Very Impressive Dermarolling And Minxodil Results - From Tressless

[The-Johnny]

Does anyone know if microneedling will affect future hair-transplant in a negative way? My hair is getting thinner and thinner for every day and I would most likely need a hairtransplant i the future and don't want to risk getting bad result due to microneedling.

 

[Francky85]

Does anyone know if microneedling will affect future hair-transplant in a negative way? My hair is getting thinner and thinner for every day and I would most likely need a hairtransplant i the future and don't want to risk getting bad result due to microneedling.

Not sure if anyone would know for sure as it hasnt been studied.......but micro needling improves the skin, increases blood flow through induced healing......it doesnt scar, in fact its used to heal scars...so if anything, I would logically assume it improves the scalp for a hair transplant....but again thats assumptions as no-one knows.

 

[ZenHead]

You´re lucky, bro. My scalp at the crown is apparently kryptonian, because it´s not red at al even though I set the pen to 2mm. Apparently the pen is not strong enough to pierce my skin in that area, which is terribly concerning me. I don´t feel any prolongued pain after the needling sessions (only in the hairline and temples), so I envy you. I need to feel some pain there so I can have hopes of getting regrowth.

Interesting, do you mind saying what your norwood is? I'm thinking if your crown is already bare, there might be decreased blood flow and feeling there. Curious to see if you gain sensation progressively after each session.

 

[hairloss_user]

Does anyone know if microneedling will affect future hair-transplant in a negative way? My hair is getting thinner and thinner for every day and I would most likely need a hairtransplant i the future and don't want to risk getting bad result due to microneedling.

That's what scares me the most. Let's hope not. Maybe someone who has done it for a while and got one can answer that question.

 

[Derelict]

Just got my dr.pen ultima A6, can't wait to try it out tonight. Also on dutasteride and oral minoxidil. Anyone else have one of these? the indicator light isn't coming up saying it is charging and it won't turn on. Ok i think i have broken it. Yup definitely broken mine, that's 60 odd quid down the drain.

 

[Eazy12]

Fuk me just had my first go with the Ultima A6 set to 1.5mm. Not sure if I did it right but did 4 passes, going from back to front to back like mowing a lawn, then in widths starting from just in front of the hairline and working my way back, then front to back again and then widths one last time.
My scalp 10 minutes later still feels like someone rubbed chili peppers all over it and I bled a bit on my temples (which was about a 7/10 pain for me)

 

[Eazy12]

Pics:

 

[MK13]

Pics:

It's posting pictures like this that got the thread locked the last time. This seems like the right way to go about getting this locked also.

 

[Bill_Russo]

It's posting pictures like this that got the thread locked the last time. This seems like the right way to go about getting this locked also.

Not even close. The 2young2retire dude looked like he poured tomato juice all over his scalp.

 

[Nighttrainer]

I use my derma roller every Monday morning and then resume my regular twice a day Minoxadil when I shower Monday night.

I don't destroy my scalp with the derma roller, just a few easy roles over my thin areas and then let my scalp relax for 16 - 18 hours or so until I re-apply the Minoxadil.

Between that process, the laser cap once or twice a week, the DHA inhibiting shampoo, the 1 Biotin, Saw Palmetto and Pygeum suppliments I take a day I seem to be doing pretty well.

 

[kiwipilu]

Not even close. The 2young2retire dude looked like he poured tomato juice all over his scalp.

Tbh the more I think about it the more I think erythema is not enough. Look at hair transplants, most guys are bleeding a lot in recipient area and it's no a problem for the grafts to grow afterwards. wounding must actually help a lot for hair transplant success since Scalp often remains reddish for months..
that said I have been dermarolling for 15months or so with no spectacular results but a fair maintenance! So maybe erythema is not enough?(enhance blood ciculation only?) but to make better things happen you have to go little more hardcore(release growth factors etc...)?dunno that's just speculation.but remember the barbecue guy, that was quite a wounding. and obviously also the famous 2young2retire like you say eventhough that was too extreme. So I'd say few drops of bloods is ok.all in all I'm dermarolling a little rougher for 3weeks and I see more blood after each session.
Can't wait for the next dermarollin session It's like a drug , I want to make it happen.
Obviously if you go this way you have to be cautious. device well desinfected, etc,...

 

[Bill_Russo]

Tbh the more I think about it the more I think erythema is not enough. Look at hair transplants, most guys are bleeding a lot in recipient area and it's no a problem for the grafts to grow afterwards. wounding must actually help a lot for hair transplant success since Scalp often remains reddish for months..
that said I have been dermarolling for 15months or so with no spectacular results but a fair maintenance! So maybe erythema is not enough?(enhance blood ciculation only?) but to make better things happen you have to go little more hardcore(release growth factors etc...)?dunno that's just speculation.but remember the barbecue guy, that was quite a wounding. and obviously also the famous 2young2retire like you say eventhough that was too extreme. So I'd say few drops of bloods is ok.all in all I'm dermarolling a little rougher for 3weeks and I see more blood after each session.
Can't wait for the next dermarollin session It's like a drug , I want to make it happen.
Obviously if you go this way you have to be cautious. device well desinfected, etc,...

Honestly, the general rule is that blood isn't necessary, but those 2 particular cases make me think there might be a correlation. 2young regrew like 2 Norwoods and without Minoxidil.
I don't think you have to absolutely tear apart your scalp like he did, but maybe there really is something about going a bit harder... Do let us know if you notice something.
I can't wait to get my pen, man. I'm thrilled about this. If all the miniaturized hairs on my hairline can go back to normal with this, even if it takes years, I can call it a cure.
Maybe having a very slow hair loss does give me a chance with this.

 

[ZenHead]

2young2retire’s results were legendary tbh. If you look up his profile and view his recent posts, you’ll see he posted a picture of his results right before he stopped coming here. Looks like a perfect nw2 after being a nw4. I too think erythmya isn’t enough for regrowth. When I wound I do bleed but just a little bit in certain spots - I may go harder in the future. I’ve noticed during the past month Ive been doing this, my temples are the place where I wound the hardest and also happens to be the first place where I’m seeing results. Maybe because they are more visible than the crown but hairs are definitley lengthening and darkening verrrry slowly. I know the admins might not like this but heavier wounding does seem to bring the best results. I just hope those of you doing heavier wounding are taking every precaution to clean your equipment and prevent scarring of your scalp. I definitely recommend a pen or stamp over a roller for that reason.
Please be careful if you decide to wound hard and be conscious that if you post pictures of a bloody scalp there is a good chance this thread will get locked.

 

[HairSuit]

Then we would have to discount the reddit user who was the cause of the start of this thread. Either his results are not from wounding/minoxidil as he says, or, at least some people are excellent responders to lighter wounding.

 

[Bill_Russo]

Then we would have to discount the reddit user who was the cause of the start of this thread. Either his results are not from wounding/minoxidil as he says, or, at least some people are excellent responders to lighter wounding.

You're right. Could be that it has to do with the person and not with the intensity of the wounding.
Could also be a bit of both.

 

[HairSuit]

You're right. Could be that it has to do with the person and not with the intensity of the wounding.
Could also be a bit of both.

Perhaps this is the problem that Follica is having as well, and we are just a microcosm of what they’re experiencing. Maybe the results are not reliably repeatable, and vary greatly from person to person, and this is why it’s taking so long to come out?

 

[kiwipilu]

Honestly, the general rule is that blood isn't necessary, but those 2 particular cases make me think there might be a correlation. 2young regrew like 2 Norwoods and without Minoxidil.
I don't think you have to absolutely tear apart your scalp like he did, but maybe there really is something about going a bit harder... Do let us know if you notice something.
I can't wait to get my pen, man. I'm thrilled about this. If all the miniaturized hairs on my hairline can go back to normal with this, even if it takes years, I can call it a cure.
Maybe having a very slow hair loss does give me a chance with this.

hehe no worriesI don’t tear my scalp apart. I keep my strict routine for more than a year I never had any issues (skin wise): It’s just that I press a little bit harder obv… Also I think it’s important to let the scalp recover !!!! that's the key here. I was dermarolling once every week but now I let 10 days . Also I rinse my scalp with distilled water right after dermarolling, that leaves a clean reddish scalp I can let recover for 24hours before applying a topical

 

[ZenHead]

View attachment 104349 View attachment 104349 View attachment 104349

Then we would have to discount the reddit user who was the cause of the start of this thread. Either his results are not from wounding/minoxidil as he says, or, at least some people are excellent responders to lighter wounding.

We don't have any reason to believe otherwise. His results are from wounding and minoxidil. But I think we have to look at it from this point of view:
2young2retire wounded with a 1.5mm roller I believe, and he pushed it to the limit. He probably ended up getting the needles in farther than the 1.5mm just from how hard he pushed it into his skin. And as I'm sure a lot of you know, rollers end up making wide "pit" type wounds instead of precise vertical wounds like a pen/stamp.
the reddit user (I forget his name on here with a bunch of numbers, I'm just gonna call him "7" from now on) used a pen at 2.0 mm, so slightly more depth than 2young. He also passed each area of the scalp a total of 6 times in one session - twice vertical, twice horizontal, twice diagonal. Pretty thorough.
I think there is a correlation between 2young and 7's results. Both methods induced a heavy wounding response. I think that with the pen you are less likely to bleed if you wound thoroughly due to the precision of the wounds. However if you are using a roller, you will bleed if you wound thoroughly with a 1.5mm roller. Either way, those that wound thoroughly seem to have the best regrowth.

Edit: found 2young's results...

https://www.hairlosstalk.com/intera...-scalp-for-natural-hair-regrowth.70994/page-8
https://www.hairlosstalk.com/intera...-potential-cure-log.77390/page-8#post-1160424

The pics are small, but go to his actual threads and you can see them full size with a bunch more.

 

[HairSuit]

We don't have any reason to believe otherwise. His results are from wounding and minoxidil. But I think we have to look at it from this point of view:
2young2retire wounded with a 1.5mm roller I believe, and he pushed it to the limit. He probably ended up getting the needles in farther than the 1.5mm just from how hard he pushed it into his skin. And as I'm sure a lot of you know, rollers end up making wide "pit" type wounds instead of precise vertical wounds like a pen/stamp.
the reddit user (I forget his name on here with a bunch of numbers, I'm just gonna call him "7" from now on) used a pen at 2.0 mm, so slightly more depth than 2young. He also passed each area of the scalp a total of 6 times in one session - twice vertical, twice horizontal, twice diagonal. Pretty thorough.
I think there is a correlation between 2young and 7's results. Both methods induced a heavy wounding response. I think that with the pen you are less likely to bleed if you wound thoroughly due to the precision of the wounds. However if you are using a roller, you will bleed if you wound thoroughly with a 1.5mm roller. Either way, those that wound thoroughly seem to have the best regrowth.

I agree. I think his results ARE legit. I also think, with my 1.5mm derminator, if
I did it long enough, I could definitely irritate the skin to the point where it is rubbed raw and bleeding. Maybe it’s just the duration and amount of friction.

 

[bboy]

I think we have to keep in mind what we're doing microneedling. The "Go hard or go home" crowd we're convinced that scalp fibrosis was a huge issue and remodeling of the skin from doing deep "clinical style" dermarolling was what was needed (also there was a large Follica inspired wounding talk). This could be true, we don't know. But I'm quite sure the fibrosis around the follicle is something that happens quite late and so might only really be necessary on the hairline of slick bald areas. Even then consider that the follicle is tiny at this point and is probably very close to the epithelial layer.

Then there's this study

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5064188/

Here they we're rolling "light" to cause only erythema, 5 days a week. The did it in amounts of cycles per session, 3, 6, 10 and 13. Now, this was in mice and had nothing to do with Androgenetic Alopecia. But we can see in stimulating growth the 10 cycle was the most optimal, so this could suggest it isn't simply about simply the harder you roll the better.

The most important part of dermarolling could be the change in gene expression that it causes, upregulation of various genes that are known to be downregulated and Androgenetic Alopecia and the downregulation of certain inflammatory genes that are know to be upregulated in Androgenetic Alopecia. This could suggest that more frequent light rolling might be more optimal to keep the gene expression the way we want it for longer.

So there's a lot of different way we could be dermarolling and we're not sure which is the best. But I think the most logical way is to start light and frequent and slow move towards harder and less frequent.