New Article on Shiseido Trial

[Pray The Bald Away]

Shisheido is where it's at and the results will determine if it will go to market or not. They will obviously have to show better results than the 6% average increase in hair count that Replicel showed in their first clinical trial.

Let's say it would show 20%++ increase in hair count on average then I personally can see it launching on the market. That's is the most reasonable and realistic expectation anyway. Something that presents (way) better results than PRP making it worth the cost and without side effects. At the very least it has present some cosmetic impact on average. Something like minoxidil can do basically but with a higher response rate. Hopefully it will turn out to be something even greater though.

If Shisheido fails however it would be a huge bummer to me as I don't see anything exciting at all currently aside from Tsuji obviously but that is still going to take some time. A miracle may always arise but ain't going to count on that.

I take it you don't have much faith in Fidia's upcoming treatment?

 

[Tracksterderm]

I have hopes about this treatment, but it's dissapointing how long it takes them to initiate the trials. And it is not the best sign with the results from first trial and no follow ups of better results (long term).

They are not so active on twitter as they used to be either.

 

[hellouser]

I have hopes about this treatment, but it's dissapointing how long it takes them to initiate the trials. And it is not the best sign with the results from first trial and no follow ups of better results (long term).

They are not so active on twitter as they used to be either.

I think Tammy George was in charge of the social media accounts. She's no longer with Replicel so it could be why there's been a lack of news from them on that end.

 

[Swoop]

I take it you don't have much faith in Fidia's upcoming treatment?

What's that Pray?

 

[Pray The Bald Away]

What's that Pray?

They aquired rights to Giovanni Brotzu's liposomal DGLA formulation. They're conducting a trial for it currently. I have a hard time believing that Fidia would aquire rights to a random snake oil treatment. How do you feel aout it?

 

[Dragonborn]

Shisheido is where it's at and the results will determine if it will go to market or not. They will obviously have to show better results than the 6% average increase in hair count that Replicel showed in their first clinical trial.

Let's say it would show 20%++ increase in hair count on average then I personally can see it launching on the market. That's is the most reasonable and realistic expectation anyway. Something that presents (way) better results than PRP making it worth the cost and without side effects. At the very least it has present some cosmetic impact on average. Something like minoxidil can do basically but with a higher response rate. Hopefully it will turn out to be something even greater though.

If Shisheido fails however it would be a huge bummer to me as I don't see anything exciting at all currently aside from Tsuji obviously but that is still going to take some time. A miracle may always arise but ain't going to count on that.

I agree Swoop. The 6% increase from Phase1 is not enough to do much of anything. I mean they are hoping for functional cure of stopping Androgenetic Alopecia by "immunizing" DHT prone follicles with DSCs.
That could prove useful but not sure if it is worth it to travel to Japan for that.
If this doesn't work Tsuji is the way to go, 'cos Dr. Angelo team is going the JAK inhibitor route, and Dr. LAuster team is lacking money and funding. There is nothing else worth mentioning.

 

[NorwoodGuardian]

I agree Swoop. The 6% increase from Phase1 is not enough to do much of anything. I mean they are hoping for functional cure of stopping Androgenetic Alopecia by "immunizing" DHT prone follicles with DSCs.
That could prove useful but not sure if it is worth it to travel to Japan for that.
If this doesn't work Tsuji is the way to go, 'cos Dr. Angelo team is going the JAK inhibitor route, and Dr. LAuster team is lacking money and funding. There is nothing else worth mentioning.

You are one of the many others that ignore SM .

 

[Tracksterderm]

I agree Swoop. The 6% increase from Phase1 is not enough to do much of anything. I mean they are hoping for functional cure of stopping Androgenetic Alopecia by "immunizing" DHT prone follicles with DSCs.
That could prove useful but not sure if it is worth it to travel to Japan for that.
If this doesn't work Tsuji is the way to go, 'cos Dr. Angelo team is going the JAK inhibitor route, and Dr. LAuster team is lacking money and funding. There is nothing else worth mentioning.

It's a shame they don't have or share data from more longterm perspective. Also, the initial trial was more to show safety, and hence dosages were not optimal. But it wouldn't have hurt to know if the testsubjects maintained those 6% after all this time, or if they even had more regrowth.

I guess now Shiseido awaits government approval to initiate next trial while RepliCel themselves lacks funds to start their own trial in Europe/Canada/US.

 

[c_super2]

When will replicil be released? What is the reasonable estimate that it will be released in Japan?

 

[Swoop]

They aquired rights to Giovanni Brotzu's liposomal DGLA formulation. They're conducting a trial for it currently. I have a hard time believing that Fidia would aquire rights to a random snake oil treatment. How do you feel aout it?

Sadly I think it's highly likely that the androgen/AR angle , estradiol and minoxidil is pretty much as good as it will get for the coming years and there will be no "compound" whatsoever that will beat that. Androgenetic Alopecia seems to reflect a irreversible state anyway at a certain timepoint. In this situation, when damage is too severe, only the creation of new hair follicles will do.

The Brotzu lotion will do something seeing the biological activity of these compounds in that topical, but it certainly won't be better than today treatments.

Regenerative therapy and gene therapy is where I'm looking at Pray. Tsuji being our biggest hope, no doubt.

 

[Pray The Bald Away]

Sadly I think it's highly likely that the androgen/AR angle , estradiol and minoxidil is pretty much as good as it will get for the coming years and there will be no "compound" whatsoever that will beat that. Androgenetic Alopecia seems to reflect a irreversible state anyway at a certain timepoint. In this situation, when damage is too severe, only the creation of new hair follicles will do.

The Brotzu lotion will do something seeing the biological activity of these compounds in that topical, but it certainly won't be better than today treatments.

Regenerative therapy and gene therapy is where I'm looking at Pray. Tsuji being our biggest hope, no doubt.

Have you heard anything back from Tsuji yet? It turns out he already uses wnt-10b so that may be how he got around his problems. And he should be doing his press release any day now, right? I seriously hope he doesn't give a timeline longer than 6 years.

 

[distracted]

Have you heard anything back from Tsuji yet? It turns out he already uses wnt-10b so that may be how he got around his problems. And he should be doing his press release any day now, right? I seriously hope he doesn't give a timeline longer than 6 years.

Honestly < 6 years would be a best case scenario, 6-10 would be expected, and > 10 would be a worst case scenario.

I'm hoping that his press release is more than a reiteration of what we already know. Hopefully he includes a timeline of when he expects to achieve certain milestones.

 

[Pray The Bald Away]

Honestly < 6 years would be a best case scenario, 6-10 would be expected, and > 10 would be a worst case scenario.

I'm hoping that his press release is more than a reiteration of what we already know. Hopefully he includes a timeline of when he expects to achieve certain milestones.

If he has a partnership I don't see why it would take so long, especially considering Japan's favorability towards stsm cell treatments. I don't understand how it would take over 5 years to get to phase 2 trials, at which point he can make the treatment available to the public.

 

[Swoop]

Have you heard anything back from Tsuji yet? It turns out he already uses wnt-10b so that may be how he got around his problems. And he should be doing his press release any day now, right? I seriously hope he doesn't give a timeline longer than 6 years.

Jup, should be any moment. I will shoot him a message anyway before the end of this month. Don't want to bother him too much at the moment, I assume he is very busy now. I think he got the culturing problem solved to be honest. Tsuji is most likely ahead of everybody.

 

[distracted]

Jup, should be any moment. I will shoot him a message anyway before the end of this month. Don't want to bother him too much at the moment, I assume he is very busy now. I think he got the culturing problem solved to be honest. Tsuji is most likely ahead of everybody.

That's awesome. This guy is incredible. Hope he gets properly compensated for his hard work.

 

[slam1523]

Sadly I think it's highly likely that the androgen/AR angle , estradiol and minoxidil is pretty much as good as it will get for the coming years and there will be no "compound" whatsoever that will beat that. Androgenetic Alopecia seems to reflect a irreversible state anyway at a certain timepoint. In this situation, when damage is too severe, only the creation of new hair follicles will do.

The Brotzu lotion will do something seeing the biological activity of these compounds in that topical, but it certainly won't be better than today treatments.

Regenerative therapy and gene therapy is where I'm looking at Pray. Tsuji being our biggest hope, no doubt.

So replicell isn't something you're betting on?

 

[hellouser]

So replicell isn't something you're betting on?

There's no reason to bet against though, we don't have all the info considering that the data we have is from only 6 months after the initial injection. Hair transplants with fully sized EXISTING follicles can take up to and over 1 year to see results. I don't think it's fair to say 6 months is the final result for DSC cell injections.

 

[Swoop]

So replicell isn't something you're betting on?

I mean traditional medicine and drugs. I think it's extremely unlikely that Androgenetic Alopecia reversal is going to happen through that.

So the Brotzu lotion, the Turkish lotion, SM04545, JAK inhibitors, bimatoprost etc. You name it. I can also illustrate why, it's just highly unlikely really..

Replicel is regenerative therapy so I'm still looking at that, but Tsuji is far more exciting to me.

 

[distracted]

There's no reason to bet against though, we don't have all the info considering that the data we have is from only 6 months after the initial injection. Hair transplants with fully sized EXISTING follicles can take up to and over 1 year to see results. I don't think it's fair to say 6 months is the final result for DSC cell injections.

"Secondary protocol objectives were toassess systemic (overall) safety and efficacy (hair growth at treatment sites) at six months post-injection and localsafety at 24 months post-injection."

.. " Participants of the phaseI clinical trial will be followed for five years."

We don't have full knowledge, but I am fairly confident that Replicel does. Those are both to test for safety but, at that point, either the change is noticeable or it isn't.

 

[hellouser]

"Secondary protocol objectives were toassess systemic (overall) safety and efficacy (hair growth at treatment sites) at six months post-injection and localsafety at 24 months post-injection."

.. " Participants of the phaseI clinical trial will be followed for five years."

We don't have full knowledge, but I am fairly confident that Replicel does. Those are both to test for safety but, at that point, either the change is noticeable or it isn't.

When I spoke with Lee Buckler he said they dont have data past the 6 month mark from Phase I.