I am not sure you are doing the protocol correctly? I believe you need to be wounding into the areas where you have hair. This triggers the plucked hair response.
Follica Microneedling Protocol Patent Disclosed
- Thread starter benjt2
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This hypothesis doesn't resonate with me. If the healing process of wounding holes is disturbed by another punch in the next successive days, then that should cause more damages than benefit as the wound will be reopened. It would be interesting to find out the probability of a needle striking a healing hole based on frequency and duration of the sessions.
Does quorum sensing rely on Fgf9 and shh-gli signaling? Does minoxidil provide those? Not disagreeing, I just don't know. I think the quorum sensing is the newest puzzle piece for wounding?
As in my reply to pegasus2; I think that quorum sensing was the latest puzzle piece for Follica. I would have to go back through all of the data they put out to be sure. I don't remember seeing it though.
No, it doesn't, but quorum sensing is just part of it.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5135642/
"Further testing demonstrated that quorum sensing in the skin was mediated by an immune cascade in which plucking injury induced the release of CCL2 which then recruited TNF-α-secreting macrophages to hone toward plucked hair follicles and their unplucked neighbors. TNF-α then stimulates the NF-κB pathway to increase Wnt signaling activating stem cells to induce hair regeneration"
Without fgf9 Wnt signalling is limited:
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/23727932
"Here we show that fibroblast growth factor 9 (Fgf9), initially secreted by γδ T cells, modulates hair follicle regeneration after wounding the skin of adult mice. Reducing Fgf9 expression decreases this wound-induced hair neogenesis (WIHN). Conversely, overexpression of Fgf9 results in a two- to threefold increase in the number of neogenic hair follicles. We found that Fgf9 from γδ T cells triggers Wnt expression and subsequent Wnt activation in wound fibroblasts."
Wnt signalling alone is not enough:
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/30464171
"While long-term Wnt activation is associated with fibrosis, Shh signal activation in Wnt active cells promotes the dermal papilla fate in scarring wounds. These studies demonstrate that mechanisms of scarring and regeneration are not distant from one another and that wound repair can be redirected to promote regeneration following injury by modifying a key dermal signal."
I'm going to give this a try, but can't decide which dermapen to buy.
the D2 seems to be reliable in its speed of 25hz but it's slow
the A7 has faster speed at ~300hz but according to some, its advertised 18000rpm isn't accurate and could cause tearing?
the D2 seems to be reliable in its speed of 25hz but it's slow
the A7 has faster speed at ~300hz but according to some, its advertised 18000rpm isn't accurate and could cause tearing?
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I'm out of cartridges and using a regular demaroller I wouldn't be able to closely mimic the protocol.
A7 is a good choice, and based on all the specs would be my top choice except that last part is a question mark. I've never used one, but I definitely don't trust the 18,000 rating. I'd hate to get it and spend only 5 minutes on my scalp thinking I've achieved the desired density when I actually haven't. It would be good if someone who has a D2 could try them side by side and see if it's actually 12x faster. It is faster, but I bet it isn't even close to the 300hz they claim. We know the motor is fast, but is it actually powerful enough to drive the needles straight in and out at the right depth every time? Still, I think the A7 is a good choice, and you should go with the one that you are most comfortable with.
I just got a Dr Pen M8. It has the same thinner 34 gauge needles. I've used 1.5mm dermarollers many times in the past. I can tell you that the 0.8mm dermapen with 8000rpm is a delight to use versus the rollers. I did my first session today with the lowest rpm because it most closely matched the 120Mhz of the Follica protocol.
I'm not sure how much the 1.5mm dermarollers helped. Hopefully the higher density wounding is more effective.
I have the new m8 and a d2 and will do a side by side a4 paper test and post it here at some point
I ordered some Dermantor 2 cartridges a few days ago but I wonder how long will it take to get here or if it even will get past customs with the Coronavirus crap.
On a side note, anyone have any minoxdil pills they're willing to sell me? I don't like drinking that crap - I rather just take the pure form but it needs a prescription.
On a side note, anyone have any minoxdil pills they're willing to sell me? I don't like drinking that crap - I rather just take the pure form but it needs a prescription.
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In Florida by any chance?
Nope, California
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I'm in FL. Ordered my cartridges from them about 5-6 weeks ago. Still haven't arrived. I emailed asking if they had tracking info but they don't do tracking for orders less than $100. They said allow up to 8 weeks then they will re-send.
Will post when I receive them.
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Where are the results?
Oooof, that's a long time. I know I usually get mine in three weeks.
I posted some photos a while ago of my results. I'll post updated ones at the end of the month.
but how do you know it's actually 8000rpm, that would require the motor to make 150 stabs per second. I don't think there are any dermapen motors that fast.