Yes it always look like sh*t. It's obvious the technique will be much more refined once it hit the clinics.
Edit: it's not "mouse hair". They used human DPSC.
Hell yea, brand new update from Stemson!
- Thread starter werefckd
- Start date
Edit: it's not "mouse hair". They used human DPSC.
Yea, Terskikh said they would want to have hair transplant surgeons transplanting their new hairs.
Also, they have to use a scaffold to control hair direction (and we have different hair directions depending on the part of the scalp).
We don't know for sure because they never talked directly about that but there is a lot of evidence suggesting that it will be one injection per new follicle or something very close to that.
Man you should if you can!
Trials there can be fast tracked according to FollicleThought, so it will be excellent news if they ended starting the clinical trials in UK
"Stemson announced that they are targeting the UK as a location to further their R&D and potentially conduct their first human trial in. Perhaps the most interesting facet of this news is the fact that we are familiar with the UK having a unique regulatory allowance referred to as “Specials.” In the case of Specials, physicians are able to prescribe and administer treatments which have not gone through a full clinical trial process to patients if said treatments are determined to be reasonably safe and are filling a need where other treatment options do not yet exist. Multipled dermal papilla cell injections may be an example of this. The one catch is that companies who develop the up-and-coming treatments are not allowed to market their treatment to patients and the decision to attempt the treatment must solely come from the physician and then the patient.
So I just did a quick reread in all Stemson's website, papers, and Dr. Terskikh. I didn't see the word "injection" being used not even once.
On the other hand, the term "transplantation" was used many times. For example:
Dr. Terskikh: The future procedures will be based on autologous cells. Patient’s own cells (say couple of hairs, tiny piece of skin, or 1ml of blood) is reprogrammed to iPSCs. These iPSCs are banked and kept forever in liquid Nitrogen. An aliquot of iPSCs is used to differentiate these cells into DP cells and keratinocytes. In the future other cells like melanocytes will be obtained as well so one can have hair of any color.. )) Then DP cells will be mixed with keratinocytes within specialized matrix scaffold and transplanted back into the same patient’s skin. This will be done for each patient.
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HLC2020: How do you plan to administer the treatment? A proprietary device?
Dr. Terskikh: Initially this will be done manually by the doctors. Eventually, we are discussing the development of biomedical robotic machines that will be doing the transplantation automatically.
On the other hand, the term "transplantation" was used many times. For example:
Dr. Terskikh: The future procedures will be based on autologous cells. Patient’s own cells (say couple of hairs, tiny piece of skin, or 1ml of blood) is reprogrammed to iPSCs. These iPSCs are banked and kept forever in liquid Nitrogen. An aliquot of iPSCs is used to differentiate these cells into DP cells and keratinocytes. In the future other cells like melanocytes will be obtained as well so one can have hair of any color.. )) Then DP cells will be mixed with keratinocytes within specialized matrix scaffold and transplanted back into the same patient’s skin. This will be done for each patient.
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HLC2020: How do you plan to administer the treatment? A proprietary device?
Dr. Terskikh: Initially this will be done manually by the doctors. Eventually, we are discussing the development of biomedical robotic machines that will be doing the transplantation automatically.
Yes ?
But how are you going to transplant cells within a liquid then ? pour it into the patients with your hands or what?
Transplant isn't only when moving an entire organ like an heart, you also transplant stem cells. and those are injected back into your body,
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Transplant is, that you move something from one place to another place.
Like a heart transplant, you move that from one person to another person.
Same with your cells, they are extracted from one place to be cultivated and then injected somewhere else, they are transplanted.
They will put the cells inside a biodegradable scaffold, so there will be a structure around them.
I don't think so, at least according to the more recent interviews.
They are considering doing clinical trials in the UK. There, under certain conditions, it's possible to offer the treatment to the public before doing a full clinical trial process.
"Perhaps the most interesting facet of this news is the fact that we are familiar with the UK having a unique regulatory allowance referred to as “Specials.” In the case of Specials, physicians are able to prescribe and administer treatments which have not gone through a full clinical trial process to patients if said treatments are determined to be reasonably safe and are filling a need where other treatment options do not yet exist."
Updates Archive - Follicle Thought
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Tsuji/Organ's approach was very similar to what Stemson is doing (except for the source of the stem cells). And the implantation part of the Tsuji/Organ procedure was basically a FUT, according to their own words:
Mr. Toyoshima: We believe that in order to provide our technologies to a broader range of people, we will eventually need to automate the process using a device. However, the current level of the skills owned by surgeons specialized in hair transplants is excellent, generating great results in treatments of alopecia patients. Therefore, we would like to leverage on such skills of surgeons as much as possible. Eventually, these skills are accumulated resulting in certain processes. Therefore, we believe that it is appropriate to develop automation devices incorporating such processes.
Keiko: Does this mean that such automation would not require a surgeon with special skills and would enable a regular clinic to provide your therapy?
Mr. Toyoshima: Well, of course, unfortunately considering potential cost of such devices, it might be difficult for any clinic to provide the therapy… however, we are aiming to have our therapy to be implemented in as simple as possible of an environment. As for the question about needles… Our transplanting technique was developed based on the FUT, Follicular Unit Transplantation, which is the surgical autografting used by hair transplant surgeons for hair loss treatment. The needle/surgical knife used for FUT is extremely small. The size of the surgical knife we used for our published research paper is almost same as that of a needle. Therefore, although we will do a skin incision, it will be a very small incision.
Keiko: Meaning it will not leave any scar?
Mr. Toyoshima: Yes, it will leave almost no scar… the scar will not visible at all. Yes, so the process requires a skin incision, but please understand that the incision will be about the same size as needle head.
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Notice how the Organ researcher had a very similar lingo as Dr. Terskikh (wants to use hair transplant surgeons to perform the procedure, thinks in the future the implantation will need to be automatised - giving the idea that the procedure is very timing consuming). Looks like the creation and implantation of new hairs via stem cells will pretty much look like a hair transplant in the front end of things.
Mr. Toyoshima: We believe that in order to provide our technologies to a broader range of people, we will eventually need to automate the process using a device. However, the current level of the skills owned by surgeons specialized in hair transplants is excellent, generating great results in treatments of alopecia patients. Therefore, we would like to leverage on such skills of surgeons as much as possible. Eventually, these skills are accumulated resulting in certain processes. Therefore, we believe that it is appropriate to develop automation devices incorporating such processes.
Keiko: Does this mean that such automation would not require a surgeon with special skills and would enable a regular clinic to provide your therapy?
Mr. Toyoshima: Well, of course, unfortunately considering potential cost of such devices, it might be difficult for any clinic to provide the therapy… however, we are aiming to have our therapy to be implemented in as simple as possible of an environment. As for the question about needles… Our transplanting technique was developed based on the FUT, Follicular Unit Transplantation, which is the surgical autografting used by hair transplant surgeons for hair loss treatment. The needle/surgical knife used for FUT is extremely small. The size of the surgical knife we used for our published research paper is almost same as that of a needle. Therefore, although we will do a skin incision, it will be a very small incision.
Keiko: Meaning it will not leave any scar?
Mr. Toyoshima: Yes, it will leave almost no scar… the scar will not visible at all. Yes, so the process requires a skin incision, but please understand that the incision will be about the same size as needle head.
--
Notice how the Organ researcher had a very similar lingo as Dr. Terskikh (wants to use hair transplant surgeons to perform the procedure, thinks in the future the implantation will need to be automatised - giving the idea that the procedure is very timing consuming). Looks like the creation and implantation of new hairs via stem cells will pretty much look like a hair transplant in the front end of things.
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to me it sounds complicated and very cumbersome.
But then again, stemson is setting out to have cells in a "bank" where they hope to cultivate generic ipsc into people. Like immune systems doesn't exist.
We will see if they can get over the immune system with "generic ipsc". Because that is the benefit with autologous cells, its your own and your own immune system should recognize those and stop fighting those new cells.
We will see how it goes with their first proof of concept in humans.
Right now i have a hard time seeing it working with the generic cells method, sure their clinical trails will be autologous, and then should give some positive results. But at that time Replicel should be far ahead.
Replicel is the only ones right now who have regenetive treatments going on in clinical trails.
How many others can say the same?
Stemson have 0 zero of concept in humans, they have grown hair on a mouse. You can rub a brick on a mouse and it will grow hair.
I'm all in for competition. But for now Stemson isn't even on the map yet, since they have no proof of concept in humans. We can discuss what ever from this day and the next 100 years. As long as Stemson have nothing done in humans. Then it is what it is - Just talk.
Yea creating new hairs from scratch with stem cells is much more complex than just trying to stimulate existing ones. It's borderline science fiction, but also has so much more potential.
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Yes Replicel has tested their treatment in humans but by the pictures they showed they are worse than minoxidil. I don't see how not beating a decades old drug that provides mediocre results itself translates to being far ahead in this race.
They said they "won't deploy to the clinic" before at least 3-4 years. It's still open to interpretation if they meant clinical trials or commercial launch.
Regarding the UK I don't know, I think they wouldn't consider the hassle of starting clinical trials in another country if a fast track wasn't in the cards.
But I agree they are not close at all to releasing anything for the public.
Regarding the UK I don't know, I think they wouldn't consider the hassle of starting clinical trials in another country if a fast track wasn't in the cards.
But I agree they are not close at all to releasing anything for the public.
Totally wild horse, they never even tested their stuff on animals and we know how low the bar of growing hair on mice is. They want to jump straight from the petri dish to humans, lol. Total hail mary strategy, I wish they get REALLY lucky and pull it with pure magic, but I'm not getting my hopes up.
The cold truth is that Stemson is right now in the same stage Organ was in 2016. Their excitement, confidence and lingo sounds very similar. And we know how that ended for Organ.
If you pay close attention to the YT interview of Dr. Terskikh, every time Dr. Wolf would make a hard question he would start making funny movements with his nose, like it suddenly got very itchy.
Good, at least they will avoid the problems J Hewitt is having in Japan trying to rent third party facilities.
The problem is that we don't know if this is the real excuse, it's just J Hewitt's version of the story. Also, if the technology were really that groundbreaking they wouldn't let something like this stall them for a whole freaking year.
Stemson looks much more robust.
For a start, hair cloning is not just a side project to them and they are not "licensing" it to some company in Japan like Tissuse did. If they really believed their own tech they would be the ones moving it forward. But no, they declared it "ready"(as if hair cloning was that simple), washed their hands and took it off from their website. lol. Huge red flag IMO.
Also, Stemson demonstrated it can grow hair with a iPSC derived DP like stem cell, and that is huge. They wouldn't have raised $7,5M if they weren't doing solid work there.