READ READ READ.. Very Interesting POV

[Petchsky]

If you want to quit the experiment Empire say that, don't make up some song and dance about it :thumbdown2:

 

[Empire]

You want to hear something funny.

The treatment IS working wonders.. I'm still on it and it's making a significant difference. No itchy scalp, very very little hair fall, no regrowth just yet but I can start to fill tiny bumps where there wasn't hair.

Also when I put a hat on, my head doesn't itchy like crazy the way it used to.

And I kept recieving about 5 messages a day from people telling me to "stop bullshitting" and "stop fooling ppl" and so forth. This is when I thought f*** this I'm not reporting my results.

Well I just realised what bunch of assholes there are on this website, if even the Moderators are getting involved.

This is easy to solve, Moderators close my account, I'm not helping Jack sh*t

 

[Axl_Rose]

Dude just keep posting your results, yeah people are going to b**ch at you about it but you should of expected that when you started, I'm sure there's people here who are genuinely interested and are eager to see how your treatment goes.

 

[abovedagame]

everyone plz just shut the phuck up and let him update us on his progress for about 4-5 more months.

i am very interested in this treatment...not only for male pattern baldness but for my severe case of seb derm that will not go away. please continue to update us!.....
















or ill pee in my pants and it wont be pretty....

 

[Guest]

I have lost a lot of respect for Empire... what a waste.

 

[OverMachoGrande]

Empire Pm'd me requesting his account be closed. He is welcome back anytime he asks but for now his account has been deactivated per his request guys.

 

[oofah]

if the sebum is the cause of hairloss ...how can we explain that:
1)women never go bald..they have sebum !

To support the OP, Men produce more sebum than woman.

To support el_duterino, some men only lose hair in mid-old age but as one ages, their sebum production declines, not increases. If sebum is the cause of hair loss, why don't older men regrow their hair?

If sebum build-up caused hair loss in women, more women would be bald.

THIS question was answered today.

I was sitting down with a friend today having lunch. His skin looked oily, so I asked "Are you sweating?" He said "No, I've just got oily skin".

HOWEVER, he has no pimples. No acne?

For some reason.. bacteria isn't growing in the sebum build up in his skin. And this reminds me of many other people who have oily skin but no pimples or acne.

So Bacteria doesn't harbour ALL sebum build ups.. I'll try to find out why. This may answer why some people with oily skin don't have hair loss.. There is simply no bacteria growth in their hair follicles, hence no immune response, hence no inflammation, hence no reason for the immune system to prematurely boot the hair out.

For what it's worth, I had such oily skin in 8th grade, mostly my forehead, that people used to joke they could see their reflection. By my junior year I had started to recede. I'm 37 now with a highly receded hairline along with diffuse loss all over.

 

[lookhowshiny]

Sebum contributes to hairloss, okay, I can accept that. I don't, however, get why do we need to use one of the most dangerous drugs on the market to get rid of it? Some people claim homeopathy and certain diet reduce sebum..

Is there another method?

 

[bobonyc]

Anyone else want to lab-rat themselves ? You never know this stuff may have potential.

 

[gigz]

Look man, there are always people out there who will doubt you. The way to silence them is by putting up proof. Post baseline and recent pictures and let us judge.

 

[badasshairday III]

http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20090525/sc_nm/us_hair_loss

Looks like your GP was right. I've also noted in many medical physiology textbooks they list one of the physiologic roles of DHT as increasing sebum.

Mon May 25, 5:09 pm ET

HONG KONG (Reuters) – Researchers in Japan have identified a gene that appears to determine cyclical hair loss in mice and believe it may also be responsible for hair loss, or alopecia, in people.

In a report published in the Proceedings of the National Academy of Sciences, the scientists described how they generated a line of mice that were lacking in the Sox21 gene.

"The mice started to lose their fur from postnatal day 11, beginning at the head and progressing toward the tail region of the back," they wrote.

"Between day 20 and day 25, these mice eventually lost all of their body hair, including the whiskers. Intriguingly, new hair regrowth was initiated a few days later but was followed by renewed hair loss."

The cyclical alopecia continued for more than two years and the researchers observed that the mutant mice had enlarged oil-secreting sebaceous glands around the hair follicle and a thickened layer of skin cells during periods of hair loss.

"The gene is likely involved with the differentiation of stem cells that form the outer layer of the hair shaft," wrote the researchers, led by Yumiko Saga of the Division of Mammalian Development at the National Institute of Genetics in Mishima.

The scientists went on to examine human skin samples, where they found evidence of this same gene.

"We confirmed that Sox21 is also expressed in the hair shaft cuticle in humans ... These results indicate that the Sox21 gene could be responsible for some hair loss conditions in humans," the authors concluded.

 

[Guest]

I'm finding it hard to understand this. Is the study saying if you have large DHT build up on the scalp, you would produce more sebum than usual? Or is it saying sebum plays a larger part in hair loss than we first thought? Also, does excess sebum mean greasy hair?

 

[badasshairday III]

In the study they found a gene responsible for baldness in mice (which in genetics we know that there are usually homologous genes found in humans). The gene results in increased sebum, hence balding mice.

 

[opeth88]

Perhaps sebum is just a "by-product" of too much dht? Maybe it doesn't affect loosing hair. I remember reading a study posted by Bryan that stated sebum does not affect hair loss. I could be mistaken though. Hmm come to think about it, I don't *usually* see women with oily hair... it's usually men. (just an observation)

 

[decro435]

Any updates?

 

[Jojje]

doesnt nizoral remove sebum ? maybe thats wy it has some effect ... ?
Just wondering

 

[Petchsky]

I think this is an interesting theory, but don't expect updates as Empire aborted the experiment.

 

[spinner2]

Anybody trying this out for themselves?

 

[zack-b]

I think Empire is still doing the experiment, but not posting anything. I would really like to hear more about his results. Wish he was still posting.

 

[spinner2]

Ok, I'll bite. I'm going to try 5mg 2x per week, for 20 weeks.

One question I have about the ultra-low dose is whether it should be continued indefinitely. I've heard that with accutane the sebacious glands shrink over time, and never return to full size. I also know it can shrink pores, which perhaps explains some of the stories about hair follicles shrinking over time.

After 20 weeks I'm going to take a break, and wait for a bit to see how oily my skin gets. Maybe this is a treatment which could be stopped after some time.