What Norwood Is It When You Are Beyond hair transplants?

[whatintheworld]

Dude not sure if I would get a transplant right now if I were you. Even though your native hair is thin, your hair loss isn't stabilized and a transplant in those diffuse areas can cause shock loss, which would be counterproductive. Also I wouldn't necessarily waste grafts on the crown and rather save them on your hairline in case your forelock thins out.

 

[razzmatazz91]

Dude not sure if I would get a transplant right now if I were you. Even though your native hair is thin, your hair loss isn't stabilized and a transplant in those diffuse areas can cause shock loss, which would be counterproductive. Also I wouldn't necessarily waste grafts on the crown and rather save them on your hairline in case your forelock thins out.

If my hair loss hasn't stabilized even with finasteride, what are the chances of it stabilizing later? It will only stabilize when I'm slick... Also, could an hair transplant cause permanent shock loss in the receptor the area?
I'm not going to get one done for a few years...that is, I won't be able to without incurring massive debt.

Also, is it not safe to conclude because of my VERY visible pattern that my forelock is immune to DHT?

My issue is that if I don't have hair in the crown.... I'll still look like a freak. The hair transplants might frame my face but I will look only slightly better...which isn't optimal IMO as it won't be able to fix the problem.
if I can't do that... I just have to wait out my entire life to get hair cloning at the age of 60. That isn't fun either.

 

[whatintheworld]

If my hair loss hasn't stabilized even with finasteride, what are the chances of it stabilizing later? It will only stabilize when I'm slick... Also, could an hair transplant cause permanent shock loss in the receptor the area?
I'm not going to get one done for a few years...that is, I won't be able to without incurring massive debt.

Also, is it not safe to conclude because of my VERY visible pattern that my forelock is immune to DHT?

My issue is that if I don't have hair in the crown.... I'll still look like a freak. The hair transplants might frame my face but I will look only slightly better...which isn't optimal IMO as it won't be able to fix the problem.
if I can't do that... I just have to wait out my entire life to get hair cloning at the age of 60. That isn't fun either.

I don't think your forelock is immune, it could just be that is how your pattern is developing. But diffuse thinners generally aren't good transplant candidates, which sucks because I'm in a similar boat as you with my hairloss.

The way I see it now, at least with your current hair, you still have a frame to your face. Much better than being slick. So keep at least that with meds for a little while longer and see what happens with regards to those other miniaturized hairs. The problem is, if you lose your forelock, but transplant everything around it, then that will look really weird and you will need another transplant for that. And then it becomes a question of donor management and you seeing what else is left to address that.

 

[razzmatazz91]

I don't think your forelock is immune, it could just be that is how your pattern is developing. But diffuse thinners generally aren't good transplant candidates, which sucks because I'm in a similar boat as you with my hairloss.

The way I see it now, at least with your current hair, you still have a frame to your face. Much better than being slick. So keep at least that with meds for a little while longer and see what happens with regards to those other miniaturized hairs. The problem is, if you lose your forelock, but transplant everything around it, then that will look really weird and you will need another transplant for that. And then it becomes a question of donor management and you seeing what else is left to address that.

I read on Joe Tillman's website that people with diffuse pattern are alright candidates because their pattern is known. But obviously not DUPA guys.

What's with that? Most of those guys who diffuse are NW5+.

 

[whatintheworld]

I read on Joe Tillman's website that people with diffuse pattern are alright candidates because their pattern is known. But obviously not DUPA guys.

What's with that? Most of those guys who diffuse are NW5+.

Most guys who are NW5/6 have nothing left and I wouldn't consider them diffuse. They can transplant on top because there is no other native hair to lose, and anything that is left are such miniaturized hairs that they aren't even salvageable.

 

[razzmatazz91]

Most guys who are NW5/6 have nothing left and I wouldn't consider them diffuse. They can transplant on top because there is no other native hair to lose, and anything that is left are such miniaturized hairs that they aren't even salvageable.

I think I'm beginning to understand your point. An hair transplant will likely kill a lot of hair in the recipient area and so it is worth it if you are slick, but now when you are diffused enough to be ....fucked.

Is that what you mean?

If so....given that my super thin hair hasn't got anywhere with finasteride, what are my best options? Waiting for Replicel/tsiji?? And when it's so bad... Why are hair transplants still a bad choice for diffuse guys?

 

[whatintheworld]

I think I'm beginning to understand your point. An hair transplant will likely kill a lot of hair in the recipient area and so it is worth it if you are slick, but now when you are diffused enough to be ....fucked.

Is that what you mean?

If so....given that my super thin hair hasn't got anywhere with finasteride, what are my best options? Waiting for Replicel/tsiji?? And when it's so bad... Why are hair transplants still a bad choice for diffuse guys?

Well your hair is thin but you've also buzzed it down very low. So if you grew it out a bit then maybe it could look a little fuller.

In my opinion I would wait some more for better treatments before you take the transplant plunge. Stay on finasteride and apply minoxidil to those very thin areas. Remember, once you get a transplant, there is no turning back, so unless the course of action is very clear, it is a risky proposition.

 

[razzmatazz91]

Well your hair is thin but you've also buzzed it down very low. So if you grew it out a bit then maybe it could look a little fuller.

In my opinion I would wait some more for better treatments before you take the transplant plunge. Stay on finasteride and apply minoxidil to those very thin areas. Remember, once you get a transplant, there is no turning back, so unless the course of action is very clear, it is a risky proposition.

I know... As Kobren often says... Once you're cut, you're cut. I definitely want to use it as the last resort.in fact, I also want to research SMP, since I have some thin scruff...it may end up realistic. Thoughts? I'm scared of looking like I have a tattoo on my head though.

But when I grow out my hair, it looks horrific. It is really really thin and miniaturized, so it doesn't look fuller at all.

As for new treatments.... Dude it's been decades now for the community just waiting for something that's always been 'just around the corner'. So...I don't know about that. This Replicel thing seems hyped thus far, and I don't even know if I would be a candidate/able to afford it.

 

[whatintheworld]

Stay pat for now in my opinion, and stay consistent with minoxidil and finasteride usage.

 

[razzmatazz91]

Stay pat for now in my opinion, and stay consistent with minoxidil and finasteride usage.

I will, even if it only keeps the thin, ugly looking scruff.

BTW, what's "pat"?
and what do you think of temporary SMP?

Edit: Thanks for taking the time to explain all this to me bro. I'm getting told very tough to digest things, and am in a very dark place with myself... but you guys are letting me have the truth, and I'm not going to be taken for a ride by some FUE butcher and have myself utterly fucked.

 

[whatintheworld]

I will, even if it only keeps the thin, ugly looking scruff.

BTW, what's "pat"?
and what do you think of temporary SMP?

Edit: Thanks for taking the time to explain all this to me bro. I'm getting told very tough to digest things, and am in a very dark place with myself... but you guys are letting me have the truth, and I'm not going to be taken for a ride by some FUE butcher and have myself utterly fucked.

Staying pat is just an expression in english meaning to stay the course, to not make a change.

I think temporary smp might actually be good for you. Reason being, your hair, even though it is thin, provides some 3D texture and the smp would fill in the gaps around it and make it darker. So you could look like a fullhead with it potentially, or at least people would be hardpressed to notice anything.

My only concern with it is the coloring, as some people say it turns blue-ish or looks unnatural after a while. But on the plus side, at least it is temporary, so in theory it should fade away right?

It's not something I know too much about, I would have to research it a lot more. These are just forum anecdotes I'm reciting.


Yeah man, as someone who is also diffusing all over like you, I am hesitant to undergoe a transplant in fear of butchering myself. While my hair isn't good, at least I'm not slick bald, and that's why at least I'm still on finasteride and minoxidil.

 

[razzmatazz91]

Staying pat is just an expression in english meaning to stay the course, to not make a change.

I think temporary smp might actually be good for you. Reason being, your hair, even though it is thin, provides some 3D texture and the smp would fill in the gaps around it and make it darker. So you could look like a fullhead with it potentially, or at least people would be hardpressed to notice anything.

My only concern with it is the coloring, as some people say it turns blue-ish or looks unnatural after a while. But on the plus side, at least it is temporary, so in theory it should fade away right?

It's not something I know too much about, I would have to research it a lot more. These are just forum anecdotes I'm reciting.


Yeah man, as someone who is also diffusing all over like you, I am hesitant to undergoe a transplant in fear of butchering myself. While my hair isn't good, at least I'm not slick bald, and that's why at least I'm still on finasteride and minoxidil.

temporary SMP apparently fades before it can colour or turn pale/blue.

I wan't saying I'm hesitant to do an hair transplant because of being diffuse.. that's an idea I got from you just now.
I was talking about going to some Doctor and being talked into it "You have amazing donor hair... can achieve excellent results" he might say..... and one year later, I might be putting a rope on the ceiling fixture....

 

[razzmatazz91]

You know what's funny?
A long while ago I figured that being diffuse is actually better from an hair transplant standpoint because you and your Doctor can know the final pattern and do proper long-term donor management planning...

So much for that idea.

 

[whatintheworld]

temporary SMP apparently fades before it can colour or turn pale/blue.

I wan't saying I'm hesitant to do an hair transplant because of being diffuse.. that's an idea I got from you just now.
I was talking about going to some Doctor and being talked into it "You have amazing donor hair... can achieve excellent results" he might say..... and one year later, I might be putting a rope on the ceiling fixture....

Well that too, I wouldn't really know who to trust, especially if I went to do it in a place like Turkey.

 

[whatintheworld]

You know what's funny?
A long while ago I figured that being diffuse is actually better from an hair transplant standpoint because you and your Doctor can know the final pattern and do proper long-term donor management planning...

So much for that idea.

Being diffuse is worse actually for that reason. Your final pattern is usually a high norwood and thus you are practically guaranteed to have multiple procedures as your native hair continues to fall out behind your transplanted hair.

You simply do not have the donor capacity to restore your entire head.

 

[razzmatazz91]

Well that too, I wouldn't really know who to trust, especially if I went to do it in a place like Turkey.

+1. In the land of good doctors like Erdogan, there are lots and lots of butchers waiting to slice up your head.

So look man, if this Replicel thing doen't come out, or I cant get it for whatever reason.... what do you think a guy like me should do? I'm tired of this sh*t now.... it's taken over my life, and I need to do whatever the f*** I can to feel at least half-alive again. Dying everyday like this is pointless.

What's your Norwood level BTW? Pics on any thread?

 

[razzmatazz91]

You simply do not have the donor capacity to restore your entire head.

So what's with all the NW5 transplant result pictures everywhere? Concealers? "Special Effects?"

f*** man.... it hurts to know I dont even have the choice of a transplant.

Can scalp laxity/thick hair diameter/caliber make any significant difference to that? I don't know if I have either, but if yes, I would probably go to a doctor and have myself checked out.

 

[whatintheworld]

I'm a Norwood 5 diffuse. Here is a picture of my hair before I started any treatments:

 

[whatintheworld]

Min has helped improve my crown, I haven't used it on my hairline but I am thinking about it. Finasteride otherwise has helped with maintenance but I haven't got any regrowth.

Just stick with proven treatments for now, try maybe using concealers if it bothers you that much. I wish I could tell you that a transplant would be the right solution but in my opinion it's risky for you dude, due to how your pattern is.

 

[michel sapin]

@whatintheworld ; do you have recent pics which show your result ?