "Jews" and "Goyim" being introduced in it

 

[JaneyElizabeth]

We can see how interrelated the names of God is in various Semitic traditions and it is usually some variant of EL or AL as the original name or in the pagan tradition the chief or son of the chief god. Do you know much about Arab mythology before the 600's? I think some fundamentalists still claim paganistic influence on Islam related to the moon as I recall but the Christian crazies put out these comic books and then leave them everywhere like in toilets and one mentions Islam and the Moon goddess.

 

[JaneyElizabeth]

The Quran is memorized by millions of Muslims as it's considered one of the greatest things in Islam to memorize it, though it's not really an obligation like prayers. There are also a good amount of Muslims who managed to memorize both the Quran and thousands of verified Hadiths at the same time because they spent decades studying them, and unlike Christianity, this was not uncommon at all among Muslims - though nowadays it's actually quite uncommon but still exists -

What's the hierarchy between scripture, hadith and Muslim traditions? I think this varies for Sunnis and Shiites.

 

[Caillou]

What's the hierarchy between scripture, hadith and Muslim traditions? I think this varies for Sunnis and Shiites.

Quran is the direct message from God, so it's at the top when it comes to importance. Hadiths are everything officially said by prophet Muhammad - Peace Be Upon Him - for example explaining things in depth, or providing more information about a certain topic, or giving us advices, etc

 

[Caillou]

We can see how interrelated the names of God is in various Semitic traditions and it is usually some variant of EL or AL as the original name or in the pagan tradition the chief or son of the chief god. Do you know much about Arab mythology before the 600's? I think some fundamentalists still claim paganistic influence on Islam related to the moon as I recall but the Christian crazies put out these comic books and then leave them everywhere like in toilets and one mentions Islam and the Moon goddess.

Arabs used to worship the same God as Muslims, the Abrahamic God. The problem is that they used to worship other things - Idols - with said God because they believed that it somehow got them closer to God. Islam preaches the message of only one God, and that no other thing in existence except him is worthy of worship, that's why Muslims got treated terribly during the beginnings of Islam in the Arabic world


About the moon claims, it comes from the misunderstanding of how crescent is often used as an Islamic symbol, but this is not actually official in Islam. It's just something people came up with because the crescent moon symbolizes the coming of Ramadan, which is the most important month in Islam. Other than that, we have no relation at all to the moon that i can think of

 

[JaneyElizabeth]

Quran is the direct message from God, so it's at the top when it comes to importance. Hadiths are everything officially said by prophet Muhammad - Peace Be Upon Him - for example explaining things in depth, or providing more information about a certain topic, or giving us advices, etc

So both are proper historical sources and not only poetry or metaphoric. I am very interested in as well why essentially one race looks-wise has no language overlap in terms of roots. If you remove the likely Dravidic influence, then all of British Indian, all Arabs and all Europeans look roughly similar with similar hair distributions among beard, body and scalp hair. The Hittites were European, like Persians and Indians. We can to a great extent parse out proto-Indo-European but it doesn't seem to be done as much with proto-Semitic but language indicates that Ethiopia was outside of the African Black tradition linguistically which confirms links alleged relating to Solomon and the Queen of Sheba, the most mysterious woman in the Old Testament.

 

[JaneyElizabeth]

Arabs used to worship the same God as Muslims, the Abrahamic God. The problem is that they used to worship other things - Idols - with said God because they believed that it somehow got them closer to God. Islam preaches the message of only one God, and that no other thing in existence except him is worthy of worship, that's why Muslims got treated terribly during the beginnings of Islam in the Arabic world


About the moon claims, it comes from the misunderstanding of how crescent is often used as an Islamic symbol, but this is not actually official in Islam. It's just something people came up with because the crescent moon symbolizes the coming of Ramadan, which is the most important month in Islam. Other than that, we have no relation at all to the moon that i can think of

It seems that Egypt used to be the center of "Arab" culture before Mecca and Medina but the Egyptian gods seem to vary greatly from the Semitic/Caananite gods. With the conquest of Carthage, one forgets that Muslims simply returned the Semitic languages to the areas that were taken by and then taken from Rome. It is also overlooked that Canaanites, Phoenicians, Jews and people in Carthage spoke a very similar language and were of all but identical genetic stock. In terms of baldness, all of it spreads baldness genes outwards and probably doubles down on baldness genes in people from near the Mediterranean or Middle East.

 

[JaneyElizabeth]

It seems that Egypt used to be the center of "Arab" culture before Mecca and Medina but the Egyptian gods seem to vary greatly from the Semitic/Caananite gods. With the conquest of Carthage, one forgets that Muslims simply returned the Semitic languages to the areas that were taken by and then taken from Rome. It is also overlooked that Canaanites, Phoenicians, Jews and people in Carthage spoke a very similar language and were of all but identical genetic stock. In terms of baldness, all of it spreads baldness genes outwards and probably doubles down on baldness genes in people from near the Mediterranean or Middle East.

Only Janey can link linguistics, Mediterranean conquests and baldness....