Atcc Pta 6475, The Cure We Aren't Talking About?

[CuredMouse]

A Treatment for mice we can use?
Mice. The hair loss industries permier clients have been gifted yet another fantastic treatment in the probiotic supplement ATCC PTA 6475, a strain of the species lactobacillus reuteri. However unlike most underwhelming animal studies which are high-concept, experimental, and both wholly inacessably and impractical for use in human beings, theres nothing stopping us from replicating this on ourselves with currently available and reasonably priced products.

The Important Stuff

Researchers fed a group of rats the ATCC PTA 6475 strain of l. Reuteri for 20 weeks. At the studies conclusion they showed a 1,200% increase in hair count over the control, as well as a 50% increase in skin thickness. The experimental group had more hairs in the anagen phase, and hair quality was also improved.

Here's the catch you've been waiting for... the experimental groups food had other nutrients aside from the probiotic, so I suppose it's impossible to know what really caused the growth....

Well it would have been had they not repeated the study, this time ensuring that the ONLY difference in diet was this bacteria. The results were the EXACT same, proving the probiotic to be responsible for the growth.

Why did this happen?

The current hypothesis is that this is accomplished via the probiotics ability to rebalance the expression of cytokines, making it a powerful anti-inflamitory.

What does this mean for humans?

I have no idea. Nobody's done a study in humans for hair loss, there have however been other studies done in humans using this strain showing positive benefits, ranging from a 25% increase in vitamin D, increased testosterone, and an increase in bone density for those suffering from Osteopenia.

The major roadblock for trying this ourselves is acquiring the strain in quantities large enough to match the mouse study when taking into consideration relative mass. However I do believe I've found a solution.

This is a link to the supplement containing the most CFU's per tablet (it's no where near high enough).

https://www.amazon.com/Probiotic-Supplement-Discomfort-Constipation-Regularity/dp/B01AH3RT9Y

The logical step would be to multiply the bacteria ourselves. This can be done by making a yogurt culture, this website describes how to do this in detail:

https://www.wheatbellyblog.com/2018/04/make-l-reuteri-yogurt/

The website itself is a little too "Everything is killing us, go vegan/gluten free/dairy free/sugar free/keto/gmo-free/add two layers to your tinfoil hat and throw away your heart medicine...etc. for my taste but it gets the job done.

What needs to happen

Currently I can find no information about the effects of this probiotic in androgenetic alopecia, whether in a formal study or even just anecdotal evidence. To my knowledge nobody has tried it for this purpose. I already have my pills and am waiting on the inulin powder to make the yogurt out of it, however I am unable to function as a tester as I have recently begun three other treatments (finasteride, clobetasol propionate, and Zix). I believe this to be a treatment with massive potential however it needs to be tested by forum members who aren't beginning conflicting regimines and are willing to document their progress. I'll leave this thread as a place to do so, and I welcome more advanced users to expand upon this information with their own research/interpretations.

Here's a link, along with some of the pictures from the study

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3547054/

 

[Javell]

Not funny bro

 

[CuredMouse]

Not funny bro

This isn't a troll and you can easily verify that everything I posted is legitimate by viewing the study and doing a minimal ammont of research. If there's something I'm missing here let me know but it seems pretty sound to me. It's clearly not a miracle cure but it's also definitely something to be explored that to my knowledge has been given no attention by members of this forum. Please, if there's something here I'm missing let me know

 

[Trichosan]

Go for it @CuredMouse. I'm most curious to see how you feel after 20 weeks of treatment. I take probiotics daily and it has been shown they are critically important for immune health. Can't say I hold much hope for it impacting Androgenic Alopecia however. Many different angles of research seem to add up to a distinct difference between mice and humans and that is the genetic mechanism is more powerfully linked to hair growth in humans. Anyway, I applaud you for establishing a premise and carrying out your own research.

 

[CuredMouse]

Thank you. And while I agree with the genetic mechanism playing a more important role in the health of human hair, I am curious about this supplements anti-inflammatory properites as well as it's ability to raise vitamin D levels. It definitely appears to address many concerns which tend to surround androgenetic alopecia which in my opinion warrants it a bit more attention.

 

[@GeraltOfRivia]

Another hairloss treatement for mouse lol

 

[Bad_Wolve]

Go for it @CuredMouse. I'm most curious to see how you feel after 20 weeks of treatment. I take probiotics daily and it has been shown they are critically important for immune health. Can't say I hold much hope for it impacting Androgenic Alopecia however. Many different angles of research seem to add up to a distinct difference between mice and humans and that is the genetic mechanism is more powerfully linked to hair growth in humans. Anyway, I applaud you for establishing a premise and carrying out your own research.

sry bro offtopic, but which probiotics would you recommend?

 

[Trichosan]

sry bro offtopic, but which probiotics would you recommend?

I try many different brands. Some from Xymogen, Dr. Ohhira, VSL3 (Costco), Lifeway Kefir, Danactive. Variety helps.

 

[jamesbooker1975]

Will be easier to find a way to convert us into mouse than find a cure for baldness

 

[CuredMouse]

Another hairloss treatement for mouse lol

Yes except this one is a novel approach which hasn't been tested in literally any human so far, yet can be for anyone who wants to try it using products currently on the market. Also the mechanisms by which the mice regrew hair are linked to certain complications we know persist in sufferers of androgenetic alopecia. Mice studies suck because they do crazy sh*t to them that we could never replicate, this one's a pretty straightforward and safe dietary one. I've yet to see anyone on this forum mention the microbiome even once. It's a completely unexplored area of attack and for anyone wanting to possibly discover an entirely untested branch of treatment options... This could be a good place to start.

 

[hailbrotzu]

I’m sure you could still be fine to test your theory unless your hairline is back to perfect. What Norwood are you at because couldn’t additional regrowth prove that it works?

 

[CuredMouse]

I’m sure you could still be fine to test your theory unless your hairline is back to perfect. What Norwood are you at because couldn’t additional regrowth prove that it works?

2.5 diffuse, a total regrowth from finasteride/zix/clobetasol/dermarolling wouldn't be the craziest thing to happen therefore there's nothing that could prove it wouldn't have been those that caused the regrowth rather than the atcc pta 6475 as I'm beginning all at once. Of course if I do have a massive unexpected regrowth it would be a real eyebrow raiser, however it wouldn't be proof

 

[baldingAF]

Yo @CuredMouse have you considered using the probiotic mixture topically?

I understand most of the benefits happen when the bacteria is introduced internally to have a systemic effect but some of these could either be concentrated or work better directly on area of application, just considering there are more than one benefit to skin and there is a growing trend behind using probiotics topically. Jack sh*t from science but if it’s already in front of you.... just something to consider mate!

Additionally I have purchased this and will be making a coconut water kefir as well

 

[CuredMouse]

Yo @CuredMouse have you considered using the probiotic mixture topically?

I understand most of the benefits happen when the bacteria is introduced internally to have a systemic effect but some of these could either be concentrated or work better directly on area of application, just considering there are more than one benefit to skin and there is a growing trend behind using probiotics topically. Jack sh*t from science but if it’s already in front of you.... just something to consider mate!

Additionally I have purchased this and will be making a coconut water kefir as well

That's a great idea, however it's possible the bacteria can only survive/live out their daily function in a more natural environment like the human gut, and wouldn't carry out their same functions introduced elsewhere in the body. It is something worth trying, however I'm not too keen on putting food on my scalp and leaving it there... If I could find a way to create a culture in something I could be certain wouldn't go bad sitting on my head I would be more apt to try it. Definitely keep us updated on your progress, if this produces even a slight benefit it opens the door to an entirely new angle in the treatment of Androgenetic Alopecia

 

[CuredMouse]

Here's a link to a separate study I just discovered which conducted a similar experiment years earlier with a similar outcome.
https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/full/10.1111/j.1600-0625.2009.01060.x

 

[CuredMouse]

*Quick bump so it doesnt get buried for people who might want to try it

 

[nohairnolife]

It's about damn time one of the mice started giving back. Godspeed you bacteria-slurping rodent

 

[WheeljackG1]

So are you going to try to get it and test it? Do they make this probiotic for humans?

 

[yayapapaya]

Stopped reading after "mice".

 

[CuredMouse]

Stopped reading after "mice".

Congratulations. I said "A treatment for mice we can actually use?" for a reason. You can literally do the exact same treatment yourself right now. This wasnt a ln expensive high concept study, it was a simple study in mice to determine the effects of a specific probiotic supplement which tackles many of the complications associated with Androgenetic Alopecia in humans, and it worked. As far as I'm aware nobody has made the connection between the microbiome and hair loss, nor have any studys in humans been attempted. This is a safe and cheap treatment that is currently available, scientifically supported, and showed outstanding results in an animal model.