Exploring The Hormonal Route. Hair=life.

[MylovelyHair]

@dani500 you said you tried cpa with e2 and dutasteride with no results.. that is surprizing how long did you stay on that regimen??Also can't wait for you to finish your gyno surgery (i wish the best results) to update us.My gyno atm is a small hard lump to the size of a small eye ball behind both nipples not visible but it is kind of painful and when hot it gives me puffy right nipple!!I will get surgery i guess next month! Been on bica 60 days and this is the only visible change..If we exclude the gyno dutasteride gives me way more sides than bica to be honest! Maybe i can handle all that meds because i am on Anafranil and Abilify aswell.I hate dutasteride but i must adhere and keep taking for ever!! I take finasteride aswell because it is cheap and why not??My body fat is 8%-9%,i lost muscle on dutasteride about 4 kgs, and a lot more side effects from duta alone!Also this friday i got my self some custom made minoxidil pills from a pharmacy 5mg and i will stop drinking the liquid!

 

[Almas_NW0]

Would rather be bald or dead than to fully commit to trans regimen for life as cis.

Some, including myself, will disagree with you. I have been on HRT for 8 months now and I have no regrets. And I won’t regret even if I have to use HRT, because nothing disfigures like baldness
A year ago, I would have said the same thing as you, but when you rapidly turn into a bald freak, you better understand what to choose in this shitty situation.

 

[Almas_NW0]

Bica+dutasteride 83 days,oral min 66days
Gaining nw0 back (my worse temple in pic)
I was on raloxifene and arimidex last few days so results could be better than this but cant let gyno get any worse before surgery day.
View attachment 175924

Have you tried Dutasteride + Minoxidil or Bicalutamide + Dutasteride? I'm wondering how important bicalutamide is in your regimen. Because at the dosage of 100mg with Finasteride, I continued to go bald as if I hadn't done anything.

 

[Almas_NW0]

I was on finasteride 4 months, dutasteride 8 months, cypro+spironolactone+e2 4months, then bica+dutasteride and started to see changes 1 month in with scalp itching, it was eliminated for the first time ever. Shortly after I started to get results. Oral minoxidil cant work before 2 month mark (different method of action) so judging by that I had satisfactory results before oral min kicked in. I lost ground on just finasteride and dutasteride. Cypro spironolactone maintained. E2 is trash imo, lemme explain why.
My mom and my sister have female levels of hormones and they are diffusing and have worse hairline than me, so my conclusion was if they are losing with female levels of e2 it must be androgens that need to be further suppresed so i added dutasteride for maximal dht protection (~50% scalp dht decrease) and bica for even further dht protection while letting e2 be at normal levels since it seems unneccesary to raise it.View attachment 175928
This is my moms scalp, diffusing in same pattern nw5a/nw6 just in female kind of way with leaving one strand of hair on every follicle. Hairline is like nw2 thats why she has this combover thing in front.
Your claim that 50% of women continue to go bald on bica is funny and wrong like i explained few times now. Women in pilot studies of bicalutamide were mostly spironolactone/cypro/dutasteride/flutamide/finasteride non-responders.
If you have 100 women and they are all balding first line of defense is spironolactone which works for (improves hair,not maintance) 40% of women. We are left with 60 unsatisfied women,next step is to implement finasteride into regimen (not even dutasteride yet).

So if we have this results on JUST finasteride imagine 200mg spironolactone on top of it. Amazing,right? So we are realisticly looking at 20 women in worst case scenario that are unresponsive to treatment (its much less but lets exaggarate here because why not this is place where everyone is aggressive balder LOL.
So next step would be dutasteride.

And we are talking about 0.15 DUTASTERIDE not standard 0.5mg. So lets say it improved hair in 5 more women of those 20 so we are left with 15.
Next step is to implement flutamide.

With flutamide 80% were satisfied with regrowth of their hair. (There is no mention of improvement %).
So lets say we are left with 10 women. We have bicalutamide now.
From this study we can gather this:

So half of those women got great improvement (that were on all those mentioned therapies beforehand) and we are looking at 5 women (at worst) maybe that need even stronger therapy than that according to you because they didn see improvement to not go bald which is 100% not true. Go to trans forums and you will see lucky ones get regrowth its not even common as you think its maintance thats easiest to achive. And your claim that 50% of women continue to go bald is so wrong I cant believe no one corrected you on that claim ever.
As experimentaly said once to you:

And 99.3% guys dont even need antiandrogen, dutasteride is enough for maintance long term (4years study).

You just gotta admit it at one point to yourself, “yes I have BDD and im not normal average person”. But thats ok we have solution for that also.

You started well, but ended up with complete BDD bullshit that I've already had to answer. Probably, in your world, any person who takes their appearance seriously and avoids turning into a ugly orc suffers from mental illness, and even the one who puts on braces or takes care of the skin of the face is sick
Regarding the study: as I understand it, the study of Flutamide was conducted on patients with already stabilized baldness. It changes a lot, doesn't it? The study of Bicalutamide, on the other hand, had a short period, during which it is impossible to judge whether baldness is stabilized. But I admit that it works well for women. But since it does not work for men from this forum, I am not particularly interested in this.

It's a shame that Bicalutamide didn't help most people on this forum. I don’t know how effective it is in women, but among men, only a few responded to it
Dutasteride, according to studies, is good for men. But firstly, baldness has different aggressiveness, and there are practically no young guys in the studies. And secondly, I advise you to look at the photo of any finasteride and Duta research: freezing baldness at a large stage is considered a success. If they started taking drugs immediately at the onset of baldness, for example, on Norwood 1, the results would be more interesting. I do not think that stopping hair loss on Norwood 2-4 is a good result.

 

[keepcoolmybabies]

You started well, but ended up with complete BDD bullshit that I've already had to answer. Probably, in your world, any person who takes their appearance seriously and avoids turning into a ugly orc suffers from mental illness, and even the one who puts on braces or takes care of the skin of the face is sick
Regarding the study: as I understand it, the study of Flutamide was conducted on patients with already stabilized baldness. It changes a lot, doesn't it? The study of Bicalutamide, on the other hand, had a short period, during which it is impossible to judge whether baldness is stabilized. But I admit that it works well for women. But since it does not work for men from this forum, I am not particularly interested in this.

It's a shame that Bicalutamide didn't help most people on this forum. I don’t know how effective it is in women, but among men, only a few responded to it
Dutasteride, according to studies, is good for men. But firstly, baldness has different aggressiveness, and there are practically no young guys in the studies. And secondly, I advise you to look at the photo of any finasteride and Duta research: freezing baldness at a large stage is considered a success. If they started taking drugs immediately at the onset of baldness, for example, on Norwood 1, the results would be more interesting. I do not think that stopping hair loss on Norwood 2-4 is a good result.

The reason I think bica works for women and not men is that in men it raises T levels but effectively prevents T from binding, so that excess likely converts to DHT which has far more affinity for androgen receptors than bica does. So imo bica should never be used without being in conjunction with a 5ari (or e2 which will prevent much of the increase in T due to hpa axis)

 

[keepcoolmybabies]

Thats why I said to him its brainless to upgrade to bica and then lower 5ar blockade from dutasteride to finasteride… you are essentially downgrading your regimen since only dht is important in hairloss.

Well I think T might also cause hairloss in people whose receptors are suuuper sensitive. But T has a fraction of the binding affinity that dht does, so doesn't pose nearly the same threat. But that might be to blame in those who get increased hairloss after introducing dutasteride

 

[Mr. Slap Head]

The reason I think bica works for women and not men is that in men it raises T levels but effectively prevents T from binding, so that excess likely converts to DHT which has far more affinity for androgen receptors than bica does. So imo bica should never be used without being in conjunction with a 5ari (or e2 which will prevent much of the increase in T due to hpa axis)

Won’t a significant portion of that T aromatize in women?

Well I think T might also cause hairloss in people whose receptors are suuuper sensitive. But T has a fraction of the binding affinity that dht does, so doesn't pose nearly the same threat. But that might be to blame in those who get increased hairloss after introducing dutasteride

I used to lean towards this theory but when you consider that pseudohermaphrodites (lacking 5AR) never lose hair it makes me believe that the dutasteride hair loss could have to do with upregulation. But perhaps it is a combination. Hmm…

 

[keepcoolmybabies]

Won’t a significant portion of that T aromatize in women?




I used to lean towards this theory but when you consider that pseudohermaphrodites (lacking 5AR) never lose hair it makes me believe that the dutasteride hair loss could have to do with upregulation. But perhaps it is a combination. Hmm…

T can be aromatized to E in either sex, and bica generally increases E lvls in cis men taking bica alone. But that increase in T won't occur in cis women (or trans women using E due to its antigonadotropin effect causing negative feedback on the hpg axis).


As for T causing hairloss, I'm honestly not sure. Your point about 5ar deficient individuals being immune to hairloss is valid and made me believe at one time dht was the only potential cause. But I'm really not sure one way or another. I suppose dutasteride could be increasing receptor sensitivity of starved receptors upregulating to such a degree that even a minor amount of dht is potent enough to decimate hair in such unlucky individuals. But who knows ultimately

 

[Almas_NW0]

Without fertility you are not man

This assertion is not supported by anything. It's nothing more than your imagination. In Russia, some say that one who has not served in the army is not a man. You are spouting similar nonsense, which is based on nothing. I don't think a man is defined by his fertility and erection lol
And I don't understand fertility concerns from those who aren't even planning to have children. In my opinion, such contradictory is a sign of dementia.

 

[Guru0007]

This assertion is not supported by anything. It's nothing more than your imagination. In Russia, some say that one who has not served in the army is not a man. You are spouting similar nonsense, which is based on nothing. I don't think a man is defined by his fertility and erection lol

Hey... How is ur hair?.. Treatment working?

 

[Almas_NW0]

Hey... How is ur hair?.. Treatment working?

Yes, I have terminal hair along the Norwood 0 growth line. But it is very thin. I'm waiting for the thickening.

 

[Guru0007]

Yes, I have terminal hair along the Norwood 0 growth line. But it is very thin. I'm waiting for the thickening.

Ur regime?.. I'm currently on 100 mg spironolactone and 4mg estradiol sublingual...

 

[Guru0007]

Ur regime?.. I'm currently on 100 mg spironolactone and 4mg estradiol sublingual...

But since starting hrt... My hair has become brittle and wirey... Is it due to hormonal fluctuations?

 

[Almas_NW0]

Ur regime?.. I'm currently on 100 mg spironolactone and 4mg estradiol sublingual...

Click on "My regimen"
I did not have increased fragility

 

[Guru0007]

Click on "My regimen"
I did not have increased fragility

Ok ... I don't know y my hair turned fragile overnight...

 

[MylovelyHair]

But you will be ready for the balkan summer!!did your doctor say after how many days do you hit the gym??Also can you use via gra together with oral minoxidil?

 

[WendyPayne]

Happy for all of those who succeed to solve the problem, hope that soon I will be among you.

 

[Experimentality]

My biggest mistake I did was to try estrogen, nothing came good out of it as non trans person. I got worse/thinner skin,no regrowth whatsoever,sunken in cheeks like meth addict,shrunken balls (1/4 of original size, now reversed),no muscles,big f*****g tits which im gonna get surgery for in next few days and no energy/depression with 0 libido… theres more probably this were first ones to come up to my mind.
If anyone wants to try HRT “safely” they can just try Bicalutamide high dose monotherapy (with dutasteride), its same effect just much safer (for balls) if you monitor liver enzymes. You would get e2 to lower end of premenopausal women and testosterone activation to women levels. If you dont regrow hair in that environment its very likely full hrt would not benefit you much more. And whats the point in regrowing hair on 8mg E2 when you cant ever come off of that dose. Would rather be bald or dead than to fully commit to trans regimen for life as cis.

Spot on. When someone feels adventurous about oral regimens they should first think very hard, and when still feeling adventurous they could maybe try Bicalutamide (after giving Dutasteride sufficient time, of course). Bicalutamide is still relatively benign (in comparison to E2) since it doesn't actually shut down the HPT axis. The effects of Bicalutamide are also (almost) always reversible, which makes a wrong decision more forgiving. Don't mess with E2 when you're male. I'm 100% sure it will be regretted (genuine trans people are an exception, of course).

 

[cetm-419]

Spot on. When someone feels adventurous about oral regimens they should first think very hard, and when still feeling adventurous they could maybe try Bicalutamide (after giving Dutasteride sufficient time, of course). Bicalutamide is still relatively benign (in comparison to E2) since it doesn't actually shut down the HPT axis. The effects of Bicalutamide are also (almost) always reversible, which makes a wrong decision more forgiving. Don't mess with E2 when you're male. I'm 100% sure it will be regretted (genuine trans people are an exception, of course).

speaking in absolutes is irresponsible, how could you be 100% sure someone will regret anything.

 

[Almas_NW0]

Don't mess with E2 when you're male. I'm 100% sure it will be regretted (genuine trans people are an exception, of course).

I have not seen a single example where someone would regret it. The side effects of HRT are overrated, not underestimated, which is why we don't see people who would regret. The fact is that people are well aware of the side effects and resort to it when it becomes clear that the second choice is the complete destruction of life due to baldness. No one thinks that HRT has no consequences, so they are not horrified when they get changes.
When the question is between HRT and the destruction of life, you are unlikely to regret