Follica Microneedling Protocol Patent Disclosed

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baldlygoing

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losingbattle88

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Can anybody explain why they dont recommend over 1mm? Many use 1.5mm and a few 2mm.... hair folicles are deeper than even 2mm. so why they recommend only 1mm wtf? Can it cause scarring otherwise?
 
John Difool

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From the patent: "Needle target depth: 0.8 mm. For long hair, this can be increased to 1.0 mm, but definitely not more than that. The wound should extend 0.8 mm into the skin but not deeper, 1.0 mm is only to compensate for longer hair."
 
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coolio

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The process isn't about hitting the existing hair follicles, it's about spurring a healing reaction in the skin.

Follica spent years figuring out the ideal wounding method. Don't try to outsmart all that work. Just use what they learned.
 
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coolio

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Follica is cope 10 years of “needling” reaserch only to combine it with minoxidil lol.
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Yes, and their research on wounding methods is the one really useful thing they have produced. We would be stupid not to follow it.
 
losingbattle88

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coolio said:
The process isn't about hitting the existing hair follicles, it's about spurring a healing reaction in the skin.

Follica spent years figuring out the ideal wounding method. Don't try to outsmart all that work. Just use what they learned.
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So u saying to use max 1mm needles? Why do they insist on not going over 1mm? Most People use 1.5mm and some crazy guys use 2mm and get regrowth of hairs. Guess i wont use 1.5mm anymore....
 
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coolio

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The Follica protocol doesn't even compare to "needling" in the normal sense.


1600 holes per centimeter. Stop and think about how much hole density that really is. Draw a 1 cm square on a piece of paper and then see if you can fit 1600 pen/pencil dots into it.

Follica isn't trying to put a series of holes on smooth skin. They are using needles to poke so many holes, so tightly spaced, that it basically destroys the top layer of skin like an abrasion wound. It's gonna heal quicker than a true dermabrasion because of the tissue left in place, but the idea is to provoke a similar kind of HEALING REACTION from the body.

Abrasion wounds have to be shallow unless you want terrible scarring. Keep it a 1.0 millimeters max.
 
John Difool

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Abrasion wounding will cause the skin to look red as if you got a sun burn. Do you think that research papers describing wounding as a trigger for neogenesis should use another wounding protocol like real scaring with different drugs?
 
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coolio

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Scar tissue is never gonna be doing us any favors in terms of hair growth IMO.

IMO there may be an argument for sunburns having (usefully) different effects. But that has to be weighed against the permanent UV damage.

Abrasions can be powerful for provoking healing responses. But between Follica and the last 100+ years of cosmetic industry (dearmabrasion, etc) that territory has already been explored.

I think Follica's wounding method is probably as good as it gets in the foreseeable future (for hair-regrowth purposes). They found a way to use needles and get the healing reactions of a deeper wound + the recovery process of a less-intense one. Follica has been a big disappointment on the drug side of the approach but they did good work on the wounding refinement IMO.


I'm still a big believer that Follica's core idea (skin wounding + drugs = new hair) is good. Great, in fact. There is enough scattered anecdotal evidence in the medical world to suggest that the human body is capable of growing all-new terminal hairs that way.

But after 15 years of research, Follica has epic-failed to produce any practical treatment progress (on the drug front). I dunno what else we can do here.
 
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5minutesbeforemiracle

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pegasus2

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5minutesbeforemiracle said:
This is super great news. They're aiming for FDA approval next year... This + pyrilutamide phase 3 this year. Everything's coming up Milhouse.
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I'm glad it's finally going to be available in clinics, but it's $3,000 for something you can do at home for $200. It might be worth it if you live close to a place that offers it just so you don't have to wound yourself, but this is something a lot of us have already done ourselves, and the results of that are sometimes better than the results that Follica has reported.
 
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pegasus2 said:
I'm glad it's finally going to be available in clinics, but it's $3,000 for something you can do at home for $200. It might be worth it if you live close to a place that offers it just so you don't have to wound yourself, but this is something a lot of us have already done ourselves, and the results of that are sometimes better than the results that Follica has reported.
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It's true that a lot of people got great results from wounding + min, but I wonder how many actually got the neogenesis which follica claims to be able to achieve? I suppose if you got the neogenesis the results might be longer lasting (just my guess).
Anyway, one thing I'm wondering is why they're looking to sell it as "x6 treatments" only. I would've thought they'd have tried to make this an ongoing treatment (more money for them that way).
 
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Ralph Wiggum

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pegasus2 said:
I'm glad it's finally going to be available in clinics, but it's $3,000 for something you can do at home for $200. It might be worth it if you live close to a place that offers it just so you don't have to wound yourself, but this is something a lot of us have already done ourselves, and the results of that are sometimes better than the results that Follica has reported.
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Follica is claiming 75% chance of strong hair growth effect, 25% chance of modest effect. That sounds a lot higher than what we get with microneedling at home, doesn't it?
 
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pegasus2

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5minutesbeforemiracle said:
It's true that a lot of people got great results from wounding + min, but I wonder how many actually got the neogenesis which follica claims to be able to achieve? I suppose if you got the neogenesis the results might be longer lasting (just my guess).
Anyway, one thing I'm wondering is why they're looking to sell it as "x6 treatments" only. I would've thought they'd have tried to make this an ongoing treatment (more money for them that way).
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I don't believe them. They got neogenesis in mice, not humans. If they really got de novo HFs then the results would be better. I don't think they want to cause cancer by keeping skin permanently wounded.
Ralph Wiggum said:
Follica is claiming 75% chance of strong hair growth effect, 25% chance of modest effect. That sounds a lot higher than what we get with microneedling at home, doesn't it?
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Did you look at the pictures in the video? Moderate hair growth is 12%. Strong hair growth is 44% lol. Yeah, tons of us have done better than that
 
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pegasus2

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LouisSarkozy said:
are they still using minoxidil as their main growth stimulant?
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Yes, he confirmed in the video that it will only be needing and minoxidil. For anything else they will have to do more clinical trials so you can forget about that. With hair multiplication coming I doubt Follica v2 will ever see the light of day
 
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5minutesbeforemiracle

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pegasus2 said:
I don't believe them. They got neogenesis in mice, not humans. If they really got de novo HFs then the results would be better. I don't think they want to cause cancer by keeping skin permanently wounded.
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In the video Bhardwaj says they did scalp biopsies to confirm follicle neogenesis in humans. I don't think he'd so blatantly lie because it's illegal (I think)! I do wonder where the massive price tag comes from. I guess it's because they spent so much money on R&D for this product.
Good point about the cancer; I guess it's up to the patient to figure out how to maintain their new hairs afterwards.
 
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pegasus2

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5minutesbeforemiracle said:
In the video Bhardwaj says they did scalp biopsies to confirm follicle neogenesis in humans. I don't think he'd so blatantly lie because it's illegal (I think)! I do wonder where the massive price tag comes from. I guess it's because they spent so much money on R&D for this product.
Good point about the cancer; I guess it's up to the patient to figure out how to maintain their new hairs afterwards.
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Depends what they call new hairs. By their definition you could say we are getting new hairs too. They aren't doing anything we can't do at home
 
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