So how DID GliSODin work out for people?

[Hoppi]

Because I was thinking "oo better get some copper peptides, topical antioxidants should do my follicles some good!" but then Immortal pointed us at GliSODin, and I thought it would be cool to get some more opinions.

So like, does taking SODs orally have a comparable effect? What dose are they needed in? Because of course it does sound much more holistic a treatment, cheaper and quicker than trying to administer something like Folligen topically.

Lastly, would taking something to further increase my glutathione levels like N-Acetyl-Cysteine help?

Would be great to see how people got on with this stuff, Immortal seemed fairly confident, and the theory of it is relatively sound as far as I can tell!

Peace!

Hoppi

 

[squeegee]

I took Glisodin for years...not a difference maker lol Acetyl-L-Cystein will be a good idea.. with Panthotenic acid..or Panthetine itself. I am a supplements freak so I spend too much on that every month.. I am on different supplements and health forum as well like imminst.org and bodybuilding.com There is a lot of goofy people on imminst.org. Don't believe everything there! :jackit:

 

[Hoppi]

Ah that's a shame about GliSODin, so you really believe it is better to increase SODs topically? That's a shame really, as the health benefits, convenience and also financial advantage of taking it orally would theoretically be very good

I believe it does have something to do with dosage though, IH recommends a loading dose of 200mg a day, and some people were I believe in 500mg or in fact GRAMS a day! lol

How much were you taking?

L-Acetyl-Cysteine you would imagine is also good to do things like increase glutathione, but.. hmm, it would surprise me if increasing glutathione systemically has more of an impact on hair than increasing SODs! Hmm O.O

 

[squeegee]

Ah that's a shame about GliSODin, so you really believe it is better to increase SODs topically? That's a shame really, as the health benefits, convenience and also financial advantage of taking it orally would theoretically be very good

I believe it does have something to do with dosage though, IH recommends a loading dose of 200mg a day, and some people were I believe in 500mg or in fact GRAMS a day! lol

How much were you taking?

L-Acetyl-Cysteine you would imagine is also good to do things like increase glutathione, but.. hmm, it would surprise me if increasing glutathione systemically has more of an impact on hair than increasing SODs! Hmm O.O

Topically or orally you won't see a dramatic change..Copper peptides topically is more hype than anything else when it comes to hairloss.. try it yourself you will see. and I was taking 2x 500mg of glisodin per day. Glutathione (L-gammaglutamyl-L-cysteinylglycine) is made of 3 amino acids cysteine, glycine, and glutamic acid and yes NAC is moderally effective but they keep saying that cystine is better..the best bet will be an amino acids complex..It is such a pain in the arse to take them individually..

 

[Jacob]

And there's the name again....... :shock:

I took GliSODin for years..even introduced "the name" to it years ago. One shouldn't be surprised that you're not seeing results hair-wise from taking it. That can be said of most things taken internally. But it's hard to say if it is doing anything whether you're seeing results or not..when so many other things are being taken/used.


There are other options as well. Extramel for those with gluten/gliadin intolerance. http://www.bionov.com/

There's a list of various ones out there..somewhere.

EUK-134 is a powerful SOD mimetic..for topical use. Probably a better % of it in 3Lab's product compared to what's in DS Labs..which I never trusted.

 

[purecontrol]

First off you guys need to realize there are two forms of SOD Cu/Zn and Mn. Second you need to realize that in order to recieve the best results you need to use injectable products, there is only one orally effective SOD and GlisSOD sucks!

Also you can purchase injectable glutathione. You have to realize that injecting is the only true way to ensure you incease the levels. For example, if you use something like NAC to increase glutathione, you may have a limiting factor preventing the NAC being turned into glutathione. So you are spending all this money and it is for nothing or for far less than what you were told.

 

[Hoppi]

Jacob dude the thing is, i DO like you and I do think you have an intelligent and experience-based knowledge of this stuff, and as long as you aren't like, having a go at something lol, I respect you man, it's just that you have to bear in mind that Immortal has presented things in a very accessible, friendly, kind of "out there in the public domain" kind of way, tried to make it affordable and shared his knowledge with everyone. I would love to learn from your topical regimen or try it, but even after looking up some of it it would still take a fair bit to put the pieces together and understand it, and then also I wouldn't have the money to implement it. If you want to really get credit in the same way that IH does then you need to really put things out there with a website or something like him, really explain things and tell others how to replicate the same success you have had for a reasonable price. That would be a fantastic thing for many people as I'm sure your regimen is excellent.

Do you see what I'm getting at here though? I'm sure if you were to make just a small number of pages, explaining what you use and why and giving also more affordable alternatives, people will be all over it in the same way that they are over Immortal's advice and regimen.

And purecontrol, maybe, although people have claimed very noticeable and positive changes in their body after taking things like GliSODin orally, so SOMETHING must be happening here mustn't it? Question is how much of it reaches the hair follicle specifically. Maybe generally reinforcing antioxidants is better.. I'm too new to know the details like that though

 

[Jacob]

I'm not looking to get credit..I'm not looking for a following- a website etc is the last thing on my mind. I'm pointing out that the guru you keep posting about..constantly for some odd reason(even after those threads..)...gets a lot of his information just like everybody else. In fact he gets a lot of it from some of us. And I know you know the reason why he's going to do an audio book instead of writing another one

If ppl are interested in what I use..they can ask. As some have. And/or they can RESEARCH. Doing so will also lead them to their own cheaper sources....or different forms of something like SOD..etc.

 

[Bryan]

Copper peptides topically is more hype than anything else when it comes to hairloss..

Have you seen the published studies of topical copper-peptides in both humans and animals? If you did, I bet you wouldn't be saying that it's mostly "hype".

 

[squeegee]

Copper peptides topically is more hype than anything else when it comes to hairloss..

Have you seen the published studies of topical copper-peptides in both humans and animals? If you did, I bet you wouldn't be saying that it's mostly "hype".

Tell me why Dr Pickart is balder than a bowling ball then? Bryan..it would be cool if you can post them.. please!

 

[Hoppi]

Copper peptides topically is more hype than anything else when it comes to hairloss..

Have you seen the published studies of topical copper-peptides in both humans and animals? If you did, I bet you wouldn't be saying that it's mostly "hype".

yay we agree on something! Yayyyy! ^_^

hehe!

Copper peptides are tres awesome as they increase topical antioxidant activity! ^_^

 

[Bryan]

Tell me why Dr Pickart is balder than a bowling ball then?

Because he's been bald for DECADES, and even copper-peptides (even Proxiphen, for God's sake) won't recover all the lost hair on someone who is completely bald.

You could make the same silly argument about Rogaine: minoxidil has been PROVEN to grow hair in study after study after study after study, so why is Dr. Pickart balder than a bowling ball?

Bryan..it would be cool if you can post them.. please!

Give me some time to find what I posted about them back on alt.baldspot. I'll post it again here in this thread!

 

[Mopless]

I have been considering trying copper/tin peptide creams in combination with wounding/needling to see if I could get some thickening and maybe a little regrowth. However, I've been avoiding it forever since I've seen more then one post saying you should use copper peptides with rogaine. Which to me says they don't do jack and rogaine is all the grow/thickening. I'd love to be wrong though. I'm trying to find something else other then minoxidil as I really don't want to ride that rocky train.

So you actually believe Copper Peptides work well for hairloss, Bryan? Somehow I'm shocked, but also pleasantly pleased. Do share those studies, I'd love to see them!

 

[squeegee]

I have been considering trying copper/tin peptide creams in combination with wounding/needling to see if I could get some thickening and maybe a little regrowth. However, I've been avoiding it forever since I've seen more then one post saying you should use copper peptides with rogaine. Which to me says they don't do jack and rogaine is all the grow/thickening. I'd love to be wrong though. I'm trying to find something else other then minoxidil as I really don't want to ride that rocky train.

So you actually believe Copper Peptides work well for hairloss, Bryan? Somehow I'm shocked, but also pleasantly pleased. Do share those studies, I'd love to see them!

I don't want to be negative but Copper Peptides by itself will not cut the difference.. It is just an add-on.

 

[squeegee]

Tell me why Dr Pickart is balder than a bowling ball then?

Because he's been bald for DECADES, and even copper-peptides (even Proxiphen, for God's sake) won't recover all the lost hair on someone who is completely bald.

You could make the same silly argument about Rogaine: minoxidil has been PROVEN to grow hair in study after study after study after study, so why is Dr. Pickart balder than a bowling ball?

Bryan..it would be cool if you can post them.. please!

Give me some time to find what I posted about them back on alt.baldspot. I'll post it again here in this thread!

LOL Bryan.. was just playing with you reference DR. Pickart.. we want these studies!

 

[Hoppi]

I have been considering trying copper/tin peptide creams in combination with wounding/needling to see if I could get some thickening and maybe a little regrowth. However, I've been avoiding it forever since I've seen more then one post saying you should use copper peptides with rogaine. Which to me says they don't do jack and rogaine is all the grow/thickening. I'd love to be wrong though. I'm trying to find something else other then minoxidil as I really don't want to ride that rocky train.

So you actually believe Copper Peptides work well for hairloss, Bryan? Somehow I'm shocked, but also pleasantly pleased. Do share those studies, I'd love to see them!

I don't want to be negative but Copper Peptides by itself will not cut the difference.. It is just an add-on.

However, it could work when combined with.. perhaps Spectral RS and Crinagen?

Might be a bit of work though! I also quite like the look of azelaic acid, I believe that has free radical scavenging properties too for some reason!

 

[Jacob]

Hey Hoppi..just wondering why you used to pretty much ridicule the use of topicals..like they weren't needed(did those threads change your mind?)..and now you've got a # of them in your regimen, and you were even talking about coming out with your own.

Maybe I should have in my sig a quote from you on what you said about topicals....

 

[Bryan]

So you actually believe Copper Peptides work well for hairloss, Bryan?

Sure, although I have some natural hesitation at specifying how WELL they work. I'm not completely sure if they "well", or something less than that! But copper-peptides have been a staple of Proxiphen for many years, although I think Dr. Proctor now feels that the other more powerful SODs like TEMPO/TEMPOL and PBN are more effective than copper-peptides.

Somehow I'm shocked...

I don't know why you're shocked; I've been talking about the benefits of copper-peptides for years on these sites!

...but also pleasantly pleased. Do share those studies, I'd love to see them!

Here's an old alt.baldspot post of mine in which I answered someone else who had also challenged me about the scientific evidence showing that SODs work for hair growth. Here's the complete post:

On Tue, 09 Jul 2002 02:00:16 GMT, honkguy <honk...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>> >BTW, show me one shred of clinical evidence that SODs grow hair on male pattern baldness
>> >sufferers. Don't pull out the "clinical trials" from ProCyte, either, because
>> >I believe those results about as much as I believe Springhair Tonic works.
>>
>> Why do you feel that way, Mitch? I've previously cited three studies
>> on SODs that were published in a medical journal;
>
>For male pattern baldness? Could you posts the references if you get a chance?

Oops... I goofed. They weren't published in a medical journal, they were published in the book "Dermatologic Research Techniques", CRC Press, 1996. They are three consecutive chapters in the book:

Chapter 16: "Phototrichogram Analysis of Hair Follicle Stimulation: A Pilot Clinical Study with a Peptide-Copper Complex" Ronald E. Trachy, Leonard M. Patt, Gordon M. Duncan, and Bernard Kalis. This was done on *human* subjects with male pattern baldness. Both total and anagen hair density increased significantly (anagen hair: +39%) with the larger topical dose of copper-peptide (glycyl-histidine-lysine-valine-phenyalanine-valine), especially when compared to total and anagen hair density LOSSES in the placebo-treated group.

Chapter 17: "Quantitative Assessment of Peptide-Copper Complex-Induced Hair Follicle Stimulation Using the Fuzzy Rat" Ronald E. Trachy, Hideo Uno, Shelley Packard, and Leonard M. Patt. This was done on rats. Copper peptides significantly stimulated hair growth, compared to vehicle.

Chapter 18: "Evaluation of Telogen Hair Follicle Stimulation Using an In Vivo Model: Results with peptide-Copper Complexes" Ronald E. Trachy, Erika D. Timpe, Irene Dunwiddie, and Leonard M. Patt. This was on mice. Copper peptides significantly stimulated hair growth in mice, compared to vehicle; it also exceeded the growth induced by 2% topical minoxidil, which was also tested.

 

[squeegee]

So you actually believe Copper Peptides work well for hairloss, Bryan?

Sure, although I have some natural hesitation at specifying how WELL they work. I'm not completely sure if they "well", or something less than that! But copper-peptides have been a staple of Proxiphen for many years, although I think Dr. Proctor now feels that the other more powerful SODs like TEMPO/TEMPOL and PBN are more effective than copper-peptides.

Somehow I'm shocked...

I don't know why you're shocked; I've been talking about the benefits of copper-peptides for years on these sites!

...but also pleasantly pleased. Do share those studies, I'd love to see them!

Here's an old alt.baldspot post of mine in which I answered someone else who had also challenged me about the scientific evidence showing that SODs work for hair growth. Here's the complete post:

On Tue, 09 Jul 2002 02:00:16 GMT, honkguy <honk...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>> >BTW, show me one shred of clinical evidence that SODs grow hair on male pattern baldness
>> >sufferers. Don't pull out the "clinical trials" from ProCyte, either, because
>> >I believe those results about as much as I believe Springhair Tonic works.
>>
>> Why do you feel that way, Mitch? I've previously cited three studies
>> on SODs that were published in a medical journal;
>
>For male pattern baldness? Could you posts the references if you get a chance?

Oops... I goofed. They weren't published in a medical journal, they were published in the book "Dermatologic Research Techniques", CRC Press, 1996. They are three consecutive chapters in the book:

Chapter 16: "Phototrichogram Analysis of Hair Follicle Stimulation: A Pilot Clinical Study with a Peptide-Copper Complex" Ronald E. Trachy, Leonard M. Patt, Gordon M. Duncan, and Bernard Kalis. This was done on *human* subjects with male pattern baldness. Both total and anagen hair density increased significantly (anagen hair: +39%) with the larger topical dose of copper-peptide (glycyl-histidine-lysine-valine-phenyalanine-valine), especially when compared to total and anagen hair density LOSSES in the placebo-treated group.

Chapter 17: "Quantitative Assessment of Peptide-Copper Complex-Induced Hair Follicle Stimulation Using the Fuzzy Rat" Ronald E. Trachy, Hideo Uno, Shelley Packard, and Leonard M. Patt. This was done on rats. Copper peptides significantly stimulated hair growth, compared to vehicle.

Chapter 18: "Evaluation of Telogen Hair Follicle Stimulation Using an In Vivo Model: Results with peptide-Copper Complexes" Ronald E. Trachy, Erika D. Timpe, Irene Dunwiddie, and Leonard M. Patt. This was on mice. Copper peptides significantly stimulated hair growth in mice, compared to vehicle; it also exceeded the growth induced by 2% topical minoxidil, which was also tested.

Which complex did they use??? Interesting.. Copper peptides is just a bunch of aminos?? Thanks a lot for the studies Bryan.

 

[Mopless]

I have been considering trying copper/tin peptide creams in combination with wounding/needling to see if I could get some thickening and maybe a little regrowth. However, I've been avoiding it forever since I've seen more then one post saying you should use copper peptides with rogaine. Which to me says they don't do jack and rogaine is all the grow/thickening. I'd love to be wrong though. I'm trying to find something else other then minoxidil as I really don't want to ride that rocky train.

So you actually believe Copper Peptides work well for hairloss, Bryan? Somehow I'm shocked, but also pleasantly pleased. Do share those studies, I'd love to see them!

I don't want to be negative but Copper Peptides by itself will not cut the difference.. It is just an add-on.

Yes, that's what I was thinking as well. I mean, I'm sure its great for hair. However I never considered it potent enough to make any real difference in hair. If a non-fda product recommends to use another fda approved hair-loss product in combination for "best" results, I immediately assume it's a cash scam and will be as effective as water.

But like I said, I really wouldn't mind being wrong. I just really am doing everything I can to avoid minoxidil, but it's starting to look like a bleak possibility.