Deadlock's Story - (21yo hair problems w/PICS. dutasteride & minoxidil)

[deadlocks]

Hello people. First of all, what a great website / forum :bravo: Truely, this is the best place to go on the internet if your having hairproblems. No doubt.

That aside, I'm of coarse not happy to find my hairline receding at this age. At this point, it's only the temples or front area that are problematic. Up untill recently I've always been able to hide my high forhead well with my long hair. It has grown thinner since last year however, and I'm not happy about it as you can imagine.

I still have my long hair. In fact, it's longer than ever and I like it a lot. At least, on the days it falls well. I always had to correct my hair a couple of times by "brushing" my hands through it (no mather the lenght) but as years went by I had to do it more often, whereas now I basically do it al day long (say, once every 10 minutes). It's not really frustating me, but it could be better, and yet it's looking like it'll be a lot worse.

I have some bad photos here I posted on a dutch forum a month or so back (I'm from the Netherlands) which I'll upload here. The angles might be bad, and I have made new pictures but I can't upload them to the pc yet, cause I'm using my parent's pc for the time being.

Top of my hair:
http://j.imagehost.org/view/0255/SP_A0013
The haircut itself:
http://j.imagehost.org/view/0586/Combover
Front view (tightly pulled back):
http://j.imagehost.org/view/0679/SP_A0021
Left side recesion:
http://j.imagehost.org/view/0960/SP_A0006
Right side recesion:
http://j.imagehost.org/view/0466/SP_A0003
Front view (loosely pulled back):
http://j.imagehost.org/view/0424/SP_A0005

Family history: on my mother's side yeah. Both grandparents from mother's side had male patterned baldness. Though my grandma had it cause she had a hormonal imbalance, don't know if it counts. My grandpa on mother's side I never knew personally. Uncle from mother's side is about a NW4 to 5 in his mid fifties.
No history of hairloss in my father's side of the family. Maybe a bit of age related recesion. My father himself has mild recesion as well, and has a similair hairline like me (though he's 48 now) but might be losing it later on top as well (looks thin, though it hasn't got worse in years).

For further information, here is a picture from when I was 15. Believe it or not, this was my teenage hairline (censured my whole face here cause it was a horrible picture besides the hairline, believe me):

http://img686.imageshack.us/i/naamloosxd.jpg/

Might be difficult to see, but it's there nonetheless. Was I already going bald when I was 15?- is what I asked myself when I saw this picture. :dunno: As far as I know, I always had problems styling my hair.

Anyways, here is me at 12 (has anyone ever had thinning hair since their 12th? Eyes centured here as well, as the only thing they show was "I play too much Nintendo"): http://img16.imageshack.us/i/naamloosbg.jpg/

So I'm really curious what you guys think?

Currently, I am taking Finasteride daily. And even Dutasteride 2 times a week. 5% Kirkland minoxidil in the morning and night, and Saw Palmetto in the night or just after working out (dunno why really, is there more DHT in your blood after excercising???). I drink green tea all day, and try to eat loads of protein.

Also, I want to say that everyone who's fighting against hairloss here should keep it up! We might be the first generation to keep our hair intact! Survive, cause we got a story to tell our childeren and grandchilderen! unk:

EDIT: I see the images are not working. I'm removing the [ img ] tags now, so I'm sorry you guys will have to click the link to see my pictures. :whistle:

 

[deadlocks]

Re: Deadlock's Story - (19/ hair problems w/PICS)

Many views, but no replies? :dunno:

I see the topic's name has changed. Sorry if I might've come over as a dick before, but I'm just really stressed out cause of this situation. I'd like to hear what you people think.

 

[eth0]

Re: Deadlock's Story - (19/ hair problems w/PICS)

It looks like male pattern baldness to me.

It seems like you're doing the right thing taking finasteride, although i'd drop the dutasteride if I were you. You're too young to be taking such strong medication in my opinion.

How long have you been on the finasteride for?

 

[deadlocks]

Re: Deadlock's Story - (19/ hair problems w/PICS)

I've been taking finasteride since October last year aproximently. Rarely have any side effects (I say rarely, cause perhaps I do have them but it's not all that bad) so that and increased hairloss last month got me to add Dutasteride to my regime. I've heard it has even less side effects than finasteride does, but then again it hasn't been officially tested yet has it?

I was thinking of adding either spironolactone or any other topical DHT blocker to my regime as well, so I got the problem coffered in all areas. Will go to the docter's office to today to see if he can get me Nizoral (wouldn't know how to get it elsewhere, as I live in Europe).

And I'll be 20 in a month and a week or so. Yes I might be 'too young' for Dutasteride, but then again, I think I'm also too young to lose my hair. So I like to take the risk. Besides, how much is 2 times a week gonna hurt?

I'm also going to take Kelp, Aloe Vera and Iron supplements a few times a week and see how it works out. As well as wheatgrass sap, nuts and seeds. Maybe I'll even become a veggeratian (but still eat fish, chicken as well) in the long run. I just... really wanna keep my hair.

 

[cuebald]

Re: Deadlock's Story - (19/ hair problems w/PICS)

Did you post on Haarweb then ? =)
(This is a big rambling post and not all of it is relevant btw)

Man, it's hard to say in your case whether you have male pattern baldness or a mature hairline.

First pic looks very thick, no problems.
Second pic can't really tell, too far away
Third pic - looks bad, heavily receded and evidence of miniaturisation. It could look like this just because you've tightly pulled back, so perhaps the image looks worse than it actually is (i.e. if it looked like that normally, that'd be NW3.5)
forth pic - again showing signs of recession way past a mature hairline - NW2.5 easily.
fifth pic - this doesn't actually look that bad. NW2? Signs of miniaturisation - but some people naturally have a lot of wispy hairs in the temples
Final front on pic - NW2, bordering on NW2.5.

Everyone is different though, so for all I can tell this could be your mature hairline. If you posted the 15 year old picture here with no description, I'd have said to jump on finasteride.

Your genetics are 50/50. Could go either way.
Do you shed a lot? (Did you shed a lot before you went on finasteride?)
I'd probably go on dutasteride twice a week in your shoes also, as long as I was sure that I'd basically finished puberty (i.e. had finished growing, etc.) Beware that finasteride/dutasteride will inhibit your body hair growth, as that is sensitive to DHT too.
I wouldn't go on dutasteride more than twice a week.
finasteride hasn't really given me any side effects at all.
Would definitely get some nizoral too. Can't hurt.

Unfortunately there aren't really any treatments other than the "Big 3" (finasteride, nizoral and minoxidil) - and you can see from the other stories here that even they don't work for everyone. I personally have taken Oral Spironolactone (200mg/day) and that was a little too heavy for me (I am 24). It gave me gyno (breast tissue about 2" in diameter, 1/2" thick and very sensitive nipples). It also feminized my body slightly - given me fat deposits on the hips. Sad thing is I don't even give a sh*t about that, that's how bad I hate male pattern baldness (I stopped it though as it was a crazy thing to do)

I've never heard of anyone getting sides from Topical spironolactone, but then I've never heard of it being very effective either. Usually what happens from here is people buy Toppik, use that until their hair is too thin even for that, and then they shave it all off. If you don't respond to current treatments, you're pretty much out of luck, unless you're willing to go down the hair transplant route (head over to the Impact section and talk to dudemon and the others for their thoughts on hair transplant's)

 

[deadlocks]

Re: Deadlock's Story - (19/ hair problems w/PICS)

Yeah I post there. My username there is Fallen Dreams. Post there quite a lot actually.

I've just made these pics a few minutes ago. Sorry that they're upside down, I tried to change it by rotating the image but it somehow couldn't stay like that. I've just applied the 5% minoxidil of Kirkland in my hair, so maybe it looks just a bit worse but here it is:

Front view:

Side view:

Other side view:


And found a good pic for my hair from when I was 13 as well:
13_1.bmp (167 KB)

As you can see, there's not even a eye brow to be seen on that picture. So my head is actually giant's size. Used to hear that a lot on school as well.

And here are two pictures. Both pictures where taken when I was still 16. Needles to say is that I always hated the wind. And even though I'm rarely on pictures, my hairline was almost ALWAYS exposed on a view of them.




And when I was 17:



It has deffinatly gone worse over the years though. Needles to say that of coarse. I don't think this is a mature hairline no more either.

So twice a week duta is good then? Yeah, I'm pretty sure I've stopped growing. Could have stopped growing since 16 already. So basically, I could take the medications. I rarely have side-effects from them anyway. I'd like to say that I don't have them at all even. So in that way, I'm lucky. With my hairline I'm not, I guess. :thumbdown2:

I do not shed a lot anymore though. A month before I went on finasteride, hair was EVERYWHERE. When I got on finasteride, it was slightly less. So yeah, this deffinatly is male pattern baldness. Maybe still in the earliest stage, but it's it none the less.

So basically what you're suggesting me to do is to buy Toppik??? And then cut it all of when it's too thin for that as well? I'll not have peace with that I gurantee you that. Besides, you can only tell if the medication works after a few years or so right? I'm roughly 9 months on finasteride now, and hairloss has basically stabalised, or at least been a lot less aggressive since then.

So I think I should see that as a good sign. Hair around the hairline is somewhat thicker as well. Then again it's a lot longer than before. Long hair has always worked better for me. Hell, I might even have slight regrowth at the temples even, and I'm just 1 and a half months on 5% minoxidil (been on 2% since September 09 though). Been losing more hair since last month though, but this has also stopped.

Spironolactone or any other topical DHT blocker I still want to try before giving up. Hell, I'm willing to try everything before giving up. Even hair transplants. Though I'm far to young to consider doing one now, I could do one in say.. 5 years or so right?

I've also read before that men shouldn't take Oral Spironolactone. Only women should. So it's no suprise you saw some side effects. At least, that's what I've read. And I'm doing a whole lot of research actually. So we men should stick with the topical version.

Heard something about Aminixil as well. It would protect the hair roots from falling out, and make more minerals and vitamins going from the blood into the scalp, basically 'feeding' the hair. It's yet another topical treathment, but I might also give that a try in the furture along with spironolactone. Cause it's actually quite easy to get.

And I might get my Nizoral today from the doctor's. But my question is... what does it do to prevent baldness anyway? I've used a Ketocansol(sp?) based shampoo before and I thought it might help (though, how can you tell if your also using minoxidil / finasteride?) or at least help against the little inflammation I sometimes had, but what is the link between inflammation and baldness?

So my future plan:
- Might get on Dutasteride alone. For now, I think I'm going with the 2 x a week for at least half a year and see how it works.
- Read more about spironolactone / Aminixil and maybe get it into my regime as well.
- Keep eating healthy (nuts, seeds and other protein sources, no fast food no more)
- Maybe a hairtransplantation in the future. 25 is the minimal age I'm thinking of (5 years almost from now as I'm almost 20)

 

[Vanzzzz]

Re: Deadlock's Story - (19/ hair problems w/PICS)

Hey I think your temple hair loss is pretty similar to zeroheat. Check out his thread. I am planning on following his regimen since my loss is somewhat similar to his though slightly less severe. Hope your regimen works for you.

 

[nickypoos]

Re: Deadlock's Story - (19/ hair problems w/PICS)

Meh, im a year younger than you i take dutasteride every day dont sweat it. I'll let you know if i die or something.

 

[deadlocks]

Re: Deadlock's Story - (19/ hair problems w/PICS)

I'm thinking of doing that to now. Especially since my hair is thinning too much. I can take the recession of the hairline but the thinning is the worst now.

And I tried getting Nirozal shampoo yesterday, but the doctor's prescibed me with another Ketoconazol shampoo of their own brand. My question was if this should make any difference from Nizoral? Or is it strictly Nizoral only for hairloss?

 

[nickypoos]

Re: Deadlock's Story - (19/ hair problems w/PICS)

And I tried getting Nirozal shampoo yesterday, but the doctor's prescibed me with another Ketoconazol shampoo of their own brand. My question was if this should make any difference from Nizoral? Or is it strictly Nizoral only for hairloss?

Nizoral isn't necessarily "for hair loss" it’s prescribed as an anti-dandruff shampoo. As long as it’s a keto shampoo it really makes no difference. (Go for 2% keto if you have the choice)

 

[deadlocks]

Re: Deadlock's Story - (19/ hair problems w/PICS)

Dunno. It's generic Ketoconazol. But the bottle says it has 20 ml Ket. for 60 ml shampoo. Or at least, something like that.

 

[deadlocks]

Re: Deadlock's Story - (19/ hair problems w/PICS)

Got some more pictures here. Just taken a few minutes ago, with better light. As before, some pictures are rotated, and I couldn't change it. Included pics of the top and the crown as well. Please tell me what you think.


(This might be from a strange angle, but it's the hairline from an tilted above view. Looks pretty damn bad to me to be honest.)





(The crown)

 

[deadlocks]

Re: Deadlock's Story - (20/ hair problems w/PICS)

Small update: During the summer, I noticed my hair was a little thicker than the year before. So I believe medications are working for me. I even have some slight regrowth at the temples, where new hairs are deffinatly growing where they weren't before. Yet they aren't as thick, long and don't cover up the spots as well as I wanted. I'm also diffuse thinning in the front now, but it's not so bad yet. And I apply a little more minoxidil there now.

Think I'm using a bit too much of Kirkland's minoxidil though. I think I use the product now for roughly 4,5 months, but I'm now using my 10th bottle already. I really like the product, but I don't like how it takes so long to dry up and leaving my hair in a terrible state in the meanwhile. I heard Rogaine was better for this?

Does it make any difference if I would order Rogaine from now on and keep using it? Essentially, both Kirkland and Rogaine are just 5% minoxidil sollutions, but I wonder if the slight change in formula would make any difference? Also, I switched from Finasteride to Dutasteride daily. How much of a difference would that be making?

Also been messing around with olive oil in my hair. Heard it had anti inflammatory properties at the scalp, and also prevented DHT and T from binding in the follicles. I just thought to give it a try as I always was interested in using topical anti androgens like spironolactone. But would this really work? Lots of conditioners, shampoos and other hair products have olive oil in it.. So I'm guessing it should be good in some way. But for hairloss? Anyone?

EDIT: As for anyone moderating these threads, I've turned 20 last month. Began thinning and losing temple hairs at like.. 16, 17 years old I think. Another positive thing might be that at those ages, I constantly shedded a lot of hairs while I now rarely find one anywhere. While last year at this time exactly, I experienced HUGE sheddings.

 

[ivangennaro]

Re: Deadlock's Story - (19/ hair problems w/PICS)

Frontal hair is the hardest place to get results from what I see. Good luck with your treatment. If I were you, I'd jump onto zeroheat's thread who had the same problem with you.

 

[deadlocks]

Re: Deadlock's Story - (19/ hair problems w/PICS)

I've checked him out. He's got a similair regime as me. Nickypoos also had some good results with Duta alone. Regrew most of his hair. I'm trying to do a combination of both.

Still, what you think about Kirkland to Rogaine? Should I expect a new shedding when I start Rogaine? (didn't had it when I switched from my doctor's 2% to Kirkland's 5% so..)

 

[deadlocks]

Re: Deadlock's Story - (19/ hair problems w/PICS)

Hey, small update. Shedding now currently, but this is what my hairline looks like now:

Can someone confirm wether this is regrowth or I am just imagining things?

EDIT: It seems like many people always visit my thread, yet no one ever replies?? :dunno:

 

[deadlocks]

Re: Deadlock's Story - (19/ hair problems w/PICS)

Another picture:

What can I expect?

 

[iamme_]

Re: Deadlock's Story - (19/ hair problems w/PICS)

bro ur hairline definetly looks alot better compared to your older pics. btw i also have exact same type of hair loss as you. i ve been using proscar and i had good results for the first 3-4 months and then shedding started again. i am also trying to switch to dutasteride.

did u notice if ur hairs got better being on dutasteride? and if yes then how long it took them after u first started dutasteride. + where you got ur dutasteride from
thanks

 

[deadlocks]

Re: Deadlock's Story - (19/ hair problems w/PICS)

bro ur hairline definetly looks alot better compared to your older pics. btw i also have exact same type of hair loss as you. i ve been using proscar and i had good results for the first 3-4 months and then shedding started again. i am also trying to switch to dutasteride.

did u notice if ur hairs got better being on dutasteride? and if yes then how long it took them after u first started dutasteride. + where you got ur dutasteride from
thanks

Thanks for your input. I appriciate it a lot.

If your shedding now, I wouldn't switch the medications. The shedding is most likely from the medications you take now, so ride it out untill you see improvement. That's what I did when I was on finasteride, so I switched to dutasteride when I got my regrowth.

I got my Dutasteride from some guy living around my area. Met him on a Dutch hairloss forum. I've always got my medications through that forum. I don't know if you should buy the meds online, cause it might be fake especially when it's really cheap. I'd suggest try finding someone who'll send you it from here on the forums.

I did notice thickening, still notice it a lot. My hair is a lot thicker now, but I'm worried a lot about the hairline, and got some diffuse and crown thinning now to. Then again, up untill recently (2, 3 months or so) I never really applied minoxidil to those areas (top, and crown). Hair on the hairline is also thicker, but there seems to be less hairs. Hope I'll regrow them soon.

 

[deadlocks]

Re: Deadlock's Story - (19/ hair problems w/PICS)

Got some more pictures. First two are with minoxidil liquid applied. All pics where taken today.