Exploring The Hormonal Route. Hair=life.

[Ephemeral-Kitten]

It has to do with the expression of igf1, not estrogen. Antiandrogens will alter igf1 in the liver. Try to search igf1 and its effect on the frontal or back region of the scalp and which case favors which.

It can be debated if estrogenic gene transcription is related to hair growth cycles in a manner which initiates hair regrowth. However, that was not the point of my post. The point, rather, is that without aromatase T can act very much like DHT at the follicle and that because T without cyp19 up-regulates the AR mRNA, then in the specific case of scalp tissue significantly deficient in cyp19aromatase 5ARis like finasteride/dutasteride can be significantly less effective, if not counter-effective.

"Even more conclusive results were obtained in proliferating RP-SMC (Fig. 4, right panel), where T in the presence of finasteride (lane 5), but not T by itself (lane 3), decreased considerably AR mRNA levels, as compared to the control with 500 nM finasteride (lane 2). Again, fadrazole eliminated this effect (lane 6), estradiol (lane 7) was a more active down-regulator than T in the presence of finasteride, and DHT (lane 8) enhanced the intensity of the AR mRNA band. Fadrazole by itself did not affect it (lane 4)."

Fadrazole is an aromatase inhibitor. In other words, AIs eliminate the down-regulatory effects of T in target tissue. Because in order for T to down-regulate the AR mRNA aromatase is required.

Without the female paracrine environment inside the scalp tissue/follicles women would bald in the same pattern as men with the androgens that are naturally present within the female reference ranges. However they don't. And this is because of local enzymatic conversion of T to E2 and other androgens to estrone.

Furthermore:
"The intervention of estrogens in the in vitro down-regulation of AR mRNA levels was confirmed by their nearly complete disappearance by incubation with 50 nM estradiol. This concentration may not be too far above the one resulting from physiological aromatization of the highest T concentration tested (500 nM)."

 

[Ikarus]

I did a blood test include T and E2 a 3 weeks ago.
E2 154 pmol /L ( Reference values = 40-161 )
Testosterone 23.2 nmol /L ( Reference values = 8.9 -42.0 )

Your T should drop due to your usage of E

 

[RuTom]

Your T should drop due to your usage of E

The fact is that, previously, I used a different treatment regimen.
For six months I took Androcur (50 mg), estradiol (4 mg) and continued to take Avodart. On such a treatment regimen, I had a hormonal background like a woman.

But after a while, I started having headaches. I went to the doctors for help. I was sent to do a pituitary magnetic resonance imaging. Unfortunately, I was diagnosed with a Prolactinoma. Blame Androсur, which caused me to have high values of prolactin.
I was forced to give up this drug.

I chose bicalutamide and lowered the dose of estradiol, as the most safe for the body.Headaches don't bother me anymore. Prolactin values are in reference values.

 

[Itsnoahkennedy]

The fact is that, previously, I used a different treatment regimen.
For six months I took Androcur (50 mg), estradiol (4 mg) and continued to take Avodart. On such a treatment regimen, I had a hormonal background like a woman.

But after a while, I started having headaches. I went to the doctors for help. I was sent to do a pituitary magnetic resonance imaging. Unfortunately, I was diagnosed with a Prolactinoma. Blame Androсur, which caused me to have high values of prolactin.
I was forced to give up this drug.

I chose bicalutamide and lowered the dose of estradiol, as the most safe for the body.Headaches don't bother me anymore. Prolactin values are in reference values.

Yeah Prolactinomas and Meningiomas are a risk you willingly take when you pop Cyproterone Acetate pills, it happens. I get headaches too after a year on androcur and i plan on weaning off and transitioning back to Bicaludamide next month.

 

[Ephemeral-Kitten]

Yeah Prolactinomas and Meningiomas are a risk you willingly take when you pop Cyproterone Acetate pills, it happens. I get headaches too after a year on androcur and i plan on weaning off and transitioning back to Bicaludamide next month.

Do you think it's still worth it to start on Cypro? Like do you think it's more effective and you wouldn't be where you are today if you had started and stayed on bicalutamide?

 

[Itsnoahkennedy]

Do you think it's still worth it to start on Cypro? Like do you think it's more effective and you wouldn't be where you are today if you had started and stayed on bicalutamide?

I'll give Cyproterone Acetate credit for how quickly I recovered my hair, I love Cyproterone Acetate and if it didn't kill me so fast I would stay on it forever because in my opinion it is superior over everything else.

 

[Thatguy0]

I think that the androgen receptors in the muscles are partially blocked.
I'll continue training and see what happens

* I take 50 mg Bicalutamide (per day)
0.5 mg Avodart (every second day)
2 mg Estradiol ( per day)

i'll be ordering 50mg bic and 2mg estradiol, what was your experience with these two? did you notice improvements after taking it?

 

[Jacob Williams]

Can I build muscle if I take bicalutamide?
Or is it impossible? After all, the androgen receptors are blocked.

As someone who started bodybuilding while taking bicalutamide I feel more qualified to answer this than others who have no experience. I’ve personally seen huge gains. It’s likely that bicalutamide is actually helping me build muscle because it increases your testosterone.

 

[Jacob Williams]

As someone who started bodybuilding while taking bicalutamide I feel more qualified to answer this than others who have no experience. I’ve personally seen huge gains. It’s likely that bicalutamide is actually helping me build muscle because it increases your testosterone.

For reference I’ve been on bicalutamide 100mg for around 6 months. I started lifting seriously 2 months in. I’ve gained around 15 pounds, all my lifts have increased substantially and I’m very obviously more muscular than before.

 

[Jacob Williams]

Do y’all think that dutasteride is necessary in my situation or can bicalutamide alone control my hair loss? I’ve never tried going off it but it’s expensive and a hassle to get prescribed. I was trying to get a 90 day prescription instead of a 30 day prescription from a new doctor and they’re making me do a thyroid stimulating hormone test....do any of y’all know if the drugs I’m taking would cause me to have abnormal results?

 

[keepcoolmybabies]

Do y’all think that dutasteride is necessary in my situation or can bicalutamide alone control my hair loss? I’ve never tried going off it but it’s expensive and a hassle to get prescribed. I was trying to get a 90 day prescription instead of a 30 day prescription from a new doctor and they’re making me do a thyroid stimulating hormone test....do any of y’all know if the drugs I’m taking would cause me to have abnormal results?

I think dutasteride might still be necessary if you aren't on a gnrh antagonist and bica monotherapy can be its own potential hair loss powderkeg since it doesn't stop the conversion of T to DHT. Instead it simply competes for the same receptors whilst having far less affinity for them than DHT. And if you simultaneously block T from binding to AR while raising it, the extra T can then be converted to the more potent DHT which will then out compete bica (unless you are taking a sh*t ton).

 

[baba_yaga]

Do y’all think that dutasteride is necessary in my situation or can bicalutamide alone control my hair loss? I’ve never tried going off it but it’s expensive and a hassle to get prescribed. I was trying to get a 90 day prescription instead of a 30 day prescription from a new doctor and they’re making me do a thyroid stimulating hormone test....do any of y’all know if the drugs I’m taking would cause me to have abnormal results?

Please let us know how it goes for you. There isn't many members who are currently on bica.

 

[Obsessive]

Do y’all think that dutasteride is necessary in my situation or can bicalutamide alone control my hair loss? I’ve never tried going off it but it’s expensive and a hassle to get prescribed. I was trying to get a 90 day prescription instead of a 30 day prescription from a new doctor and they’re making me do a thyroid stimulating hormone test....do any of y’all know if the drugs I’m taking would cause me to have abnormal results?

We are in a rare category: males who lift weights while using bica. So you've been using 50 mg/day for 6 months? Aside from gym gains, how are hair gains?

I'm essentially microdosing bica (12.5 mg/EoD) while also using spironolactone and finasteride. Plan to bump up bica dose and drop spironolactone soon.

 

[ali.talebi1994]

I think dutasteride might still be necessary if you aren't on a gnrh antagonist and bica monotherapy can be its own potential hair loss powderkeg since it doesn't stop the conversion of T to DHT. Instead it simply competes for the same receptors whilst having far less affinity for them than DHT. And if you simultaneously block T from binding to AR while raising it, the extra T can then be converted to the more potent DHT which will then out compete bica (unless you are taking a sh*t ton).

The affinity of bicalutamide for the AR is relatively low as it is approximately 30 to 100 times lower than that of DHT, which is 2.5- to 10-fold as potent as an AR agonist as testosterone in bioassays and is the main endogenous ligand of the receptor in the prostate gland. However, typical clinical dosages of bicalutamide result in circulating levels of the drug that are thousands of times higher than those of testosterone and DHT, allowing it to powerfully prevent them from binding to and activating the receptor.
source: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bicalutamide#Pharmacodynamics

 

[ali.talebi1994]

For reference I’ve been on bicalutamide 100mg for around 6 months. I started lifting seriously 2 months in. I’ve gained around 15 pounds, all my lifts have increased substantially and I’m very obviously more muscular than before.

how much has bica helped you to treat hair loss

 

[keepcoolmybabies]

The affinity of bicalutamide for the AR is relatively low as it is approximately 30 to 100 times lower than that of DHT, which is 2.5- to 10-fold as potent as an AR agonist as testosterone in bioassays and is the main endogenous ligand of the receptor in the prostate gland. However, typical clinical dosages of bicalutamide result in circulating levels of the drug that are thousands of times higher than those of testosterone and DHT, allowing it to powerfully prevent them from binding to and activating the receptor.
source: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bicalutamide#Pharmacodynamics

Bica dosage levels were established primarily based on prostate cancer treatment, of which its not FDA approved as a monotherapy and requires use of an lhrh analogue to prevent the rise in T.

Monotherapy is used in a variety of other countries than the US, however, but at a typical dosage of 150mg, which is far higher than most people would likely consider taking for hair loss. And even at that dose, it's less effective than being combined with dutasteride, possibly for the reason I mentioned.

"PSA progression was found in 52 patients [65.8 %; 95 % confidence interval (CI) 55.4–76.3] in the monotherapy group compared to 38 patients (53.5 %; 95 % CI 41.9–65.1) in the combined therapy group (p = 0.134)."

 

[baba_yaga]

Could the adrenal glands become overworked in the long term and stop working correctly when producing double androgen levels due to taking bica? I havent found any study mentioning this. Any ideas?

 

[Kira Marie]

What about those of us whom have had an Orchiectomy? {I'm taking IM-EV, 25mg bica, and .05mg dutasteride.}

 

[Ikarus]

Could the adrenal glands become overworked in the long term and stop working correctly when producing double androgen levels due to taking bica? I havent found any study mentioning this. Any ideas?

I don’t think the adrenal glands produce more testosterone due to bicalutamide

 

[baba_yaga]

I cant seem to find any article/page mentioning Addison's disease being caused indirectly by bica. As for orchiectomy, if I remember correctly, can cause this disease unfortunately.

We must dig deeper.