Exploring The Hormonal Route. Hair=life.

[Marky]

your head must smell lovely lol.

if you don't mind having gyno. but it depends how bad your hairloss is. probably best to start with dutasteride first and add the gel next if it you don't get results.

if yoy do try, Id say 1.5mg. If you only put it on the temples i think .75mg twice a day is probably better for absorbtion. Estrogen will cause less testicular activity which means less testosterone and estrogen will be produced from the testicles. however, ive never heard of it decreasing aromatase, it might actually increase aromatase cause it can make it easier to gain fat.

what strength of minoxidil are you taking, I'm seeing 5 and 10mg pills - and everyday?

 

[Marky]

You might as well choose one and stick with it. Taking 2-3 a week will confuse your body because the half life isn’t a that long. Just take it every day.

wow half life is about 4 hours - sounds like it's better to stick with a topical.

 

[Georgie]

wow half life is about 4 hours - sounds like it's better to stick with a topical.

Actually it’s 24 hours but closer to 6 hours for hair, and everyone that I I’ve seen who uses it gets better results. But do what you want. Your hair.

 

[Marky]

Actually it’s 24 hours but closer to 6 hours for hair, and everyone that I I’ve seen who uses it gets better results. But do what you want. Your hair.

ya I guess, I'm only seeing 5 and 10mg, is that too strong, maybe a 10mg once a week?

 

[Georgie]

ya I guess, I'm only seeing 5 and 10mg, is that too strong, maybe a 10mg once a week?

I would not start on 10mg. I would start with 2.5mg which is 10mg quartered, see how you tolerate it and increase your dose to see how your body reacts.

 

[bridgeburn]

Are those hairs thinner at the end, or the same thickness throughout (assuming you didn't get a haircut in the meantime)?

hmmm, It looks like the same thickness but I trim my hair regularly

ya I guess, I'm only seeing 5 and 10mg, is that too strong, maybe a 10mg once a week?

I was taking 10mg a day, recently I switched to 10mg every other day.

Actually it’s 24 hours but closer to 6 hours for hair

what?! lol

 

[Georgie]

hmmm, It looks like the same thickness but I trim my hair regularly

I was taking 10mg a day, recently I switched to 10mg every other day.

what?! lol

Antihypertensive effect lasts 24 hours, hair stimulatory effect is 6, going off all the things I have read

 

[Marky]

hmmm, It looks like the same thickness but I trim my hair regularly

I was taking 10mg a day, recently I switched to 10mg every other day.

what?! lol

sheesh you are hardcore, other than male related problems to you have days where you just don't feel good being on all this stuff?
you don't think about cancer all these chemicals might cause?

 

[bridgeburn]

you don't think about cancer all these chemicals might cause?

I'm reducing my risk of prostate cancer by using this stuff! and breast cancer can actually be treated with higher doses of estrogen!
Hahahahaha

"estrogens stimulate the growth and accelerate the progression of ER-positive breast cancer.[35][36] In accordance, antiestrogens like the selective estrogen receptor modulator (SERM) tamoxifen, the ER antagonist fulvestrant, and the aromatase inhibitors (AIs) anastrozole and exemestane are all effective in the treatment of ER-positive breast cancer.[37][38][39] Antiestrogens are also effective in the prevention of breast cancer.[40][41][42] Paradoxically, high-dose estrogen therapy is effective in the treatment of breast cancer as well and has about the same degree of effectiveness as antiestrogen therapy, although it is far less commonly used due to adverse effects.[43][44] The usefulness of high-dose estrogen therapy in the treatment of ER-positive breast cancer is attributed to a bimodal effect in which high concentrations of estrogens signal breast cancer cells to undergo apoptosis, in contrast to lower concentrations of estrogens which stimulate their growth.[43][44]"

sheesh you are hardcore, other than male related problems to you have days where you just don't feel good being on all this stuff?

I feel pretty good actually. But I think the 10mg minoxidil a day was making me itchy.

 

[Marky]

I'm reducing my risk of prostate cancer by using this stuff! and breast cancer can actually be treated with higher doses of estrogen!
Hahahahaha

"estrogens stimulate the growth and accelerate the progression of ER-positive breast cancer.[35][36] In accordance, antiestrogens like the selective estrogen receptor modulator (SERM) tamoxifen, the ER antagonist fulvestrant, and the aromatase inhibitors (AIs) anastrozole and exemestane are all effective in the treatment of ER-positive breast cancer.[37][38][39] Antiestrogens are also effective in the prevention of breast cancer.[40][41][42] Paradoxically, high-dose estrogen therapy is effective in the treatment of breast cancer as well and has about the same degree of effectiveness as antiestrogen therapy, although it is far less commonly used due to adverse effects.[43][44] The usefulness of high-dose estrogen therapy in the treatment of ER-positive breast cancer is attributed to a bimodal effect in which high concentrations of estrogens signal breast cancer cells to undergo apoptosis, in contrast to lower concentrations of estrogens which stimulate their growth.[43][44]"


I feel pretty good actually. But I think the 10mg minoxidil a day was making me itchy.

yeah true, DHT is the bane of a males existence, everyone should make it their priority to nuke it, we'd all have a prostate of gold.
While estrogen could make us look like we should be singing in a boy band.

 

[Marky]

I'm reducing my risk of prostate cancer by using this stuff! and breast cancer can actually be treated with higher doses of estrogen!
Hahahahaha

"estrogens stimulate the growth and accelerate the progression of ER-positive breast cancer.[35][36] In accordance, antiestrogens like the selective estrogen receptor modulator (SERM) tamoxifen, the ER antagonist fulvestrant, and the aromatase inhibitors (AIs) anastrozole and exemestane are all effective in the treatment of ER-positive breast cancer.[37][38][39] Antiestrogens are also effective in the prevention of breast cancer.[40][41][42] Paradoxically, high-dose estrogen therapy is effective in the treatment of breast cancer as well and has about the same degree of effectiveness as antiestrogen therapy, although it is far less commonly used due to adverse effects.[43][44] The usefulness of high-dose estrogen therapy in the treatment of ER-positive breast cancer is attributed to a bimodal effect in which high concentrations of estrogens signal breast cancer cells to undergo apoptosis, in contrast to lower concentrations of estrogens which stimulate their growth.[43][44]"


I feel pretty good actually. But I think the 10mg minoxidil a day was making me itchy.

bridge this is going to be you once it's all said and done

 

[Topher]

your head must smell lovely lol.

if you don't mind having gyno. but it depends how bad your hairloss is. probably best to start with dutasteride first and add the gel next if it you don't get results.

if yoy do try, Id say 1.5mg. If you only put it on the temples i think .75mg twice a day is probably better for absorbtion. Estrogen will cause less testicular activity which means less testosterone and estrogen will be produced from the testicles. however, ive never heard of it decreasing aromatase, it might actually increase aromatase cause it can make it easier to gain fat.

Thanks I will just start the Dutastride see how that goes. Like you were saying increasing aromatase likley since there is more free T due to less converversion to DHT. The smell from onion juice became quite noticeable in the sauna lol, even after washing it off of course.

 

[bridgeburn]

bridge this is going to be you once it's all said and done
View attachment 80770

I hope I can get that hairline but i dont think his short on sides and only super bushy on top look would fit me.

 

[Georgie]

Hey @bridgeburn I saw my gyn today and had a chat about non birth control hrt, wanting to know if I could take an equivalent dose of 17B estradiol (progynova) to Diane35. Basically he said that it’s almlost impossible, because as I originally thought, the ethinyl estradiol in Diane is actually like 8-10x more potent. I would need to be taking like 10-12mg of 17B a day to match it, which is unheard of. I’d also need to take a progestin with it, and essentially none of the ones used in hrt (apart from some of the ones in combined birth control like CPA), and all male hormone derivative progesterones. So very high androgen index. Not good. If I were to make the switch, I would be taking a significantly lower dose of estrogen, and because females cannot take E without progesterone, I’d also basically be taking androgens. So I have a script for a bunch of 17B anyway. I’m thinking about staying on Diane and making my own 1% 17B topical. It dissolves at around 2mg/ml in ehtanol and 25mg/ml in dsmo. I’ve read that glycos deliver the best penetration, so I’m still wondering how I should go about making a base and how doses for a 1% solution. This is working off the low local follicle estrogen theory. If it’s a bust I’ll just take the sh*t orally.

 

[bridgeburn]

ethinyl estradiol in Diane is actually like 8-10x more potent. I would need to be taking like 10-12mg of 17B a day to match it,

If it's 10x more potent then 3.5mcg in a diane pill is equivalent to to 3.5mg E2, not 10-12

like 10-12mg of 17B a day to match it, which is unheard of.

actually i have heard of that Lol.

I’d also need to take a progestin with it, and essentially none of the ones used in hrt (apart from some of the ones in combined birth control like CPA), and all male hormone derivative progesterones. So very high androgen index.

You dont have to take synthetic progesterone, just take bio identical. It competively combines with 5ar. I think it might help.

 

[Georgie]

If it's 10x more potent then 3.5mcg in a diane pill is equivalent to to 3.5mg E2, not 10-12

actually i have heard of that Lol.

You dont have to take synthetic progesterone, just take bio identical. It competively combines with 5ar. I think it might help.

Nah my gyn confirmed that it’s like 10-12mg 17b to match the pill.
Bioidentical are still androgenise to a degree. I’m kind of stuck on the pill.

 

[bridgeburn]

my gyn confirmed that it’s like 10-12mg 17b to match the pill.

I don't believe your gyn. I've heard too many different numbers about the equivalents, 5 times 10 times 100 times. I don't know what to believe.

Ive even heard this: "The effect of EE relative to estradiol differs in different tissues. In the pituitary, it is about 120 times more potent, in the liver 500-1500 more potent."

maybe it has some aevantages over 17b and maybe 17b has some advantages over it as well. I dont think it can accurately be converted to equivalency. its technically a different molecule.

Bioidentical are still androgenise to a degree.

what? how?

 

[Georgie]

I don't believe your gyn. I've heard too many different numbers about the equivalents, 5 times 10 times 100 times. I don't know what to believe.

Ive even heard this: The effect of EE relative to estradiol differs in different tissues. In the pituitary, it is about 120 times more potent, in the liver 500-1500 more potent.
maybe it has some aevantages over 17b and maybe 17b has some advantages over it as well. I dont think it can accurately be converted to equivalency. its technically a different molecule.

what? how?[/
I can’t remeber how but my gyn was saying that unless they’re a newer class of specifically antiandrogenic progestin like cpa then they have androgenic properties.

I’m a bit lost too. Estrogen is difficult and it’s fucked me over more than once. I’m really interested to see what making my own topical out of 17b might yield though.

 

[Marky]

I hope I can get that hairline but i dont think his short on sides and only super bushy on top look would fit me.

If someone offered me hair like that by simply using meds I would take it in a heart beat, and I'm 41, then maybe stop by the barber for a little trim on top.
Maybe something like this would be more suitable and realistic for you:

 

[Jesse Navarro]

If i had 41 i would kill to have the hair Lloyd Cole has now.