Bald man goes up against a tall Norwood -1

jd_uk

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He's a f-ing celebrity for f-ck's sake.

Wake up. I've f-cked women almost without talking to them at all.

I know, hard to believe when it probably never happened to you.

They knew nothing about me. But somehow it was my dominant attitude and behavior?!

Please. All I did was kissing them and then asking them "So, shall we go to your place?" "OK!"

All while the ugly ginger guy she came to the party with was looking at us, full of contained rage and disappointment.

It's all looks. You'd have to be in my shoes to understand, but keep believing you can increase your chancing by behaving differently.

So basically yet again you have no argument to anything i posted?

And the girls are commenting on his character in the show. They're there telling the world how sexy his 'bad boy' persona is.

By the way, from the way you speak i am almost certain you don't have the experience i do with women. Or, if you do then it has been based on nothing more than your appearkve because you're too shy/emotional/insecure for anything else. For the record i have slept with women in probably about 15 different countries over the last 6 years. For some little effort was required (i.e. no game at all, she liked how i looked from the start), others more effort was required. It's laughable that youndon't believe anything but appearance influenced sexual attraction.

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I think youre using the exception as the rule. Also there are a lot of variables. Women can like an older man, but was he a good looking guy. What was his last trist with a girl like that? For all you know that guy hadnt had sex for YEARS before her.
Anyway Ive been on both ends of the spectrum. I know for a fact that physcial attraction needs to be there to get a girl to openly give you the time of day. When I had my good hair it was super easy to grab girls. Now its not. Its not an age thing because im talking about girls my same age.
If you are saying a guy can get a girlfriend or wife with enough effort than yes thats true. Even a NW7 guy can eventually land a decent enough wife but what effort does he have to put in to get it? What kind of attitude will she have? Who will be the dominant one in that relationship?
I dont believe the confidence BS lines. Im confident enough. Im confident to the point people think Im an arrogant jerk half the time. But that is the difference. When I had good hair and was attractive my confidence was just that, healthy confidence that people liked. Now that Im a thinning haired goblin my confidence strikes people as odd and just me being obnoxious.
I am sure if I was single I could still pick up girls to some degree. But would they be something I would want? When you were used to tapping 8s and 9s (maybe not 9s lol) and then have to be forced to accept overwieght 4s and 5s you have to ask "is this worth the effort?" Why waste the resources. At that point paying would be the better option.
If you are a guy who doesnt have much experience with females like some guys here anyway, then yeah start with some 5s and work your way up. Burger to filet is GREAT, filet to burger...... eh not so much.
I can personally say I see the difference in the interactions with women when hair loss set in. Most barely acknowledge eye contact and look down because they dont want to even take the chance they might entice me to interact with them. When I still had my hair eye contact was my go to first step for meeting a girl.
Would I still like to rake them in like I used to, of course, but in the end it just doesnt work that way. Some people get to keep those look and others dont. Theres not much I can do I guess. finasteride doesnt like me, minoxidil doesnt seem to do anything, the hair transplant road can only do so much and shaving just didnt work on my body/head. Im screwed in that department.

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Neil Strauss is a fake. Hes been repeatedly caught using escorts as his props.

Not had time to read your whole post but this guy had another 27 year old girlfriend at the same time as f*cking the 24 year old. She actually used to sneak into his house for sex while the girlfriend was there for the thrill. Crazy stuff. He certainly wasn't 'a good looking guy'. But in her words he f*cked her better than anyone else. Recently i saw her and asked if she ever saw him now that she has a steady boyfriend. Her response: "unfortunately not".
 

jd_uk

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was the dude manly? as in facial features, tall, etc?

In reasonable shape for a 50 year old but, yeah...he was 50. So not exactly oveeflowing with testosterone. Probably just under 6 foot so not short but not tall.

She commented how he looked younger and i remember being amazed at how blinded she was because to me he was just an average looking, 50 year old guy (and a bald one too). It all boiled down to the fact that he was dominant in his ways. He was her 50 shades of grey guy. She was open about how he'd bend her over his knees, spank her etc. That was the kind of sex they had. I was jealous at the time because she was hot and i couldn't understand what she saw in him.
 

shookwun

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She was just attracted to the guy, it happens all the time with who aren't objectively good-looking, you would think at least.

But through her eyes, in her mind, that guy was hot as f-ck, and that's why he easily got her, not because he was "dominant".


The dominance, and masculine demeanor he presented was only accountable after her initial physical attraction to the man. Had he presented this type of attitude to her without having a mutual connection, he would of most immediately lost his job through an HR complaint if she filed a dispute.

Right, because this man is going to talk about slapping, and choking her with his 'dominant' personality before having mutual feelings, and establishing chemistry with one another.


it's simple. She physically liked him, and vice versa. Things escalated in the safe zone, and he happened to display the manly figure in bed, and turn her into a bedroom acrobat. Square root of all this being physical attraction.

:)
 

swingline747

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In reasonable shape for a 50 year old but, yeah...he was 50. So not exactly oveeflowing with testosterone. Probably just under 6 foot so not short but not tall.

She commented how he looked younger and i remember being amazed at how blinded she was because to me he was just an average looking, 50 year old guy (and a bald one too). It all boiled down to the fact that he was dominant in his ways. He was her 50 shades of grey guy. She was open about how he'd bend her over his knees, spank her etc. That was the kind of sex they had. I was jealous at the time because she was hot and i couldn't understand what she saw in him.

again though, Im thinking exception not rule. I was always a dirty dirty boy and most girls said I was one of the best people they had in bed. I used to get the 6 month call all the time from any number of ex girls in the past whether I was single yet. Difference is though they were all psychically attracted to me initially. To think a woman is going to want to facelock with a guy who is ugly "without" some other interest such as money, authority (the teacher), some really deep affection, etc is like others have said about a guy wanting a girl who is overweight and hairy.

When youre bald height helps to. Im def not tall so that also doesnt help. Im in good shape, but all that makes me is a balding stocky guido. Not primarily first pick for most attractive women.
 

shookwun

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Height, and having a well developed physique does help, but won't get you laid unless she likes your face.
 

jd_uk

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She was just attracted to the guy, it happens all the time with who aren't objectively good-looking, you would think at least.

But through her eyes, in her mind, that guy was hot as f-ck, and that's why he easily got her, not because he was "dominant".

The reason i find this funny is because if you lot saw a photo of the guy you'd be telling everyone how such a man would never get laid or if he did he'd have to settle for an older woman with 3 kids. This guy was 50...he certainly was no bodybuilder. When i say 'in shape for a 50 year old' i mean he didn't have a huge beer gut. Facially, he looked like a slightly wrinkled, bald 50 year old man.

And this very bald, old guy was bedding to women in their 20's. This doesnt happen remember fred? These guys don't get hot girls. It feels like you're tying yourself in knots to me. Just like the guy in that soap opera...you lot would say young women would never be attracted to him..yet the specifically state (!) that it is the characters behaviour and bad boy ways which they find attractive.

Looks matter...but to say they are the only thing that matters for sexual attraction. That's at best very naive and at worst pretty damn stupid. Essentially you're writing off whole aspects of behavioural science and psychology just like that. Despite all the evidence. You always conveniently ignore it when i point out the flaws in your posts.

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again though, Im thinking exception not rule. I was always a dirty dirty boy and most girls said I was one of the best people they had in bed. I used to get the 6 month call all the time from any number of ex girls in the past whether I was single yet. Difference is though they were all psychically attracted to me initially. To think a woman is going to want to facelock with a guy who is ugly "without" some other interest such as money, authority (the teacher), some really deep affection, etc is like others have said about a guy wanting a girl who is overweight and hairy.

When youre bald height helps to. Im def not tall so that also doesnt help. Im in good shape, but all that makes me is a balding stocky guido. Not primarily first pick for most attractive women.

Exception to the rule or not, i am just using yet another example which disproves such a naive statement as 'looks is all that matters'. I mean really!?... to suggest that women don't look for any behavioural clues, any pointers as to who is the alpha male, the highest status guy. To just write off what is known about body language, to rubbish any study ever done on sexual attraction which wasn't based on looks. Fred and the like will keep clinging on our of pure stubborness but i just find it laughable.

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The dominance, and masculine demeanor he presented was only accountable after her initial physical attraction to the man. Had he presented this type of attitude to her without having a mutual connection, he would of most immediately lost his job through an HR complaint if she filed a dispute.

Right, because this man is going to talk about slapping, and choking her with his 'dominant' personality before having mutual feelings, and establishing chemistry with one another.


it's simple. She physically liked him, and vice versa. Things escalated in the safe zone, and he happened to display the manly figure in bed, and turn her into a bedroom acrobat. Square root of all this being physical attraction.

:)

I thought that based on your views she would immediately be more interested in every other NW1, testosteone bound young guy on her course instead of the 50 year old bald guy? Hey maybe physically the NW1 guy doesn't win every time after all. Right? ;)

I wasn't there at their initial interactions but to completely write off any other aspect of attraction...dominant behaviour, body language, verbal language etc etc is at best very naive. You're HONESTLY telling me that you've never come across a distinctly average looking guy who could 'talk a woman into bed'? I think deep down you, fred etc etc don't even believe what you say...for whatever reason your beliefs are stuck in your head and nothing will change them (despite the fact that i've noticed you sometimea change opinion slightly with your mood).
 

jd_uk

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The girl found this old ugly bald guy attractive. In her mind, he was attractive, she got wet over him.

The fact that he was a teacher helped a lot of course. This wouldn't never have happened if he was the school janitor.

But for this to happen, looks are still the cornerstone. You need looks to proceed further, as sex is physical, last time I checked.

Saying that behavior, personality, humor or whatever helps is a lie, a lie on which the whole PUA and self-help industries were built.

"If you do this or that, if you try hard enough, if you stand like this, you will seduce her!" Right, in your dreams Joe.

It's terribly offensive for people who genuinely struggles with women. I don't, since I'm tall and not bad-looking, but I would never tell my friend who is a redhead and below average looks-wise:

"Man, you don't get it, it's your attitude! You should be more confident! It's all your fault if women run away from you!"

You're right when you said about not being an intelligent guy/not having good credentials. Yet again for about the 4th time you ignore every point i've made because it's too difficult for you to comprehend and come out with the usual spiel. I have no doubt you will be playing the same oblivious broken record on here in another few years time. It's very apparent to me that you don't do so well with women as you protest to on here.
 

jd_uk

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There's no point to make, without looks, you cannot compensate by being funny, intelligent, dominant, or whatever.

For the hundredth time, I'm only talking about sexual attraction here. Not relationships.

And again you ignore them...

I don't mind, it's funny.
 

jd_uk

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Show me one shred of evidence that women respond to anything other than looks when it comes to sex.

Without even reading the rest of your post... i already have done. You're confusing visual stimulus with physical stimulus. Physical can be a wide range of things...such as body language, scent (the experiments which showed that we find someone who smells genetically different to us more sexually attractive). Then there are things beyond the purely physical which influence sexual attraction such as what is said or how something is said or even the situation (e.g. when people experence high anxiety situations they are more likely to be experience sexual attraction together). Voice tonality another one...women are proven to find deeper voices in men more sexually attractive. How many examples do you want? Go and educate yourself, i'm not going to do it for you because you're not bright enough to do it yourself. Visual/physical appearance matters to sexual attraction. It is part of the equation, but to say 'looks is all that matters' is the just the most stupid, naive and stubborn oversimplification. It says a lot about you that's for sure.

Your problem is that despite every time you are proved wrong, there is some voice in your head/inner belief that you can't let go of. I don't know if that is some sort of mental/behavioural issue with you or not but it's pretty clear to me that you're incapable of reason or perspective. The amount of times I've seen you claim 'bald, average looking guys don't get girls etc etc' only for to come out with some BS excuse 'but, but he's famous..or is a lecturer, or those bald guys with girls on the street are in rocky territory in their relationships'. I genuinely believe you have issues about it. But i can't keep arguing with a broken record so look i'll leave you to do your research. No doubt in 5 years time you'll be here playing the same tune and undoubtedly even more insecure as you believe that as your looks fade so goes your ability for any sexual attraction.
 

Agustin Araujo

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The face is the most important, straight forward and simple as that. Height and body are factors. You can always get well built if you're not, whether you want to improve your appearance and/or feel better about yourself. Not much can be done about height though. But again, face is the most important, and considering first impressions. Men on here like FredTheBelgian and shookwun have already proved how important attraction really is countless times, and hair as well.
 

jd_uk

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Body language can be faked.

How something is said, can be faked.

Voice tonality, can be faked to some extend.

Women have evolved so they would not be tricked into producing a weak offspring.


Imagine if all women could have been tricked into having sex with short, bald, weak men, the human race wouldn't have lasted long.

Think about it. Use your common sense.

You'd better read my posts completely.

I give up..stupidity can't be argued with. I've instantly given you many points disproving what you say (yet again) and yet again you move the goal posts. The whole f*cking point is that it is not all about looks and that sexual attraction does change with behaviour (or can be faked) as you put it. Just because this doesn't fit with your severely limited world view doesn't mean it isn't true.

You literally have no ability to debate, only to repeat. I mention behaviour, you cry 'it can be faked', i mention the studies which prove that women are more sexually attracted to deep voices (NOT A VISUAL TRAIT) and you ignore it, i give you countless examples of bald guys doing well with women and for each one you come up with a different excuse (famous, lecturer, tall, youtube fakes). The only thing I can take from it all is that you must have a double digit IQ or some type of mental issue meaning you can't see any other point of view (in which case maybe it's just not your fault).
 

Saurabhaj

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Women can be attracted even to bald..i have no objections and i accept your points...

but what happens if you fall for a particular girl and she says no because you look old because of hairloss..

This is the reason why i have came to this forum..
i have been with many girls..

but i never fall in love even when i was proposed by 3 girls..

But when i liked my girl,i was so dissapointed that i won't be good match to her..

why..hairloss..

Give me some solution..

If i like one girl...she is 24..how can i impress all her family that our couple will be liked by all..
remember..in India..whenever some one posts pic of engagement/marriage..
the only comment i see is
1)Awesome looking couple
2)Best looking couple
3)number 1 couple
4)marathi language words which meant pair made in heaven..


so how can i at so young age 29 make a 24 year old girl ready that our pair will look best in engagement,marriage,relative functions,social functions and all that..


I do not believe in concept of marrying to someone who likes you because i rejected 3 all beautiful looking girls because i want to marry the person whom i will like and who will like me simultaneously..

I had fallen in love only one time in life,got failed...
 
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tellersquill

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I have an IQ of 115.

By the way, everything I say in my posts is backed up by scientific evidence.

Voice is also genetic and can't be faked, I don't know where you're going with this.

In studies about human mating, it is established that there is a difference between short-term and long-term attraction.

Like PUA's, you're confusing them and think you can take characteristics that matter in long-term attraction and use them to have sex with a girl.

It. Doesn't. Work. You cannot tell a girl you're rich or make her laugh and expect her to get wet for you because of these.

Physical attraction is still a prerequisite for long-term attraction. If you're a short, bald, ugly Danny DeVito look-alike guy:

- It doesn't matter if you have a deep voice
- It doesn't matter if you make 100000k a year
- It doesn't matter if you are high status
- It doesn't matter if you're very, very funny
- It doesn't matter if you have a larger-than-life personality

If you want to sexually attract a girl. All that will matter is your face (hair included since hair loss f-cks up your facial proportions), your height and your natural build.

If you want a long-term relationship (ie. exchange your money, status and highly entertaining personality for sex), then yes, all of these will matter to an extent.

But! Being physically decent for the girl (ie. her type) is still required.

I very much disagree with this. I have plenty of 'ugly' friends with good looking partners.

Also, there are plenty of good looking guys who do not get women. I'm decent looking and I'd only slept with three people by age 21 because I was too shy. When I manned up, became confident, that is when I got with more women. Sure, looks helped but it wasn't essential.

I think you just need to be average looking to get women.

Of course if you look like a troll and you don't look after yourself then you wont get many women looking your way.
 
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tellersquill

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You approached more women, so you got more women.

So, approaching more women improves your chances to get a girlfriend.

Genius.

Good looking partners! Read my post again, you're talking about long-term attraction here.

You don't have plenty of ugly friends who can get sex regularly with hot women, right?

Of course not. As I've said, looks are still important in long-term attraction, but you can help your case with your other qualities.

You still need to be relatively decent though. And if you're not, you'd better have a very high status, loads of money, and a larger-than-life personality to compensate for it.

I don't believe in magic. And I don't believe in short, ugly, bald men with no status (large social circle) and no money getting hot girlfriends. That's never going to happen.

But most people are average - hence the term average.

If you take a guy who is, say, a 7, and then you take away his hair his face and body will remain the same but maybe he goes down to a 6. Being a 6 still means he can get women. Sure it may mean he struggles to get 10s but, as we men should all know, these knock out 9s and 10s are often high maintence and trouble.
 

rocklegends

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I agree with Fred here.

I have an IQ of 115.

By the way, everything I say in my posts is backed up by scientific evidence.

Voice is also genetic and can't be faked, I don't know where you're going with this.

In studies about human mating, it is established that there is a difference between short-term and long-term attraction.

Like PUA's, you're confusing them and think you can take characteristics that matter in long-term attraction and use them to have sex with a girl.

It. Doesn't. Work. You cannot tell a girl you're rich or make her laugh and expect her to get wet for you because of these.

Physical attraction is still a prerequisite for long-term attraction. If you're a short, bald, ugly Danny DeVito look-alike guy:

- It doesn't matter if you have a deep voice
- It doesn't matter if you make 100000k a year
- It doesn't matter if you are high status
- It doesn't matter if you're very, very funny
- It doesn't matter if you have a larger-than-life personality

If you want to sexually attract a girl. All that will matter is your face (hair included since hair loss f-cks up your facial proportions), your height and your natural build.

If you want a long-term relationship (ie. exchange your money, status and highly entertaining personality for sex), then yes, all of these will matter to an extent.

But! Being physically decent for the girl (ie. her type) is still required.

Fred, I'm afraid you are wasting your time with this individual. Its apparent that he will not acquiesce nor acknowledge some of the critical factors you brought up, so catering to the minutae is just an inefficient use of your time, since the only thing it seems to yield is an irascible response.

Now, to serve as the objective voice in the room of the dialogue, I would opt to side with Fred on this one. The primary critique that I tend to have here is that folks are bringing up exceptions to the rule rather than conventional examples in the 50th percentile. One of the thing they teach you in analysis is to ignore the aberrational factors when building a prospectus or thesis. The same would apply here. JD, throughout the commentary, you are using singular instances to justify a particular affirmation (celebrities, tv stars, one off incidences, singular assertions). All of these are immaterial to the broader scope, primarily because of insufficient sample size to forward materiality.

One of the primary things to question here when it comes to folks dealing with androgenic alopecia is this: why is it that there are almost always compensating factors and coping arguments embedded to forward attractiveness? Why is it that lifting is a prerequisite? Growing facial hair? Dressing nicely? Being confident? Why aren't these prerequisites to the converse argument for the individual who has hair? To that end, let's posit that the individual with a full head of hair has all of these characteristics. In such a scenario, ceteris paribus, the selection is nearly unequivocally to the latter rather than the former.

In a circular lumen de lumine allegory, one would opt to remit to a full head of hair over a bald head in 99.99% of cases if indeed that option was a possibility in this distinct case study. If we apply this as the fundamental principle, all the trickle downs only serve the purpose of coping tactics employed by the cognitive defense mechanism as a modality of pain avoidance. Eventually, most folks realize (either voluntarily or involuntarily) that they are an inherent disadvantage within specific circumstances, and with that either comes terminal forlorn disposition or acceptance.

Is it impossible for someone who is bald to have a relationship? No, I don't believe so. Is it possible for them to get a job? yes, absolutely. Is it possible for them to bed women spontaneously? Rare but I have seen it happen in my escapades. However, you have to understand that the societal framework necessitates that individuals in the 50th percentile, extending to 3 standard deviations of a normal distribution, are all at an inherent disadvantage framed to 1-3+ pegs below their respective counterparts with full heads of hair in a spontaneous environment.

PUA and cognitive deception are deceitful shams, and one would realize this if they had more experience with women. You can't trick someone into thinking that they are attracted to you when they aren't (that would be some killer hypnosis if indeed that is the case. There is however a name for this, and that is a sedative :p). PUA and its surrogates rely on the rules of entropy and arbitrage: capturing the rules of dishevel and disorder to capture a market inefficiency. The caveat to this is that inefficiencies are ephemeral in nature, and are quickly closed as everyone attempts to take advantage. Sure, there may be first mover advantage for a bald due who utilizes PUA, but what if their respective counterpart then incorporates it as well? In every one of these scenarios, neutralization is via the mode of the inherent and distinct disadvantage on the attraction scale, and objective analysis will always lead to this inevitable conclusion.

I've seen many individuals on the site in my brief time here suggesting what you are as well, JD. (shookwun to my recollection used to have these debates with fred, suggesting that masculinity would be the equalizer, until he arrived to the conclusion that all is immaterial because there will always be someone with hair with the same characteristics. The qualities aren't mutually exclusive across the spectrum...) Yes, there are anomalies, but these individuals would be more attractive with hair, and still outdone if someone similar with hair comes along. This isn't served as a disparaging remark, but as a reminder that casting blanket judgments that effect is immaterial is unfair to a very large cohort of folks comprising of this site. One cannot know their particular hair loss situation, progression, or cognitive function as a result of the depression. We are also unable to know of cultural norms and tendencies of the particular population. Finally, we are also not privy to their personal anecdotes (Fred to my recollection is a tremendous source for the personal anecdotes, which tend to fall in line with what I am trying to tell you right now)

Attraction is usually instantaneous and mutual. There was one occasion where there was a mutual acknowledgement of attraction without either of us having to say anything. PUA and being the loud confident man in the room might help in a survivorship bias case, but its efficacy in forwarding your one night stand prospects are immaterial for the broader scope.
 
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tellersquill

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They're not for the good-looking men they go out with.

Because they feel lucky and are behave like trained puppies in front of these men.

If an average guy tries to punch above his weight, of course the girl is going to feel high-maintenance.

She will never be sure that she made the right choice, she will always feel that she deserves better, etc.

Not quite the recipe for a happy relationship.

Maybe. I'm decent looking but in my experience the 9s and 10s are all high maintinence.

I'd much rather have a 7 who is nice, good personality, and appreciates me.
 

jd_uk

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Voice is also genetic and can't be faked, I don't know where you're going with this.


Read this carefully with your 115 IQ.

Statement: "Physical appearance (looks) are the only factor (all that matter) in gaining sexual attraction from a woman."

Disproof by contradiction:

"Women are more sexually attracted to men with deep voices (Hint: the voice is not visual (looks). Therefore your statement is factually incorrect.)

http://m.huffpost.com/us/entry/deepvoiced-men-have_n_4109673.html

Disproof by contradiction:

"Human scent plays a role in sexual attraction" (Hint: sexual attraction is non visual ("looks")

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Body_odour_and_sexual_attraction

Face it Fred, you are quite simply wrong. The above is absolute proof. No ifs or buts about it. I suggest any career you choose doesn't involve reasoning, logic or critical thinking.

And let's not forget all the blanket statements you have made about bald men only to be given many counter examples. Just feeble excuses every time.

Further to all this, I would absolutely love to hear you try and tell evolutionary biologists and body language experts that humans don't respond to each others behaviour, verbal cues and body language, either sexually or otherwise.

It's incredible how someone can be so wrong yet can cling on so dearly to a belief which they have held for years. And i think i am starting to understand why. For years, maybe on an almost daily basis, you have rereated the same erroneous statements to people on a forum who share the same views as you and from that you have got more and more validation. So much validation that you're blind to anything else.
 

jd_uk

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It's also been shown that when women see the men of which they liked the smell, surprise! They match looks-wise.

And even then, how does this information help you? Are you going to spray pheromones on yourself or something?

In the end, it's always looks. Have you ever heard a woman saying, "OMG I had sex with because he smelled so good!"

Great,well considered retort pal. Well done.

I'll leave you preach to the others. Can an admin change this guys name to 'FredTheBelgianParrot'?
 
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