Follica - Good News!

[goata007]

Do anyone know when/if they are releasing the results from their experimenting at Harvard?

NO, it was a research study. Unless they are planning on publishing a research paper(which I highly doubt) they won't release the results. Especially because it was paid for by Follica, Inc for private reserach NOT by government for public research.

 

[SoThatsLife]

Thanks, then we just have to wait. But it's real nice to have a purely academic approach to this field, and I guess the study they do at Harvard could give them more understanding of the way the follicle works.

If it works, 5 years from now, we maybe sit and watch Discovery Channel's documentary "Follica" :innocent: since I guess Discovery or National Geographics is probably killing to do a documentary about Follica.

 

[prewareq]

where is everybody???any news....??? :dunno: looks like this thread has died

 

[SoThatsLife]

Follica is doing research and testing. They will probably release some info next year.....if we are lucky. If they have good results, you bet it is going to be front page material next fall(if they start a small human trial next year).

Bare in mind that this procedure could be a REALLY easy one(of course with highly prescription drugs, medical laser, no infection, a nice Doctor and the right timing), so they want to guard their secret and make it as effective as possible. There are 4 of the best experts in each field that are scientific advisers to follica, so I guess they want to learn new stuff in the process.

I really wonder about the price, Histogen is talking about 5000$ for one procedure, that would probably make it affordable to some, but if they lower their price to around 1-2000$ they would probably have many more clients.

 

[prewareq]

thnks! seems there is nothing else to do than waiting for the big moment. anyway if the prices will be so high-5000$-why not having a hair transplant for that money?I mean you can have a decent session for 5000 and you have the warranty of dht resistant hair .Of course the situation would change if the new technique will grow dht resistant hair,but if not,then I'm not sure the price is justified.Correct me if I'm wrong.

 

[SoThatsLife]

Goata007 and Mr. B,
Do you know of any treatments of non-life threatening diseases that involves internal immune suppressing drugs?

My biggest fear with the Follica approach is that the involvement of internal immune suppressing drugs are going to make it not suitable for commercial release. Im quite convinced that the Follica approach would make new hair, but since so much new sciences put a focus on the immune system's effect on regeneration of organs/cells, I have a fear that they only allow strong suppression of the immune system in regarding of life-threatening diseases. But I guess Follica hopes Samir Mitragotri can figure out a approach that would make this commercially accepted.

 

[goata007]

Goata007 and Mr. B,
Do you know of any treatments of non-life threatening diseases that involves internal immune suppressing drugs?

My biggest fear with the Follica approach is that the involvement of internal immune suppressing drugs are going to make it not suitable for commercial release. Im quite convinced that the Follica approach would make new hair, but since so much new sciences put a focus on the immune system's effect on regeneration of organs/cells, I have a fear that they only allow strong suppression of the immune system in regarding of life-threatening diseases. But I guess Follica hopes Samir Mitragotri can figure out a approach that would make this commercially accepted.

No, I'm unaware of any immunosuppresants for non-life threatneing diseases. Immunos are only prescribed in extreme circumstances so it's highly unlikely that it's used for non-life threatnening diseases. However, someone posted a link to a study (on hairsite) done using topical cyclo in which people used it for about 8-12 months and some had very good results i.e. terminal regrowth, and no side effects whatosoever. I'm just not sure if the effects will last when you stop using it? maybe then getting on a topical lavender oil application will slow down the thinning process considerably - again not sure yet.

 

[waynakyo]

I agree it's hard to market anything of that form. For me - I am sorry I know you hate to hear that - but I am quite pessimistic about all that. The wounding and all the things that you have to add to that and the timing. Not so sure
Besides if we take immunosupressant agent then we might as well get tranplant of hairs from other people no ? OK I might be saying non-sense here.

But let me say one thing : I CAN'T just can't understand the people who are talking about the price - you have people talking about the marketing details and making plans as if it was a certainty. It is depressing, if you go to intercytex post you will find the same thing written 2 years ago. We are all anxious and want to see this happening but I don't understand the over-optimism and the people second guessing things that just are impossible to predict even my the research lab at this stage.
I think the point should be to discuss this research as objectively as possible to set the right expectations.

 

[ideo08]

Hi. Some ideas:

I think people trying like-follica experiments should NOT take finasteride or testosterone antagonists, because that promotes the kind of hairs that will always be weak and cause dependence on these drugs, sometimes with 'asexualizing' effects.
It`s better to let testosterone (even maybe taking additional one during the treatment) finish them all, and hopefully trough egf inhibition/wnt activation/testo, a 'natural selection' process will promote terminal hairs like the ones at the back/sides of the head.
In parts of the patent they have finasteride etc., but the patent is just a collection of different approaches, they are yet finding about the best combination, and some self-experimenter could beat them with good results in an actual human.

Also, in the first experiment by Orin, he had hair growth at one side and not the other, and some assumed that he made the mistake of sleeping at the side that didn't work, but it could have been the opposite; I believe that the hair at the back and sides of the head is not sensitive to testosterone because those are the regions of the head that throughout all life are pushed against the pillow.

On a side note, I wonder if instead of one-by-one hair transplantations, wouldn't it be possible to just scalp the head from the desired hairline to a symmetrical cut at the back, turn 180º the piece and reattach it.
Of course there will be the border scar with the sewing marks (unless some glue where used instead of stitching
-please bring these to other forums to promote discussion/ideas. I think there's investigation in biological glues...-
), but the surgery will be faster, cheaper and preferable, I think.
The new bald back could wait for future methods of regrowing, and would maybe benefit from sleeping in that area.
Easier too to have the new front hair combed back to cover that region, maybe with a ponytail. I wouldn't bother much for the little border stitching marks.

 

[Moomin]

You're actually crazy

There's no basis for anything you've said, and your common sense reasoning. Why would taking finasteride negatively affect the results from any follica type experiment. You've given some survival of the fittest argument for why it might be beneficial, but i don't see how the theory of evolution impact on hair neogenesis in any direct way.

Also, could you explain to me just what affect Orins pillow was having, was it just his pillow, did it have some magical properties or is it all of them, and if so should we sleep standing up like cows, maybe follica could isolate the bovine gene that allows cows to sleep standing up and inject it in us. After all we wouldn't want all those new follicles "pushing against the pillow"

And as for your suggestion of doing a 180 on peoples hair line and gluing it all up... I'm not even sure what to say, if my scalp is doing a 180, it might as well go the whole hog and do some half pipes, quarter pipes, ramps maybe even some rails. Maybe all that air its getting could mix in with the cow genes and yield even better results.

Seriously though, there are some really good posts on here, with a wealth of information from intelligent and measured people, whereas your post idea08 is purile, go through the posts on here, go through the patents, read the newspaper articles google and wiki the items they mention which you know nothing about, just like almost everybody else who has an interest in this area has done, and then come back and give us your informed argument.

 

[SoThatsLife]

Goata, how is you lavender experiment going?

I am thinking of rotating my nano conditioner(includes rosemary and other stuff) with Jason Organic Lavender Conditioner, but Im a little uncertain of whats the best way of using lavender. Lavender drops in my old conditioner, or the easy way with a conditioner like Jason's.

 

[goata007]

Goata, how is you lavender experiment going?

I am thinking of rotating my nano conditioner(includes rosemary and other stuff) with Jason Organic Lavender Conditioner, but Im a little uncertain of whats the best way of using lavender. Lavender drops in my old conditioner, or the easy way with a conditioner like Jason's.

My scalp acne has cleared up after a decade of being there! so it's definitely working. As of the hair, well I am NW6 so I'm not expecting lavender oil to regrow anything either. However, it has also made my scalp very less oily and itching is gone as well.

I'd recommend that you mix it (3-4 drops per application) in a good carrier oil and massage your head before going to bed. That way it'll have enough time to get absorbed etc, I would Not recommend adding it to the shampoo because I doubt it would work at all, maybe if you leave conditioner on for 5 minutes or so.

I know applying oil to hair is not a good solution BUT it is a very effective one without any side effects. So until ASCJ-9 or better treatments come out, I'd advise people to give this a try.

 

[CCS]

I've been putting lavender in my shampoo. I'm sure lavender oil would absorb much better than in shampoo, but Nizoral absorbs, so shampoo is possible.

My advice: put it in your shampoo, just for the topical days you miss so you are covered. But if you have time, put it in the carrier of your choice, and rub it into your scalp 30 minutes before shampooing. Unless you love greasy, nice smelling hair, which case you can put it on before bed.

Lavender is supposed to potently block the androgen recepter and inhibit 5 alpha reductase type I, and is a hair growth stimulate. It will grow hair on your face if you put it there, because the growth properties are stronger than the anti-androgenic properties.

I alternate mine with nizoral. I think I'll start rubbing it into my bald spots before a shower though. Just now my whole head since that would take more time and oil.

 

[CCS]

I really wonder about the price, Histogen is talking about 5000$ for one procedure, that would probably make it affordable to some, but if they lower their price to around 1-2000$ they would probably have many more clients.

$5000 is affordable to just about everyone in the united states. Maybe not other countries though. Yeah, some bums here never have more than $100 on them at a time except right before rent is due. But anyone who works and tightens there belt can buy it if it fixes their hair.

 

[ideo08]

In response to Moomin, Fri Jan 02, 2009 4:27 am :

>There's no basis for anything you've said, ...

Your response is very violent. They're ideas. If you don't like them, say why you don't and don't attack me.

>i don't see how the theory of evolution impact on hair neogenesis in any direct way.

After wounding if you block skin cells and dht sensitive hairs, you may promote non-dht sensitive hairs. All the cells of an individual have the same genes; different ones are expressed.
So that you don't get confused with "theory of evolution", live it as 'selection', drop the word 'natural'.

>After all we wouldn't want all those new follicles "pushing against the pillow"

You understood the opposite. I wrote that the pressure of the pillow could be good.

>as for your suggestion of doing a 180 on peoples hair line and gluing it all up... I'm not even sure >what to say, if my scalp is doing a 180, it might as well go the whole hog and do some half pipes, >quarter pipes, ramps maybe even some rails...

¿? That proposal would obviously be only for those that have a good area with hairs in the back of their heads.

I'm not responding any more about this.

 

[zb00st]

how the whole thing will be performed ?

 

[sengoku]

June 2008 Contract and Grant Awards

Mitragotri, S.S., Chemical Engineering, $171,155, Follica, Inc., "Drug Delivery into Microdermabraded Skin."

 

[SoThatsLife]

I couldn't find that info on the pdf you showed. But I found it on UCSB own funding site- http://research.ucsb.edu/pubs/documents ... e_2008.pdf.

It really seems like Follica almost certainly knows that they need to suppress the immune system somewhat for the best effect and they know that if they need to suppress the immune system internally it really wouldn't be a "commercial success" because the risks. I guess Samir Mitragotri is researching how they can use a topical immune suppressing drug effectively and how a topical drug application will effect the "follica growth". I hope Zohar releases some info soon, but since they have the investors they need, they might be quiet until they start phase 1.

 

[1750]

sounds like another dead duck.... may as well transplant someone else’s hair onto your head if you require immune suppressants

 

[SoThatsLife]

Have you read anything about the procedure actually? Please read up before becoming negative!

People don't need to take immune suppressant for ever, it is just a week or to, maybe even less. They are trying to figure out if topical immune suppressant is enough. Topical Immune suppressant is used for a lot of skin diseases.