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What made you flip on Sinclair, you used to speak well of him?
Why there will NEVER be a cure for baldness
- Thread starter Hairful
- Start date
Nothing. I'm not against him. I'm just saying he's not going to revolutionize medicine. I like him despite the shameless self-promotion, but the real work is being done elsewhere. David himself is not the one who's going to reverse aging. I do like that he's passionate about it, and that he is not afraid to speculate on what we can do now rather than waiting for decades of study. However, the real reprogramming stuff that will revolutionize things isn't coming from his lab.
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I don’t know how it works in other countries but in Canada all this sh*t (finasteride, dutasteride, minoxidil) used to cost like 10x more than it does.
Im super thankful to be on meds that used to cost $400 a month for $40 a month.
Cute would be great but thankful for how far my dollar can go now.
Im super thankful to be on meds that used to cost $400 a month for $40 a month.
Cute would be great but thankful for how far my dollar can go now.
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Average 12 Month Prices for Propecia (Brand) & Finasteride (Generic)
generic Proscar is around $12.81
generic finasteride costs from $20 to $60+ per month
And Proscar have x5 finasteride than Propecia
| Pharmacy | Propecia Retail Price | Finasteride Retail Price |
|---|---|---|
| Walmart | $122.73 | $47.30 |
| Walgreens | $140.42 | $82.40 |
| Kroger Pharmacy | $127.01 | $47.06 |
| Albertsons Pharmacy | $124.40 | $72.86 |
generic Proscar is around $12.81
generic finasteride costs from $20 to $60+ per month
And Proscar have x5 finasteride than Propecia
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According to the American Academy of Dermatology Association (AAD), about 50 million men and 30 million women were estimated to be affected by some form of alopecia in the U.S. in 2018.,..., and growing in most countries
yes but only few people are obsessed with balding, and these people are in this forum, including me
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I would consider cloning a real cure. Even if the new hair is non-dht resistant and you would need a refill after 20 years.
But semantics aside, the human body is just extremely complex and inducing permament positive changes without side effects is just not that easy.
If the industry would be all and only about profit, how is it possible that brand finasteride can be undercut in price by generic versions that cost 10% of the original? If Merck has the power to prevent development, why didn't it crush this development?
I am aware of Big Pharma, it's price gauging and the overall power of lobbies, but it is obviously not the whole story.
Who will pay for stemsons hair if they wont be dht resistant?
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Every field needs talkers and doers. The rejuvenation-field is getting more attention due to types like Sinclair. Others might be better at doing the actual work, but the attention he generates can be a positive.
We gotta be more specific, let's say:
- unlimited hair
- no sides, no increased risk of cancer
- not dht-resistant
- new follicles are identical to native follicles in term of color, curl, thickness etc.
- $50.000,-
I would say it is a pretty attractive offering.
Our problem is that we look at the picture in terms of human logic and assumptions. The market and business do not work this way, it has long been clear that when selling any product, the opinion of the buyer is not taken into account, but the animal instincts of a person are taken into account. There are 3 main ones - survival, reproduction and dominance (manifestation of the first two). Dominance is what makes us try to be better than others, it manifests itself in any area (even donating to your favorite blogger, this is his manifestation), it is this instinct that makes you panic because of the lack of hair, in the end you will not find a girl and she will not give birth to a bunch of children for you and you will not be able to give your parents grandchildren, be happy, etc. (actually this is nonsense, because women are arranged differently). The bottom line is that these instincts are being manipulated into sell this or that product. You coul say that a lot of companies failed, right, but that just means they had less talented marketers. If you think that you are very different from animals, then I will disappoint you ..The question is: Why do they take time and resources to find a cure when the products are selling so well? Finding a cure is not easy as well, they can fail and gain nothing.
Alopecia Market Size, Share & Growth Analysis Report, 2030
The global alopecia market was valued at USD 8.77 billion in 2023 and is expected to grow at a CAGR of 9.1% from 2024 to 2030www.grandviewresearch.com
"The global alopecia market size was valued at USD 7.6 billion in 2020 and is expected to expand at a compound annual growth rate (CAGR) of 8.1% from 2021 to 2028"
Bro, he is a guy who sold his bio company for big bucks, and then the buyer shut down the company after a few years. I believe may be 25% of what he says. Can you link me to a study of what he did?
In fact, those who invest money do not have a share of the same finasteride, these are completely new players in the market who see a future perspective, because. the future is fixated on beauty and fashion(and this is despite the fact that tolerance is being promoted everywhere and everywhere, the propaganda of which makes this problem even more destructive). The old generation can still say "bald? Yes, and God bless him", the new generation is more prone to depression and it is quite natural that the next one will suffer even more. We also do not take into account that baldness is becoming an increasingly common problem every year, including for women. This is a huge potential for those who want to earn.
We also do not see the inner workings between researchers and investors, we do not know who promises what to whom. I assume that those who create the "medicine" promise those who invest big profits and bright prospects. Since they both want to make money, in the end there is a fiasco. Creativity and money are antagonists. Some push others, set deadlines, demand something, others do not agree, do not have time, etc. There is a conflict of interest and often we see a break in relations between companies and the suspension of research.
There was also a question - "why not make a drug that will cure baldness completely, but will cost 50,000 euros?". Because it is not profitable, it greatly narrows the circle of people who can afford it. The market is not based only on people who live in favorable conditions, and even there, most people will not give that kind of money. It is much more promising if 300,000,000 people buy a product for $20 a month than 1,000,000 buy it and forget it. There is also a black market that will reduce the cost of this technology bypassing the patent and that will not bring profit to those who developed this product. In fact, there are too many nuances for those who want to make money.
And lastly, new technologies must be, otherwise we will get stagnation, which will be reflected in mass discontent. Today we already see the dissatisfaction of many who do not understand why 30 years have passed since the creation of finasteride and there is nothing new. In the end, the effect of a stretched bowstring will occur, which suddenly explodes.
I apologize if I'm not writing something correctly, I use a translator because English is not my native language.
Totally agree.
They will be dht-resistant. Somebody on the thread mentioned that it doesn't matter because it will be 20 years before you need it again. That's not true. You could end up needing it again in one year. Hamilton found that injecting young eunuchs with testosterone caused slow hair loss, but injecting older eunuchs with testosterone caused fast hair loss. It doesn't depend on cumulative damage from DHT, it depends on the following in order of importance.
1. genetic susceptibility
2. age (ability of cells to resist stress)
3. environmental factors that can trigger it, such as steroid use.
Bros, you get me wrong. I don't pain all the big pharma companies evil. On the contrary, I think they deserved respect because their product is helping million to billion people. Their research is wonderful, otherwise, we have nothing to talk about outside of anecdote cases. What I want to debate here is: Along the process to try to help people, greed comes in and the will to get to the core of problems diminishes. And that's perfectly normal to be greedy, I don't hate or blame them for that. It's not their responsibility to find a cure.
But I want to find/ have a cure, and I have very little hope that it comes from those companies. If more and more bald peoples realize that, they may take action on their own and we have more chances. I did experiments for years on myself, if one day I succeed, great. If I don't, I hope more people think this way and try to find the cure instead of relying on big companies.
If your experiments are natural compounds I'm afraid you're wasting your time. They've all been tried.
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We don't disagree about the nature of the industry. Yes, (potential) profits do drive them and if there would be a potential cure that would cost a lot to research but would yield virtually no revenue, not much companies will pursue it.
However, I don't see why you would think that a slightly better product than currently available would be preferable from a business perspective. It would have to compete with fina and minoxidil, who are well established and known by the market, and who are not that profitable by themselves. Generic propecia is dirt cheap, why would people pay big bucks for a product that is marginally better with no name recognition?
I get the idea of "hooking" customer to a product, so you get repeat sales etc, but for this market, I don't think it makes that much sense.
I don't experiment with natural compounds a long time ago.
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stuck in cell
The industry has basically nothing to lose by releasing better baldness treatments. There is no decent one right now.
Minoxidil treats hair loss like face makeup treats acne.
Finasteride treats hair loss like brushing your teeth treats cavities.
Hair transplants treat hair loss like dentures treat tooth decay.
THE EXISTING TREATMENTS ARE ALL PATHETIC!
This is how a normal person sees it. They aren't like us. They don't have cruelly-lowered expectations. They don't believe in "manageable" sexual side effects, or "manageable" face bloating & headaches.
And when normal people hear about a 'hair restoration' method, they imagine something that would f**king WORK. Norwood #7 into Elvis. Do-able for all ages.
Minoxidil treats hair loss like face makeup treats acne.
Finasteride treats hair loss like brushing your teeth treats cavities.
Hair transplants treat hair loss like dentures treat tooth decay.
THE EXISTING TREATMENTS ARE ALL PATHETIC!
This is how a normal person sees it. They aren't like us. They don't have cruelly-lowered expectations. They don't believe in "manageable" sexual side effects, or "manageable" face bloating & headaches.
And when normal people hear about a 'hair restoration' method, they imagine something that would f**king WORK. Norwood #7 into Elvis. Do-able for all ages.
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what about if someone is completely bald and want different type of hair than the original ? will be possible to choose hair colour, thickness and density?
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Nothing has a cure, not even a simple cold. Hair loss is no exception. Cancers, Aids, etc, no cure. Humans give themselves too much credit when it comes to cures. No, they are likely not hiding or preventing a hair loss cure. We literally just don’t know how to cure anything. Humans try, but the human body is very complex. We are just not that advanced yet.
When humans from the future look back centuries to see when the best hair loss treatments started, in the grand scheme of things, Rogaine’s and Propecia’s discovery years, to present year, will be cluttered into one era. Early 90s to 2022 is a mere 30ish years…which is nothing. Even if you fast forward to 2050, 2080, that’s not even a century yet.
It took us 100s of years to stop worshipping the Sun. And even then, what that turned into was just a more sophisticated version of what Natives did. Which is called religion, and we now worship an invisible “higher being” that rules over our lives and punishes us accordingly. Also, when we die, if we are good, we will join this being up in the sky.
Let that last paragraph sink in a bit. We are still quite primitive. You can’t possibly expect for a civilization like ours to cure something as complex as hair loss. I mean ffs man, we are intelligent but not THAT intelligent yet.
When humans from the future look back centuries to see when the best hair loss treatments started, in the grand scheme of things, Rogaine’s and Propecia’s discovery years, to present year, will be cluttered into one era. Early 90s to 2022 is a mere 30ish years…which is nothing. Even if you fast forward to 2050, 2080, that’s not even a century yet.
It took us 100s of years to stop worshipping the Sun. And even then, what that turned into was just a more sophisticated version of what Natives did. Which is called religion, and we now worship an invisible “higher being” that rules over our lives and punishes us accordingly. Also, when we die, if we are good, we will join this being up in the sky.
Let that last paragraph sink in a bit. We are still quite primitive. You can’t possibly expect for a civilization like ours to cure something as complex as hair loss. I mean ffs man, we are intelligent but not THAT intelligent yet.
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What I got from the Stemson presentation is that they are developing a custom product, for someones one hair I presume, and a more generic version. I could see that as, say, 10 versions for Indian hair, 10 versions for Chinese etc.
If that is indeed the idea and whether they are capable of delivering is something else, of course. But I think it would be possible to choose different hair.