Prolactin "minitherapy" with SMI-1 (novel protocol for lowering prolactin locally)

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Ollie

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scientist_0005 said:
I see a lot of people participating in these group buys and after digging a bit into the science of it especially the paper published on the stump tailed monkeys that are a good animal model for androgenic alopecia i can understand the temptation at least some of it. however, prolactin and its effect on hair has been studied before has it not? there are no major publications that remotely indicate that it could have such potential. for every compaound ever trialed, i can understand the pathway and how exactly it might be involved in the pathology of AA. however, with this antibody, i get it the monkey have AA too but still... what is the theory behind this? how does it fit into the conventinally believed model of AA? I am sure someone has thrown in some idea in those 33 pages of thread but i can not read through that. I read quite some papers and some have found a suppression of anagen phase but only when prolactin in very high levels was used. which means that for a normal ranged guy, suppressing any signaling even further, how much is that going to profit them? no research on that at all.

I really hope, hopemed is going to trial this drug for AA. so far, they have only announced a trial for the other condition and i am afraid, it could go down like it did with companies of the likes of beloved cassiopea who took a literal decade to achieve a literal pile of nothing and they decided acne was their place to be and so totally neglected AA. I have a feeling this could be very similar with hopemed. what are the similarities? the vagina disease hopemed is trying to cure would also be covered by insurance, very convenient when you have an anti body that would probably cost thosuands of dollars in a prescription. for cassipea, this horse was acne. but we will see, hopefully very soon too
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dude the entire patent for HMI is aimed at androgen alopecia. The US is a nightmare covered in red tape - just because it doesn’t have approval there doesn’t mean it won’t be approved elsewhere. Not ideal but beggars can’t be choosers.
 
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scientist_0005

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Ollie said:
dude the entire patent for HMI is aimed at androgen alopecia. The US is a nightmare covered in red tape - just because it doesn’t have approval there doesn’t mean it won’t be approved elsewhere. Not ideal but beggars can’t be choosers.
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yes but i am still looking to find a single paper that clearly links androgenic alopecia to the actions of prolactin. there are some on hyperprolactinemia in women who have levels way outside the normal range.

there is this paper

Europe PMC

Europe PMC is an archive of life sciences journal literature.
europepmc.org europepmc.org

but i do not think it shows that prolactin is the driver of a pathological finding. sure, it may be implicated in inducing aptosis during the catagen phase but the Catagen phase is something that is a natural part of the hair cycle. there was some experiment where they treated hairs in vitro with prolactin and observed a reduced elongation of the hair shaft but the amount of prolactin they used was a multitude higher than what is normal for an average balding man. of course you would have to measure scalp prolactin and not serum prolactin as it is a auto/paracrine hormone and produced on site much like DHT. still, if this has had SUCH a tremendous effect in the non human primate model, it seems to me that this should have popped up in other research much more often?
 
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scientist_0005

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pegasus2 said:
There is no single paper finding that prolactin is THE cause of hair loss. There are lots of papers scattered throughout this thread and the Bayer thread that hint at its importance. If you don't want to read them, then please create your own thread to speculate on prolactin from a fresh start.
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I just feel like if something produces results of such enormous proportions like in the macaque studies, this should be a central part of the theory no? after all targeting the androgen path way would never yield such results and yet thats the main theory rn. also this would have wide implications of the inner workings of stem cell biology as a whole?
 
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scientist_0005 said:
I just feel like if something produces results of such enormous proportions like in the macaque studies, this should be a central part of the theory no? after all targeting the androgen path way would never yield such results and yet thats the main theory rn. also this would have wide implications of the inner workings of stem cell biology as a whole?
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Because it's a new finding and probably a lot of people aren't even aware of it yet.
 
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Ollie

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scientist_0005 said:
yes but i am still looking to find a single paper that clearly links androgenic alopecia to the actions of prolactin. there are some on hyperprolactinemia in women who have levels way outside the normal range.

there is this paper

Europe PMC

Europe PMC is an archive of life sciences journal literature.
europepmc.org europepmc.org

but i do not think it shows that prolactin is the driver of a pathological finding. sure, it may be implicated in inducing aptosis during the catagen phase but the Catagen phase is something that is a natural part of the hair cycle. there was some experiment where they treated hairs in vitro with prolactin and observed a reduced elongation of the hair shaft but the amount of prolactin they used was a multitude higher than what is normal for an average balding man. of course you would have to measure scalp prolactin and not serum prolactin as it is a auto/paracrine hormone and produced on site much like DHT. still, if this has had SUCH a tremendous effect in the non human primate model, it seems to me that this should have popped up in other research much more often?
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The problem is we don't understand the mechanism of action that prolactin has on hair follicles. I don't think there has been a single study of intrafollicular prolactin on hair growth, and we certainly don't know how much prolactin is required to interfere with the regrowth of hair.

It might be the case that the follicle is extremely sensitive to the presence of prolactin and even in minuscule doses prevents the recurrence of regrowth - which is why you need complete silencing of the PRLR from HMI for significant regrowth. All we can do currently is look at anecdotal evidence; Women during feeding following giving birth lose a lot of hair when prolactin levels are extremely high etc.

Rather than prolactin being responsible for miniaturisation process it might just be responsible for not allowing follicular regeneration.

Like with finasteride and minoxidil, both were discovered for hairloss by complete accident because of our lack of understanding of hair loss mechanisms and this is looking like a similar outcome.
 
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Dimitri001

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Are there any in vivo studies of SMI-6 (or any other molecule with same mechanism of action) for breast cancer or any other indication?
 
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fashy

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Somewhere in this thread Pegasus mentioned that he has written why HMI is better than RU even though both achieved similiar results in macaques but I cannot find any such posts in the back pages of this thread.

Can anyone explain the difference between the two?
 
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fashy

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I feel like this is almost impossible not to work on us at least as good as finasteride is working and probably better than that. The question then would be if there would be any unwanted side effects be it serious or mild. Samumed never had even an ounce of this drug's potential.
 
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Ollie

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fashy said:
I feel like this is almost impossible not to work on us at least as good as finasteride is working and probably better than that. The question then would be if there would be any unwanted side effects be it serious or mild. Samumed never had even an ounce of this drug's potential.
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Any side effects of this are an absolute benefit. Prolactin in men is absolutely trash. ED, low libido, gyno etc..
 
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Micky_007

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pegasus2 said:
HMI has made it clear that the main reason they wanted the drug rights from Bayer was for the indication of Androgenetic Alopecia. They also confirmed Androgenetic Alopecia ph2 trials enrolling this year in Australia. It won't take 6 months to enroll patients with Androgenetic Alopecia. There are millions of bald men for them to choose from. It's not like trying to find a cancer patient that is willing to take a risk
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Can you provide the link for where Hope Medicine "confirmed Androgenetic Alopecia phase 2 trials enrolling this year in Australia" because I can't find anything on the internet stating that
 
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Numerous_Bet_3027

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Micky_007 said:
Can you provide the link for where Hope Medicine "confirmed Androgenetic Alopecia phase 2 trials enrolling this year in Australia" because I can't find anything on the internet stating that
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This isn't available anymore, they have changed the article and removed the part that they will start this Summer. It was here:

和其瑞医药联合创始人肖瑞平：医药强国，吾辈使命 - 创新人才 - 南京生物医药谷

· 和其瑞医药有限公司联合创始人、董事长兼首席执行官；· 北京大学讲席教授，北大分子医学研究所所长；· 《新英格兰医学期刊》副主编
www.njbpv.cn

Now the only confirmation we have from them is that phase 2 will start for multiple indications:
"HMI-115, a prolactin receptor antibody, has passed animal experiments and phase I clinical human studies, and will enter phase II trials in multiple indications in 2021."
en.prnasia.com

Hope Medicine Inc. Announced Dr. Henri Nico Doods as President and Head of Research & Clinical Development - PR Newswire APAC

SHANGHAI, Dec. 14, 2020 /PRNewswire/ -- Hope Medicine Inc. Announced Dr. Henri Nico Doods as President and Head of Research & Clinical Development
en.prnasia.com en.prnasia.com
 
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Micky_007

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Numerous_Bet_3027 said:
This isn't available anymore, they have changed the article and removed the part that they will start this Summer. It was here:

和其瑞医药联合创始人肖瑞平：医药强国，吾辈使命 - 创新人才 - 南京生物医药谷

· 和其瑞医药有限公司联合创始人、董事长兼首席执行官；· 北京大学讲席教授，北大分子医学研究所所长；· 《新英格兰医学期刊》副主编
www.njbpv.cn

Now the only confirmation we have from them is that phase 2 will start for multiple indications:
"HMI-115, a prolactin receptor antibody, has passed animal experiments and phase I clinical human studies, and will enter phase II trials in multiple indications in 2021."
en.prnasia.com

Hope Medicine Inc. Announced Dr. Henri Nico Doods as President and Head of Research & Clinical Development - PR Newswire APAC

SHANGHAI, Dec. 14, 2020 /PRNewswire/ -- Hope Medicine Inc. Announced Dr. Henri Nico Doods as President and Head of Research & Clinical Development
en.prnasia.com en.prnasia.com
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Thanks. That's unfortunate for us. Have they even done a Phase 1 in humans for Androgenetic Alopecia, since they were talking about Phase 2?
 
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