Exploring The Hormonal Route. Hair=life.

[bridgeburn]

Also I was reading that mtf are prescribed UP TO 8mg E a day.

it depends on person, and how fast the liver metabolises it. they get blood tests usually and adjust dose as needed.

I have tried CPA before at 25mg and it was the same as spironolactone for me.

how long did you take it for?

even though it’s a huge dose of E.

I dont think its a huge dose. 1 diane pill is like 3.5mg estradiol. Im taking more than that.

 

[bridgeburn]

I think you're taking these drugs for life. 25mg of Cyproterone is already a lot, ben careful.

Im not going to take cypro for life, could be dangerous. ill just take for a few months.

 

[Georgie]

it depends on person, and how fast the liver metabolises it. they get blood tests usually and adjust dose as needed.

how long did you take it for?

I dont think its a huge dose. 1 diane pill is like 3.5mg estradiol. Im taking more than that.

Ethynil estradiol in Diane35 is vastly stronger. Here’s a conversions table of estrogens
https://www.earlymenopause.com/hrt-equivalencies/

Diane has 35mcg which is indeed 3.5mg estradiol or so, but even so, it’s a high dose for any human being. It’s actually banned in a lot of countries because it causes strokes and clots. But yeah.. taking 8mg of estradiol is a lot more haha. I give very little fucks. I’m willing to do it myself.

I was on Androcur for maybe 3 months but is made me feel all kinds of fucked up. really depressed.

 

[bridgeburn]

It’s actually banned in a lot of countries because it causes strokes and clots.

i heard it causes that not just for being stronger but because of the way it is metabolised by the liver.

taking 8mg of estradiol is a lot more haha. I give very little fucks. I’m willing to do it myself.

try rubbing progesterone cream/gel on your scalp and face too. since it competively binds to 5ar. both e and p reduce dht.

 

[michel sapin]

crazy regrowth!
how bad are the sides right now ?

 

[Jesse Navarro]

Thats the problem with this kind of regimen. You taste the blood and become addicted, soon you want to eat all the people roaming the face of the earth. Not sure if im seeing results yet but if i see it i wont stop even if i get gyno

 

[AnxiousAndy]

hello everyone, a few things have been on my mind. I am wondering how much of this is from the oral minoxidil, my hair is really dense and I am worried that someday i may get synchronized sheds or minoxidil dependence. I know that the minoxidil and the estradiol are both having effects, its kinda weird and cool how i get more body hair on some places for awhile until the estrogen catches up, like right now my arm is hairier because of minoxidil but recently I've been losing hair specifically on my hands, my upper arms are getting fuzzy but my leg hair is falling out. Ive been taking the 10mg only one time per day but its still a high dose and having effect despite its short half life. I know that minoxidil decreases collagen production so I don't think that I want to use it forever if possible.
I realize also that there are trans mtf's on full trans regimens who although get dramatic regrowth and improvement still have much trouble with the problem areas like the temples! I'm wondering if i will need to go stronger, it seems my temples are narrowing in towards the center but still the center is the slowest to improve and most stubborn, it looks better up close but still looks bare from a distance and it is bothering me.

View attachment 79174

I know i've improved alot and should be grateful but I want more and more and I'm hoping most of it is not because of the initial minoxidil growth. So,
I will be reducing the amount of oral minoxidil to 10mg every other day which I'm nervous about but I'm going on a stronger antiandrogen regimen today. I don't give a f*** about sides anymore, my dick still works that's all that matters, I want my goddamn youth back!
I'm restarting cypro 50mg everyday, i will use the rest of the 104 pills I have left. I will start using topical estrogel again at 2.25mg along with 2mg buccal estrofem, I'm still on .5mg dutasteride everyday. also I will be using Nizoral 2%, I don't know if it will help but If I'm going to wash my hair at all I want to at least wash it with something that might help it and won't hurt and i think keto shampoo has the most science behind it as far as shampoos go. I dont have a schedule for nizoral, just whenever i feel like washing my hair.

Your hair is looking amazing, are you sure you want to change anything in your regimen or up it? Anyone's who's not a Norwood spotter would not consider you balding.

 

[rupture]

So bridge as you know I'm on exact reg as you and we have been on right at the same time. My hair came back as good as yours but I have had small shed for last 2 weeks that is noticeable I had one in September too. I think I've been on Loniten a while longer than you and wondering if I,m getting sync sheds. Have you had any sheds at all ? It,s weird because my right side has always been my weak side and its were it always sheds more. I thought the first shed was a seasonal shed but now I'm wondering about sync

 

[Georgie]

So bridge as you know I'm on exact reg as you and we have been on right at the same time. My hair came back as good as yours but I have had small shed for last 2 weeks that is noticeable I had one in September too. I think I've been on Loniten a while longer than you and wondering if I,m getting sync sheds. Have you had any sheds at all ? It,s weird because my right side has always been my weak side and its were it always sheds more. I thought the first shed was a seasonal shed but now I'm wondering about sync

Every year my “weak” areas get worse then regrow. Takes months, but it’s happened over and over. This means my whole hairline recedes back to where it was pre treatment, then back again. To be honest I think I’m just stuck with this because as far as I know there’s no way to change it. I am trying stemoxydine to see if I can’t kick some of the hair back into life and mix up the hair cycle, but I have little hope.

I’ll add that my shedding stays consistent. It’s more just that the hair grows all at once, then stops growing all at once.

 

[SpaceInvader]

Every year my “weak” areas get worse then regrow. Takes months, but it’s happened over and over. This means my whole hairline recedes back to where it was pre treatment, then back again. To be honest I think I’m just stuck with this because as far as I know there’s no way to change it. I am trying stemoxydine to see if I can’t kick some of the hair back into life and mix up the hair cycle, but I have little hope.

I’ll add that my shedding stays consistent. It’s more just that the hair grows all at once, then stops growing all at once.

Why not upping the dose?

I'm currently on 3.3 mg/mL and keeping refrigerated.

 

[Georgie]

Why not upping the dose?

I'm currently on 3.3 mg/mL and keeping refrigerated.

Of minoxidil or daro?
I can’t up my minoxidil dose because it makes my face and body bloat badly.
I have slowly upped my dose each week for daro. I started with 40mg/40ml, then 50mg/40ml, now 58mg/40ml.

 

[SpaceInvader]

Of minoxidil or daro?
I can’t up my minoxidil dose because it makes my face and body bloat badly.
I have slowly upped my dose each week for daro. I started with 40mg/40ml, then 50mg/40ml, now 58mg/40ml.

I dissolved 50 mg of Daro in 15 mL of Kirkland minoxidil, and doing 2 mL twice a day. Keep your minoxidil dose the same, just increase the daro. Mine should be more concentrated at around 3.3 mg/mL. Only one application as of now. So far so good.

 

[bridgeburn]

how bad are the sides right now ?

about the same as usual, except more body hair has been shedding recently

Thats the problem with this kind of regimen. You taste the blood and become addicted, soon you want to eat all the people roaming the face of the earth. Not sure if im seeing results yet but if i see it i wont stop even if i get gyno

Hahhaahaha! this is so true

Your hair is looking amazing, are you sure you want to change anything in your regimen or up it?

Im upping it just in case and to see if I can get away with less minoxidil. And also what Jesse said, I taste the blood.

Have you had any sheds at all ? It,s weird because my right side has always been my weak side and its were it always sheds more. I thought the first shed was a seasonal shed but now I'm wondering about sync

there was a brief time when I thought maybe I was shedding, cause more hair would come out but I think my hair was actually getting better at the same time and not noticeably worse. actually maybe my body hair is more synced?

 

[Marky]

I exercise. A lot.

Georgie what is your experience on working out/weightlifting and hair loss? I know people freak out over it cause it produces T, but wait a minute, isn't T what gave us thick hair in puberty, along with other growth things.

It's the dht from T that is the culprit, but what if someone was on finasteride or better yet dutasteride - then lifting would be a benefit to hair, no? Instead of pumping iron we pump hair. Thoughts anyone?

 

[Georgie]

Georgie what is your experience on working out/weightlifting and hair loss? I know people freak out over it cause it produces T, but wait a minute, isn't T what gave us thick hair in puberty, along with other growth things.

It's the dht from T that is the culprit, but what if someone was on finasteride or better yet dutasteride - then lifting would be a benefit to hair, no? Instead of pumping iron we pump hair. Thoughts anyone?

Working out is only an issue if you are calorie depleted for a period of time and you are over-training, OR you’re stupid enough to take steroids.

My experience is mixed, because it involves years battling anorexia nervosa and athletica. What happens here is, the constant stress from starvation and over-exercising causes cortisol levels to rise, which inhibits the release of gonadotropin releasing hormone in the pituitary gland. So this in turn suppressed the release of follicle stimulanting and luteinising hormone, so there are not hormonal messengers telling the ovaries to produce estrgoen, meanwhile, the adrenal glands are over-stimulated by cortisol which drives androgen levels up. Perfect breeding ground for Androgenetic Alopecia. In men, this condition causes the lowering of testosterone production in the testes. So that is one way exercise can be detrimental.

Alternatively, regular, healthy amounts of exercise combined with a solid diet keeps cortisol levels low, and sex hormones in check. It can promote elevated levels of testosterone and estrgoen, but that’s a good thing. Regular weight training will NOT lead to hairloss if you are taking a healthy approach to it. No steroids, no over-training, good diet. It will not give you Androgenetic Alopecia. If you get Androgenetic Alopecia and you exercise moderately, chances are you were already headed that way.

The moral of the story is you want to keep your steroidal hormones low which actually involves moderate regular exercise.

 

[Marky]

Working out is only an issue if you are calorie depleted for a period of time and you are over-training, OR you’re stupid enough to take steroids.

My experience is mixed, because it involves years battling anorexia nervosa and athletica. What happens here is, the constant stress from starvation and over-exercising causes cortisol levels to rise, which inhibits the release of gonadotropin releasing hormone in the pituitary gland. So this in turn suppressed the release of follicle stimulanting and luteinising hormone, so there are not hormonal messengers telling the ovaries to produce estrgoen, meanwhile, the adrenal glands are over-stimulated by cortisol which drives androgen levels up. Perfect breeding ground for Androgenetic Alopecia. In men, this condition causes the lowering of testosterone production in the testes. So that is one way exercise can be detrimental.

Alternatively, regular, healthy amounts of exercise combined with a solid diet keeps cortisol levels low, and sex hormones in check. It can promote elevated levels of testosterone and estrgoen, but that’s a good thing. Regular weight training will NOT lead to hairloss if you are taking a healthy approach to it. No steroids, no over-training, good diet. It will not give you Androgenetic Alopecia. If you get Androgenetic Alopecia and you exercise moderately, chances are you were already headed that way.

The moral of the story is you want to keep your steroidal hormones low which actually involves moderate regular exercise.

Agreed it's all about balance. But what I was getting at is the affects of T (positive) without the bad by product effects of dht.

So for example, Saturdays are my harder workout sessions, I'm taking dutasteride one hour before the gym, hit the weights harder than normal
to produce T, which I think stimulates hair growth (like in puberty) in addition to general blood flow to the scalp, while the dutasteride circumvents
the harmful dht affects. So it's like puberty all over again only you're getting a second chance with not losing the hair thanks to
the anti-androgen effect.

 

[Georgie]

Agreed it's all about balance. But what I was getting at is the affects of T (positive) without the bad by product effects of dht.

So for example, Saturdays are my harder workout sessions, I'm taking dutasteride one hour before the gym, hit the weights harder than normal
to produce T, which I think stimulates hair growth (like in puberty) in addition to general blood flow to the scalp, while the dutasteride circumvents
the harmful dht affects. So it's like puberty all over again only you're getting a second chance with not losing the hair thanks to
the anti-androgen effect.

Yeah I actually noticed that I’ve been a bit stronger whilst taking avodart. I’m not complaining, but I’d prefer more hair.

 

[bridgeburn]

to produce T, which I think stimulates hair growth (like in puberty)

head hair?? does anyone gain head hair during puberty

 

[Georgie]

head hair?? does anyone gain head hair during puberty

Hair strands do tend to become thicker/coarser after puberty perhaps with the addition of androgens and sex hormones... if you’re not genetically f**ked.

 

[bridgeburn]

Hair strands do tend to become thicker/coarser after puberty perhaps with the addition of androgens and sex hormones... if you’re not genetically f**ked.

I dont think androgens are the reason. except that T can convert to E. androgens are terrible for hair, eunuchs castrated before puberty will not suffer male pattern hairloss.