Where Does Your Rejection Of The Blue Pill Viewpoint Come From?

[zircon]

...

 

[Rudiger]

One single picture of me getting ready for a wedding in my suit, bad angle, somewhat wet hair pushed in the most awful way to give me the "island" effect, bloated red face, luckily the stars aligned to make me look as bad as possible, because then I started getting serious about researching treatments, finasteride instead of just minoxidil and dabbling in ridiculous vitamins that I knew weren't doing anything (I've got a shelf of them).

I might even actually look fine bald, I've got a strong face which may survive with stubble, but I try to repress this thought as I definitely won't look better or even the same bald.

Thank god for that picture, I went back to it months afterwards and actually I didn't look as bad as initially thought, but it was definitely a bad picture. I won't go back to it again in case I start thinking I actually looked OK, this is not the kind of harshness I need to be determined in doing something about hair loss.

 

[CopeForLife]

LONG POST ALERT

I remember the moment of realisation.

I was 20. I was sitting in a chair in the hair salon waiting for buzzcut to be made. The lightning was above me so scalp looked like receding also I had horrific enormous bald spots on temples looked into my eyes like a dark void. So I looked like 40 years old clerk in office with diffuse thinning and huge bald spots. Also I had a swollen face because it was a morning.

Then when I decided to "date" someone. I just finished uni and was quite passionate, before I never had depression or bad mood. So I tried to make a "selfie" (I hate this word) for the first time in my life. I felt something wrong with my face it looked like face of 30 years old – I didn't take note of my hairloss yet. Also many times I was called as 30 years old – but I have a teen body, so problem was in my face – it looked too old.

I also got some of "advices" from random fullheads "just shave it bro" (I am not even that bad, NW3.5).

I got comments even from mother about hairloss – redpill comments but I was bluepilled at that time (I literally said I do economy on shampoo because of buzzcut etc.). Every relative commented about how my hair receded. Friends took a note of it.

I got mocked once about balding.

Got called ugly by 4/10 asian girl (no jokes) I wanted to "set a date". Got gently rejected by another asian girl after she saw my face when we talked each other on video (it was the first time I was exposing my face online besides photos). It was my first attempts to date, lol.

Then I started taking the redpill:
1. the first forum I visited about balding was SLYBALDGUYS.COM – even bluepilled I couldn't bear amount of cope and delusions there – the cope dosage was a way too strong
2. reddit (JUST LOL AT MORONS AND WHITEKNIGHTS THERE)
3. r9k – so I found out there about ER, eggman and his The Black Pill video, sluthate and etc
4. lookism – initial months of browsing there impacted me a lot in mental health and caused a severe depression, but now I understand that it was necessary transformation and now I am resistant to most (if not all) of redpill artillery. I feel relieved.
5. finally this subforum – I think it is the best place – not so extreme as lookism and not bluepilled as other bald forums

Worth to note I haven't been interested in relationships or girls before my 20-21 years (really). So better to say I haven't got any pill before neither blue or red.

 

[Roberto_72]

My case: my parents (father NW7) asked me at 18 if I wanted to see a derm for my hair loss because it was becoming evident.

I was eighteen and the derm said it was unlikely that minoxidil would help such an aggressive case. He even said that not even a hair transplant could probably save me in the future.

How is that for a red pill?

 

[Rudiger]

I get a great deal of satisfaction in watching good-looking pricks losing their beauty and their hair and living some of my same misery. Because they deserve it.

All good looking people deserve any misery they receive? Why?

 

[Afro_Vacancy]

iIn spite of being unattractive and not taking great care of myself, I didn't relate that to my problems from age 5-25 as I also had personality problems. I didn't get along with people. I was less religious than the people around me. I had anger issues. I got into a lot of fights. I aid the wrong thing. I was often disparaging, plus since I had an ultra-sheltered childhood I missed a lot of hints related to both social and professional cues. From most of the first jobs I had, I was fired, fired from many jobs in the service sector serving ice cream, bagels, etc. I was almost kicked out of my graduate program too.

So it was obvious to me that looks were not the issue, rather maybe I needed to be more "cool", buy cooler clothes (which is hard to maintain) and so on. I did that for a while and I think I'm a more agreeable, sociable, and interesting person now. The progress from that has been good for making friends, of which I have many, and doing better professionally, where I no longer fear being fired (other than nightmares and occasional panic attacks) but am held in high esteem professionally by my peers.

However, the progress with dating has been marginal. I'm 32, I have about ~20 first dates in my life, maybe 4 women with whom I reached second dates, only two girls have let me into their apartments in a romantic context. No friend has ever fixed me up on a date with someone they know. Not once.

I think it was largely my experiences with online dating, which in my case has been on okcupid, plentyoffish, eHarmony, and tinder.

At the bottom of their profiles, I have seen many, many women write that they're looking for a man who knows how to spell, who knows the difference between you're and your, and who has read their profiles and has more to say than "hi sexy u make me horny". They say that's what they're looking for. I then write to them and ... nothing. This has happened many, many times and there's simply no correlation.

I've also received the same similar advice many times. Write a good profile, emphasize that I'm travelled, cultured, educated, ambitious, have my sh*t together ... barely any responses.

Virtually all of the advice for men online is: be funny, smile in your photo, write a good profile, write good messages, etc.

Meanwhile I know of other guys who put in marginal effort and do very, very well.

So overall, looks is the dominant factor, and for whatever reason we create an edifice of bullshit to convince ourselves otherwise.

ETA: MY red pilling is not really due to baldness but with respect to other factors in my case. I have early male pattern baldness and I don't want it to get worse, it would be yet another thing reducing my potential. No thank you. Some friends think I'm crazy for caring. I don't care to argue in detail.

 

[CopeForLife]

Forgot to note my face was rated average at 4.5/10 with comments about balding on 4chan/soc where 7/10 = 5/10 IRL.

As a cherry on top I've even posted on turbo bluepilled reddit/AmIUgly and got comments about my balding again and 5/10 rating

So people comment about balding here and there but it is just hair)))))) I need to find another planet this is too shallow or what?

IRL I never got commented about my ugliness tho.

Also I am giving redpills here and there to my balding friends – they're accepting them and do a treatments.

 

[hairblues]

Sometimes I wonder where I'd be if I didn't treat my hair loss. I'm still not completely sure where the initial impulse came from, though it likely was related to my displeasure at how bad I looked buzzed and sly. I had also by this point seen several examples of people who were sure they were in the know, that I initially believed due to their confidence, but could later tell had a fundamentally incorrect perception of the world in one way or another.

At the time I called a relative who's a medical doctor. I told her about my hair loss troubles and how I had considered trying finasteride. I gave a brief explanation of how the drug worked. She literally screamed out loud – "are you serious?!" – to me over the phone. Her reaction scared me and made me wary of starting treatment.

She then proceeded to tell me how the bald guys at her hospital were the coolest guys around, and how I sounded like her female friends when they complained about getting fat. I asked how she could possibly know what the effects of baldness would be for me, and her response was that she was a very smart person and had seen a lot of bald guys that did well with women.

At the time I pretended to agree with her, I don't think she ever caught wind that I went ahead anyway.

It's striking how many people that feed this kind of BS to balding guys, on- and offline. It's more or less the default thing they're told. To start treatment and assume the risks/hassle that come with it you kind of have to make an initial leap of faith: that you are correct and that all these other people, some of which may be in a position of authority, are wrong. It's not surprising to me that most men give up treatment or simply don't start at all, even when they are presented with their options. The pushback from the outside world is too strong and they don't have the will to follow their own intuition.

So to those who are doing treatments, where did your decision to start treatment/reject the blue pill viewpoint come from? Did you have any notable episodes like I had with my relative? It would be interesting to know what made people pull the trigger.

As 45 year old woman so i am probably same generation as your Aunt.

I think each generation the expectation for men to be good looking is increasing..and probably your Aunt is being genuine in her life experience but does not help you in your situation.

Also your aunt criticizing her friends who got fat complaining does not realize its not good for women to get fat..i was fat for little while--forget it i was treated night and day to when i was slim..it was shocking. And i am really pretty some say beautiful did not matter..People are much nicer when slim. I lost 30lbs as fast as i could and people went back to treating me better--it's a sad reality. Some people do have thick skin and can raise above anything but not all of us are like that not even most.

Your aunt is either a very evolved person (which is awesome) OR she is naturally slim.

 

[Dnpuntold]

I remember someone maybe it was Dante mentioning the word Jade/Jaded and that word describes a big % of my past ,I came from a pretty much nonfunctional family which nearly destroyed me before I got to my 20s ,by the time I was nineteen I was a obese child/adult weighting at around 160kgs ,severe depression and a jar full of mental problems,my body was a total wreck , I've had seasons by seasons simple pass me by while I was rolling around bed simple because it was just too painful physically to simply move .Hairloss for me was just another flavor in the cake .During that period of my life I've had noone well I never did anyway so I solute the youtubers which became my family,mentors and role models I never had athenewins and Elliott Hulse in particular.They were the people that swayed me away from taking the one way road to death.Not much was changed about my life back then but I was able to make a living for myself thru poker since I was introduced to it by Athene,I was still 160kg with severe physical and mental pain ,playing poker and league all day and night ,while my hair was slowly going north and I was deluding myself things were improving in my everyday life ,until I had that snapping moment as youd call it.I was just going thru my day just finishing my 6 hour daily poker grind so I went for a snack and q'd up for a relaxing game of league lololo,every champion in league has quotes and such ,eventually I heard the words "Only a fool plays the hand his been dealt" coming out of my champions mouth and mama ain't raised no fool xD jk,but yeah that little quote was my snapping moment.One and a half years later I'm standing at 70kgs ,slowly recovering from Androgenetic Alopecia and my back injuries ,working as a chef and taking every step possible to get into college in the next 2 years .Getting hunted by the shadows of my past has turned into a everyday thing,but life is different and yet the same now,everyday is a grind ,everyday is still a struggle and yet it's a blessing to have it.Adapt or die

 

[CaptainForehead]

iIn spite of being unattractive and not taking great care of myself, I didn't relate that to my problems from age 5-25 as I also had personality problems. I didn't get along with people. I was less religious than the people around me. I had anger issues. I got into a lot of fights. I aid the wrong thing. I was often disparaging, plus since I had an ultra-sheltered childhood I missed a lot of hints related to both social and professional cues. From most of the first jobs I had, I was fired, fired from many jobs in the service sector serving ice cream, bagels, etc. I was almost kicked out of my graduate program too.

Why were you fired from jobs? And grad school?

 

[lbj2]

I started losing hair at 14, and was NW3 by 18 when I started taking finasteride consistently. Would've started on finasteride at 16 if the internet were what it was today--instead, I listened to my idiot GP who claimed that the drug wouldn't do any substantial good. When you start losing hair that early, it's pretty clear that you're not going to enjoy a decent sex life absent a decent head of hair. Probably what fucked up Fred and so many others so badly.

 

[Afro_Vacancy]

Why were you fired from jobs? And grad school?

Fired from jobs and fired from graduate school. I was laid off from one ice cream + chocolates job (they fired ~10 people during a management change), fired from waitering (lots of customers complained), fired from a Canadian analogue to Kmart known as Zellers, fired from a bagel store (they fired everybody), fired from another ice cream job. Did hold on to a few jobs later on. The difficulties were a combination of being unattractive (which made me a target), being sheltered (see point A), and poor social skills amplifying the damage. Also, my hearing impairment makes a lot of service sector jobs very difficult, but I didn't know I had a hearing impairment at the time, so really I just looked like a moron.

I convinced them to hold on to me in graduate school and did extremely well in the end but in hindsight it was very calibrated. I wasn't prepared for graduate school so it took me a lot of effort to get the engine going. I actually sent my then-adviser a complete draft of my first publication on the same day when another professor told me they wanted me to leave, 19 months in. That's very fine-tuned. I lobbied them and they gave me a 12-month stay of execution/probation which I completed very well ... which again was very fine-tuned as I considered instead 1) sending a long email insulting everybody or 2) suicide or 3) leaving in silence and maybe teaching high school.

Of the 4 people I started graduate school with, I was the last person to submit a publication to a journal, and later on the first person to finish the degree.

Part of the reason for this is that a few years before, there was this guy, a former childhood prodigy, who was there for 8 years and did nothing and they gave him a PhD. They wanted to avoid that by kicking out people early if they weren't good. In my time there were two other people (two years older than me) who also had problems. One was a white woman from an upper-middle class background, she did very well in six years of graduate school and five years over two separate postdocs and is now leaving the field, just very little quality work at all, she discusses a lot how there is discrimination against women in the field. Another one was this guy from a rich family. he did a huge amount of work but he has ADHD so a lot of his work never reached completion. They kicked him out after 4 years but now ... he is still in the field and doing excellent, high-quality research, lol.

I understand that it will be difficult for people in late career to judge people in early career.

 

[I.D WALKER]

David, I try my best to shy away from genericized puns,
but I expect YOU to vanquish many more Goliath's before your great race is finally run.
I'm rooting for you.

 

[shookwun]

That everyone has a personality. There is nothing mutually exclusive about anyones personality. Those that read; travel, involve themselves in activities and have money have everything they need to be competent for being interesting to a women. I mean how much more could you possibly contribute you to your experiences to make yourself more interesting the you actually are. Anyone with a healthy mind set who doesn't live like a recluse will have a semi-interesting life.


Your looks dictate everyrhing. They are the threshold that captivates, and keeps a Womens interest. How receptive she is to you is almost entirely related to your looks.

Once you leave the teenage years behind you realise being friends with a women is a complete joke. After the parties, and school you start to realise in the real world that unless your having sex you probably won't become a friend unless it involves benefits.

What is other wise the point? Almost every girl I have been with recently including roomate, colleagues and friends through friends of women resulted in some sexual contact. It wasn't like the platonic ages of high school where chillin with a chick was mutual and fine either way. Even if you had been friendzoned.

Start to realise your looKS determine everything.


I mean I had sex with 50% of my roomate give the right conditions. Almost 100% once drinks were introduced. I consider myself there friend but without sex it would be useless. I would never consider them my friends outside of big roomate or work colleagues. Where as I am always around these people. Outside of that, not a chance



The days of platonic female friends ups are long gone. Only reason most males are there is being they are not looks compatible. I learned this early on. Women will show you loads of gesures and hints if they are truly interested.

I have no issues of big friends with a female, being in rhe position I am in now though, I would never be a platonic friend witb a hot chick. Absolutely useless.


Most the chicks I am platonic friends with are amongst those I knew since my teenage years. Even then, it is a a moment that will eventually happen.

 

[Rudiger]

That everyone has a personality. There is nothing mutually exclusive about anyones personality. Those that read; travel, involve themselves in activities and have money have everything they need to be competent for being interesting to a women. I mean how much more could you possibly contribute you to your experiences to make yourself more interesting the you actually are. Anyone with a healthy mind set who doesn't live like a recluse will have a semi-interesting life.

I like this post overall and I think you put a lot of thought into it (not to be patronising, but you know I've really disagreed with you in the past and I'm just clearing the air here).

BUT (of course there's a "but") you make it sound like having a personality is this concrete thing, that in our ever more complicated post-internet world that people haven't been smart enough to determine what types of personalities suit theirs.

Everyone can relate to each other in some way, personality is not only a cognitive skill of determining how to relate to someone, but also- and way more importantly, there is a base of fundamental interests that attract people to each other.

 

[That Guy]

That everyone has a personality. There is nothing mutually exclusive about anyones personality. Those that read; travel, involve themselves in activities and have money have everything they need to be competent for being interesting to a women. I mean how much more could you possibly contribute you to your...

I'm sorry, but this entire post is textbook "bro bible" bullshit. You could sum up this entire post by saying, "I have no interest in the companionship of women unless it involves sex, because that is all that women really mean to me." This, despite your claim that you have no problems being friends with women; you literally just finished saying that without sex, their friendship is useless.

I'm friends with several hot women who I will never sleep with, mostly because most of them are married or in long-term relationships already. It doesn't bother me because I know that there are quite literally millions more hot women out there in the world. I also met most of them through work or other friends.

I don't mean to sound like I'm hating on you, but my observation of your rhetoric, hobbies and beliefs is that you would probably fit the "bro" stereotype quite easily. You definitely seem to share their interests of weight lifting and your primary concern, socially, is how much you "pull"; friendship with women is not possible because the only reason for men and women to be together is sex -- It's not so much redpill as it is juvenile.

The fact is, this line of thinking simply isn't true for most social interactions among adults. The majority of the time, even for single people, they are not constantly in quest for ***. When I was at college a few years ago, girls outnumbered guys 3:1; I've never been surrounded by so many hot girls in my life. Some of them I specifically was looking to get with, and often did; others, I simply started talking to and never had any intention of dating or banging them. I remain good friends with many of them. We have gone to concerts, movies, and gave the other person a lift when they broke down on the side of the highway -- I continue to benefit from platonic friendships with women even in my mid 20s.

Women (even the hot ones) are people. If there is nothing to be gained from platonic friendships with women unless you're f*****g them, then there is nothing to be gained from platonic friendships with men unless you're f*****g them too.

 

[shookwun]

I'm sorry, but this entire post is textbook "bro bible" bullshit. You could sum up this entire post by saying, "I have no interest in the companionship of women unless it involves sex, because that is all that women really mean to me." This, despite your claim that you have no problems being friends with women; you literally just finished saying that without sex, their friendship is useless.

I'm friends with several hot women who I will never sleep with, mostly because most of them are married or in long-term relationships already. It doesn't bother me because I know that there are quite literally millions more hot women out there in the world. I also met most of them through work or other friends.

I don't mean to sound like I'm hating on you, but my observation of your rhetoric, hobbies and beliefs is that you would probably fit the "bro" stereotype quite easily. You definitely seem to share their interests of weight lifting and your primary concern, socially, is how much you "pull"; friendship with women is not possible because the only reason for men and women to be together is sex -- It's not so much redpill as it is juvenile.

The fact is, this line of thinking simply isn't true for most social interactions among adults. The majority of the time, even for single people, they are not constantly in quest for ***. When I was at college a few years ago, girls outnumbered guys 3:1; I've never been surrounded by so many hot girls in my life. Some of them I specifically was looking to get with, and often did; others, I simply started talking to and never had any intention of dating or banging them. I remain good friends with many of them. We have gone to concerts, movies, and gave the other person a lift when they broke down on the side of the highway -- I continue to benefit from platonic friendships with women even in my mid 20s.

Women (even the hot ones) are people. If there is nothing to be gained from platonic friendships with women unless you're f*****g them, then there is nothing to be gained from platonic friendships with men unless you're f*****g them too.

Preemptively disqualifying yourself for women that you cannot get.


Hanging out with with hot chicks you want to bang, but oppressing yourself of your true intentions. would rather have not of ever met. My as well have lots of male friends that you can actually have something in common with.



I see no point in being friends platonic ally with a women outside of work, roomatrs and places where you otherwise need to act in a certaina djusted manner. I have casual talk with lots of women outside of my close quarter areas and I would never hang out with them like 'one of the besties' unless we have sexual interest in one another. When I casually chat up wits random girls, that's as close at it gets to a friendship. When I ask a chick for her number its interest in her sexually. Women almost always perceive this in that way also.


Do you seriously think women operate any diffrently then men. Grow up. Outside of your social media friends, women perceive men no diffrently on approaches.

You seem smart on paper but come off as a low t male. Delluding yours with the belief of being any different then a mamal and his animalistic instincts towards women.

 

[Afro_Vacancy]

I do wonder if too many of my friends are women and if it's a problem for me. Most of my friends that are worth mentioning as friends are women. This includes women friends from school/work, and also separately, beyond.

It may be due to my being somewhat of a soft man, and may be due to my being repressed sexually. Or both.

I need a really good f*** with a woman, soon. And separately, I also need some additional , good, male friends.

@That Guy , your dislike of weightlifting comes off as an insecurity. The biggest difference between weightlifting and other activities like swimming, yoga, running, etc is that weightlifting is demonstrated beyond a reasonable doubt to be extremely effective and efficient in improving health, fitness, and aesthetic.

 

[shookwun]

Friendzoned.



I am at a point in my life where when I meet a women nowadays at twenty five both her and I know where this is going. We could have a exclusive one day friendship but the moment she agrees to come over we are seeing each other for the real reason.


Being alone with a women versus being surrounded by others as friends Is a totally different scenario. If you catch yourself always around others and never alone in the privacy of her or your home, then chances are she looks at you nothing more then a little boy known as her friend.

it seems taboo for me to meet a women nowadays as a friend where my dick stays in my pants and I hold her pocket. I don't even remember the last time I have been with a girl that I didn't mess around with....


However I can sympathize for men that are used to these relations. I can assure you however that if she is attracted to you, that you wouldnt be a 'bestie 4 life male'

 

[shookwun]

I do wonder if too many of my friends are women and if it's a problem for me. Most of my friends that are worth mentioning as friends are women. This includes women friends from school/work, and also separately, beyond.

It may be due to my being somewhat of a soft man, and may be due to my being repressed sexually. Or both.

I need a really good f*** with a woman, soon. And separately, I also need some additional , good, male friends.

@That Guy , your dislike of weightlifting comes off as an insecurity. The biggest difference between weightlifting and other activities like swimming, yoga, running, etc is that weightlifting is demonstrated beyond a reasonable doubt to be extremely effective and efficient in improving health, fitness, and aesthetic.

Hi

Nothing wrong with a few friends but whe they out number the amount of male friends you have I would begin to question how women perceive you versus how you perceive them



Once you find yourself a true bromine where you have a solid group of male friends you will appreciate how close and fun the crew is together. Its not the same being around women. That sexual tension for the opposite sex gets in the way.


Going to music festivals, parties and doing guy sh*t with the boys is priceless. Women have there place but will never be a true friend to a male the being male themselves. Its a totally different situation.


I have grow up and phased out many different cliques and crews, but your true friends Stick around. I miss being around my boys that I truly want to be friends with. Women for me nowadays are a form of release. My perception might be skeyed but do you blaMe me? I left one of the biggest cities in north america to make six figures witb friends that I barely know nowadays. People keep leaving and women have never been true friends In my neck of the woods. We simply meet and see if something clicks. They have nobinterest in a gay best friend and nor do i