One of the microneedling studies showed results declining at 6 months, so a good bit longer than minoxidil results
Follica Microneedling Protocol Patent Disclosed
- Thread starter benjt2
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This does nothing to address the actual cause of hairloss. You have to have some method of maintaining. I'm less excited about this now.
Chromeo
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Why did you think it would?
This guys are 10 years late, thats for sure. But its such a massive and under served market that even overpriced stuff like Fol-04 will thrive only because it is effective to some degree.
Hair Transplant clinics and similars are still making millions selling crap like prp and exosomes (lol). Really sad, but thats how things are.
Hair Transplant clinics and similars are still making millions selling crap like prp and exosomes (lol). Really sad, but thats how things are.
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Hi guys,
A lot are saying " Follica is using Minoxidil, so, it's sh*t " !
Don't forget two things :
> Minoxidil solutions actually uses "poor" vehicles ( eth/pg/water or Eth/glycerin/water), some good vehicle can enhance 500% or more the effectivness of a drug...so, it's totally possible Follica to use a new efficient vehicle.
> Minoxidil sulphate is the active metabolite of minoxidil. Very powerfull and works in ALL People ( on the contrary of minoxidil). Problem with sulphate minoxidil is the stability...but...some research founds way to stabilise it with some ascorbate derivatives....
Btw....they could enhance Minoxidil with others synergistic stuff too....
And...Add to this the fact than follica isn't "standard wounding".
Maybe follica will give us suprise....wait !
A lot are saying " Follica is using Minoxidil, so, it's sh*t " !
Don't forget two things :
> Minoxidil solutions actually uses "poor" vehicles ( eth/pg/water or Eth/glycerin/water), some good vehicle can enhance 500% or more the effectivness of a drug...so, it's totally possible Follica to use a new efficient vehicle.
> Minoxidil sulphate is the active metabolite of minoxidil. Very powerfull and works in ALL People ( on the contrary of minoxidil). Problem with sulphate minoxidil is the stability...but...some research founds way to stabilise it with some ascorbate derivatives....
Btw....they could enhance Minoxidil with others synergistic stuff too....
And...Add to this the fact than follica isn't "standard wounding".
Maybe follica will give us suprise....wait !
cloudsanrain
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Maybe a few drop of DMSO in your minoxidil on needling days would help .
It's not a matter of penetration , but more a location where minoxidil will go... ( reaching follicle without entering on the blood stream).
This, ladies and gentleman, is what you call ‘cope’
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This, ladies and gentleman, is what you call ‘cope’
If people wanna speculate, so what? It's no worse than these "They aren't doing anything we can't do at home" people. (these guys seem to have pretty impressive devices at home to make 1600 cm/2 holes without disrupting the skin excessively, and doing it in the right pattern shown in the Follica patent.)
cloudsanrain
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Yes it dose but look at all the people that takes it oraly every day . It gets in their blood stream an It don't seem to affecting them in any way . Me included .
We do, and we also get more regowth than what Follica has shown.
Follica is not meant to improve minoxidil Pemberton. The point of minoxidil is to upregulate Wnt signalling and create hair follicle cells instead of skin cells during wound healing. It is the wounding process itself that causes hair growth, not better delivery of minoxidil.
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We do, and we also get more regowth than what Follica has shown.
Follica is not meant to improve minoxidil Pemberton. The point of minoxidil is to upregulate Wnt signalling and create hair follicle cells instead of skin cells during wound healing. It is the wounding process itself that causes hair growth, not better delivery of minoxidil.
Most people have no idea how you achieve this manually (on a micro scale, I might add?):
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Looks like pegasus2 doesn't think the pattern below is necessary, or important. (Maybe he has conducted extensive studies on it lol.) Or else he would reveal how exactly he manages to do it well-enough manually (on a micro-scale?):
I've gotten some slight results with microneedling myself (Derminator2, 1.0 - 1.2 mm) but doing the above consistently seems feasible only to a computer.
I've gotten some slight results with microneedling myself (Derminator2, 1.0 - 1.2 mm) but doing the above consistently seems feasible only to a computer.
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Follica is a commercial organization. If their solution can be replicated by individuals at home, they wouldn't make a lot of money. So it is in their interest to claim that a certain movement pattern that can only be done by a computer / robot yields significantly better results.
But of course, they would have to provide evidence for that claim.
But of course, they would have to provide evidence for that claim.
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I don't know about the pattern, but something they're doing is either magic, or marketing, if the majority of patients get 40% growth. Some people have gotten that at home, but they're few and far between.
I suspect a lot of DIY guys aren't doing the wounding correctly. They probably err on the side of going too deep because everyone wants do that by default. That increases the pain & mess & time it takes, which leads to them slacking off on the hole density too.
Also, Follica's baseline would be zero treatment of any kind. Some of the DIY guys already had regimens.
Also, Follica's baseline would be zero treatment of any kind. Some of the DIY guys already had regimens.
So I've known about this thread for 2 years and still nothing has been really nailed down yet. I'll just drop my experience..
I've been using a derma pen 1.5mm, average of 1.5 times a month for 2 years and my hair has gotten slightly worse. The only topical I've been using is reviv with their two additives (anti-gray and minoxidil analogue). Not one thing in this routine appears to be doing a damn thing; every aspect has gotten slightly worse.
I can do 2.5mm but it hurts too much to do enough passes to make the scalp nicely wounded and (lastingly) red. I guess I'll try going down to .8 and spending exponentially more time, more passes. For me, .8 is basically pain-free. Even 2.5 is not at all bothersome, specifically in the crown and the low temple near the ear. There are just no pain receptors in those areas. But the frontal scalp, the upper temple that actually tends to recede, or anything near the forehead...that all hurts badly once you go above 1.5.
So I have yet to try a more follica-like method (<1 mm and extreme thoroughness). Till now I have assumed depth is better for reviving the follicles but that's been sufficiently proven false.
I only have diffuse thinning so you'd think needling in a hair-occupied area would make it easier to get some re-density but no. One thing I may have pinpointed is collagen supplementation. My hair was arguably recovering density in 2020, when I first started using a pen and I was taking collagen powder once a day.
Side notes from needling the face
- I had a large melanin spot (sunspot, or whatever) on my cheekbone and it has disappeared from needling. It was about half the size of a dime, not terribly dark, nothing that people have ever pointed out, but I noticed it.
- Needling has done absolutely nothing for increasing facial hair density. I'm a clean shaven/stubble only guy, so I don't actually care about that, just saying.
I don't have a ton of gray or very visible gray since I have light hair. I think I have a slightly low metabolism and low thyroid function. I am a young looking person and the hair is aging faster than everything else. This is why I'm trying hard to address the problem holistically/nutritionally and topically, because being a norwood guy wouldn't suit me. I'll get FUE if my methods don't work adequately. I don't have norwood 7 genes so I can avoid it all together with surgery if nothing else works.
Historically, balding men had faces that suited that look.A lot of guys today have my situation but a lot worse, maybe NW3-4 with the face of a 20-something. That I believe is a deeper nutiritional/environmental issue and not so much 'androgenetic.' I don't believe 'androgenetic alopecia' is the correct name for our issue in a general sense.