How Different Types Of Estrogen Promote (and Hinder) Hair Growth

[John Difool]

Estradiol 2-8mg sublingual or Estriol ~100mg topical

Eplerenone 200mg oral or spironolactone 200mg + 10mg G-15 topical

 

[John Difool]

Please confirm dosage on G-15. It's hard to find good info on this one.

 

[pegasus2]

Please confirm dosage on G-15. It's hard to find good info on this one.

I don't know. I haven't researched it. The price is going to be quite high. Just a quick guess, about 10mg.

Eplerenone's IC50 for aldosterone is half the dose of spironolactone. 50mg twice a day is the maximum effect on blood pressure, and should be sufficient. For our purposes it might be more effective up to 200mg twice a day. I'm going to work my way up to 100mg twice daily. The risk of hyperkalemia increases at that dose.
https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/pdf/10.1002/clc.20324

 

[coco_304]

Elperenon does not possess any antiandrogen

 

[coco_304]

That's the point. It's a MR (mineralocorticoid receptor) and GPER antagonist, but doesn't affect T. Finerenone is a newer, more potent MR antagonist.

How it help hairloss?

 

[coco_304]

Blocks aldosterone, downregulates TGF-b and p53, and reverses fibrosis.

spironolactone not doing that?

 

[Sanchez1234]

Blocks aldosterone, downregulates TGF-b and p53, and reverses fibrosis.

How will this affect gyno in your opinion?
Any studies on hairlos or how it compares to estriol estradiol?

 

[Sanchez1234]

I ordered Estriol today. Maybe a dumb question but if you apply 2ml of say 10mg per ml on a spot compared to 1ml of 20mg, is there a difference for results? Normally i apply say 2 or 3ml on the front part but since the solubility is limited of Estriol i want to apply 5 to 6ml on the front.

 

[Derelict]

A higher concentration has greater effect than a higher volume, but I think that's fine.

^The risk of gyno is less than 1% with eplerenone. Even if you already have gyno it probably won't make it worse. Estriol might though if you already have it.

Is it true estradiol sublingually has less chance of gyno than oral because it doesn't go through the liver?

 

[inmyhead]

By the way, do we have anyone who got results with estriol cream?

This dude claims that topical estrogen did nothing

 

[Sanchez1234]

By the way, do we have anyone who got results with estriol cream?

This dude claims that topical estrogen did nothing

Nope but those dosages are 1mg per ml. We need 20 times that and has never been tested. It quite cheap so i bought 10 grams.

 

[Sanchez1234]

A higher concentration has greater effect than a higher volume, but I think that's fine.

^The risk of gyno is less than 1% with eplerenone. Even if you already have gyno it probably won't make it worse. Estriol might though if you already have it.

You should make a thread about eplerone. Sounds real good so far.

 

[xaragedom]

By the way, do we have anyone who got results with estriol cream?

Estriol is too weak to produce any results Estradiol is stronger but dont give any effects except sides effects. These hormones are probably easily wipe out from our skins into bloodstream. Found that in mice https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/27658263/?from_term="topical+estradiol"+"wound"&from_pos=1 estradiol benzoate (alpicort E having it but in a baby's dose) is much better at increasing wound healing than estradiol, probably because it more likely stay in the skin. Maybe there is some estradiol ester which is way to go.

 

[GRme11]

Hello,reading this, we can conclude that 17a-estradiol(eg Alfatradiol) it's definitely harmful for hair,since 17a-estradiol binds more to ERα(even though with such lower affinity->Alfatradiol binds to the ERα and ERβ with 58% and 11% of the relative binding affinity of 17β-estradiol.However, it has 100-fold lower estrogenic activity relative to estradiol, which may in part be due to differences in the intrinsic activity of the two compounds)? Thanks you in advance.

***1) ER-alpha
ER-alpha is the type of estrogen receptor you DON'T want to stimulate.

With hair, ER-alpha stimulation promotes catagen. Catagen is the cessation of hair growth. ie. The end of anagen (growth phase). After catagen comes telogen (hair shed). Any estrogen which stimulates ER-alpha predominantly will therefore stall hair growth and lead to hair shedding. (ref)

ER-alpha stimulation also may lead to osteoarthritis and osteoporosis. (ref)

 

[GRme11]

Hello again. Does anyone know what is the binding affinity of Spironolactone to the ERα ERβ receptors, respectively? I didn't find something specific like this, that's why I am asking. Thank you very much for your time.

 

[Capone]

Hello again. Does anyone know what is the binding affinity of Spironolactone to the ERα ERβ receptors, respectively? I didn't find something specific like this, that's why I am asking. Thank you very much for your time.

I’m using a little Estradiol 17B not everyday on the temples but still seem to be losing hair. Any ideas? Use more?

 

[John Difool]

I’m using a little Estradiol 17B not everyday on the temples but still seem to be losing hair. Any ideas? Use more?

How much are you using and how frequently? Are you using any AA?

 

[Capone]

How much are you using and how frequently? Are you using any AA?

Like small pea sized amounts every 3rd day.. my muscles and skin seem to be better too. It there a chance it gets turned into DHT? Silly question lol. Also taking castor oil most mornings. No AA apart from Nizoral not consistently.

 

[John Difool]

If you are not blocking DHT sufficiently or unless you use high dose of f E (High dosed E was originally used as an AA to treat prostate cancer), small dose of E won't do much in terms of stopping hair loss. EstroGel (estradiol gel) contains 0.06 percent estradiol. One pump depression of EstroGel delivers 1.25 g of gel containing 0.75 mg estradiol. You are applying the minimum dosage of hrt for.a cis woman every 3 days. Knowing that cis women don't have to deal with T and DHT levels as men do I am not quite sure what you are trying to achieve here.

 

[GRme11]

If someone could make the things clear about Alfatradiol, I would appreciate it.

“We have not specifically tested competitive binding of the ERs following exposure to differing E2s; however, reports indicate that 17 α-E2 and 17 β-E2 possess different affinities for ERs. According to Edwards and McGuire (1980) [43], there are variations in 17 α-E2’s relative binding affinity to ERs that could range from as low as 1% of 17 β-E2 in rat uterus to values reaching 90% in mouse uterus. Other investigators have found diverse affinities, as well: Kuiper et al. (1997) [44] reported an affinity of 17 α-E2 to ERα of 58% of the relative affinity of 17 β-E2, and 11% to ERβ, while Torand-Allerand et al. (2005) [26] reported an affinity of 17 α-E2 binding to human recombinant ERα and ERβ of 51 and 64% compared to 17 β-E2, respectively. Kaur et al. (2015) [45] indicated an affinity of 17 α-E2 to ERα to be 40-times lower than 17 β-E2.”

I am trying to figure out if can make the things worse because of the binding affinity to the ERα(although above seems it has more affinity as well to ERβ).Because is very weak though, I don’t believe that is so potent.Any advice appreciated, thanks.