21 Years Of Finasteride/ Dutasteride ( Since 1998, Duta Since 2002).

[Comb_over]

Well, seeing that he even put as acetaminophen , I really don't think it is serios list, basically, he mention almost any drug even fluoxetine ! that is a well know safe drug and there are theories that the high sexual side effects is because it lower DHT levels. And even cetirizine ! that is a big LOL : A preliminary study on topical cetirizine in the therapeutic management of androgenetic alopecia. :https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/28604133

Anyway even if we believe this list where is almost is telling you that water can cause hair loss, it will be telogen effluvium, not androgenetic alopecia.

But don't worry, trazodone will not cause you hair loss.

Do you regret to had taken propecia?

 

[davesmith420]

Thank you for this thread man; very interesting to hear about the experience of someone using anti-androgens for so long. I was considering switching to dutasteride if sh*t ever really hit the fan for me, but reading your story has made me reconsider. I think at the most I would add in dutasteride once or twice a week along with my current finasteride usage.

 

[jamesbooker1975]

Do you regret to had taken propecia?

Nice question. Really , really hard to tell. I just wished somebody told me in 1996, When I start the damn balding, that I can used minoxidil, alpha estradiol, spironolactone, etc. All that studies exist in 1996 . So, in resume Yes, I am regret. BUT I must admit cause then to finasteride/propecia I keep all my hair and I can hide the scars from the bad hair transplants.

 

[jamesbooker1975]

Thank you for this thread man; very interesting to hear about the experience of someone using anti-androgens for so long. I was considering switching to dutasteride if sh*t ever really hit the fan for me, but reading your story has made me reconsider. I think at the most I would add in dutasteride once or twice a week along with my current finasteride usage.

Thanks, that was the sense of posting my experience. Glad it helped at least one person .

 

[Johnmpb]

So did u start treatment in 1996 or 1998? If in 1996, how'd you hear about propecia since only proscar existed then? Very interested to know

I think alt.baldspot used to be a big newsgroup back then.

Besides finasteride, min, nizoral what else would u think is worth adding as I'm sure you've seen many many treatments come and go.

 

[Nick1990]

so bryan at hlh has passed away?

 

[sunchyme1]

Nice question. Really , really hard to tell. I just wished somebody told me in 1996, When I start the damn balding, that I can used minoxidil, alpha estradiol, spironolactone, etc. All that studies exist in 1996 . So, in resume Yes, I am regret. BUT I must admit cause then to finasteride/propecia I keep all my hair and I can hide the scars from the bad hair transplants.

you mean you wished you used minoxidil, alpha estraodiol and spironoacltone instead of propecia?

dont alpha estraodiol and spironolactone have more side effects than propecia?

 

[MaxPayne3]

you mean you wished you used minoxidil, alpha estraodiol and spironoacltone instead of propecia?

dont alpha estraodiol and spironolactone have more side effects than propecia?

Yes, estradiol and spironolactone cause body feminization, dutasteride not. And the funny thing is that topical application leads to more absorption by the body in comparison of oral introduction.

 

[sunchyme1]

Yes, estradiol and spironolactone cause body feminization, dutasteride not. And the funny thing is that topical application leads to more absorption by the body in comparison of oral introduction.

i must be mis reading his post then

he surely cant mean he wished he used these instead of propecia.

 

[MaxPayne3]

i must be mis reading his post then

he surely cant mean he wished he used these instead of propecia.

Maybe he means to use these substances in very low doses, I know men that apply estrogens on their scalp and do not have body feminization, but we are talking about 0,0x % concentration in the lotion.

 

[jamesbooker1975]

Yes, estradiol and spironolactone cause body feminization, dutasteride not. And the funny thing is that topical application leads to more absorption by the body in comparison of oral introduction.

You have no idea of what you are talking about.
1) Alfa estradiol is not betaestradiol and is is an extremly popular drug in Europe
2) Spironolactone it do not have systemic absortion if you use it topical.

Kinda funy and ironic, I talked what I talked cause
1) Read tons of papers
2) I used
3) I am a pharmacist

Could you take time to read instead of use Broscience ?

 

[jamesbooker1975]

you mean you wished you used minoxidil, alpha estraodiol and spironoacltone instead of propecia?

dont alpha estraodiol and spironolactone have more side effects than propecia?

No, since it have no systemic absorption ! Alpha estradiol is not Beta estradiol ! please google the BIG, BIG, difference.

 

[jamesbooker1975]

Maybe he means to use these substances in very low doses, I know men that apply estrogens on their scalp and do not have body feminization, but we are talking about 0,0x % concentration in the lotion.

Jesus stop the Broscience !!!!!!!!! Sear for Alpha estradiol Studies ! It a well know safe treatment since more than 30 years ago in Europe. Seach on the Germany forums! Even hairlosstalk, they new cream they sell contain spironolactone , alphaestradiol and Tempol !

I used Spironolactone ORAL first and within 2 month gave me REAL gynecomastia that only a surgical procedure solve it ! I used it topical for 7 years without any side effect ! PLEASE READ !!!!!! IT is not something new what I am talking about, there are dozen of papers on pubmed.gov

This post is anti-broscience , if you believe in Broscience it is a waste of your time to read it.

 

[jamesbooker1975]

so bryan at hlh has passed away?

Yes :
http://www.hairlosshelp.com/forums/messageview.cfm?catid=10&threadid=107757
https://www.acne.org/messageboard/t...-died-a-couple-months-ago-which-goes-to-show/

Was really, really sad. I was "away" from the forums for many years, Just knew he died last year, but he died on 2013

 

[MaxPayne3]

You have no idea of what you are talking about.
1) Alfa estradiol is not betaestradiol and is is an extremly popular drug in Europe
2) Spironolactone it do not have systemic absortion if you use it topical.

1) I've seen alfa estradiol in some lotions, but the dosage is very low aiming to avoid systemic absorption.
2) Okay, this is new to me, so I wonder why people keep applying minoxidil (that is only a grow stimulator, it does not reverse male pattern baldness) if they can go with topical spironolactone (that blocks androgen receptors and could be really helpful to reverse male pattern baldness).

 

[jamesbooker1975]

So did u start treatment in 1996 or 1998? If in 1996, how'd you hear about propecia since only proscar existed then? Very interested to know

I think alt.baldspot used to be a big newsgroup back then.

Besides finasteride, min, nizoral what else would u think is worth adding as I'm sure you've seen many many treatments come and go.

No, in 1996 I used Minoxidil 2 % two times per day for 6 or 8 month. It really worked, but I was 18th, so dumb, no internet , etc. So I thought that if did not bring me to a norwood 0 did not work.
Finasteride, first time I tried it Was in 1997, after I read it on a news paper, and was proscar 5mg pills. For 3 month, then I stooped cause fall into scams like aminexil and ETG treatment..

I will split things that I used, That are proven to work with many studies, but, since I don't use it alone, I do not know how good they are. On the other side, there are things that I tried, and there is not chance it will not give side effects and I strongly not recommend it.

Treatment topicals that I tried that have tons of papers behind, are safe and I recommend :

Ketoconazole as cream, lotion and shampoo. I recommend the first two ( check the Japanese paper )
17-Alpha estradiol ( aka : alfaestradiol )
Spironolactone
Tretinoin
Latanoprost ( but at very low dose, the Xalatan dose )

Oral :
Isotretinoin ( low dose , 10 mg per day. Keep in mind we now know it inhibit DHT and more androgens like androstendione ) , In my case, I give it a try in 1995 ( 3 months ) and it worked great for my hair, but that time, I was already receding. And no, Broscience stay away. Accutane do not cause hair loss as androgenetic alopecia, only at really high dose cause telogen effluvium. Ironically, this fucked my liver enzymes lot less than Dutasteride.

Topical that I used but I DO NOT RECOMMEND cause it goes systemic :
Flutamide

Oral drugs I used I extremly DO NOT RECOMMEND cause side effects and cause are not better then they topical versions
Minoxidil
Spironolactone

Topicals that I used but don't have enought papers behind them and I can't say if it works :
Tacrolimus
Azelaic acid ( For what I know, this don't have papers, only the 1998 one, that is in vitro with Zinc and Vit B 6 )

So far, I don't remember any other thing I have tried.

 

[sunchyme1]

i thought topical spironolactone was generally regarded on the forums to be useless

 

[jamesbooker1975]

1) I've seen alfa estradiol in some lotions, but the dosage is very low aiming to avoid systemic absorption.
2) Okay, this is new to me, so I wonder why people keep applying minoxidil (that is only a grow stimulator, it does not reverse male pattern baldness) if they can go with topical spironolactone (that blocks androgen receptors and could be really helpful to reverse male pattern baldness).

The thruth is that nobody know exactly how minoxidil works. They say that is a growth stimulation cause have no idea how it works, nothing more. Everythin is telling that, in fact, Minoxidil works in the cascade of hair loss started with DHT more closer ( read the CTHR2 receptor and prostaglandines theories ) . Minoxidil is underrated .

Also, don't forget that the only two FDA approve drugs ( the only that actually went for the clinical trial and submition to the FDA ) are Rogaine and Propecia, so doctor prescribed that. Plus ROGAINE is OTC since more than 3 decades .

Check the phase 2 of BREEZULA, the "reverse " male pattern baldness process was almost as effective as the minoxidil 5 % ( they compare to it ) .
Telling that Minoxidil do not attack the cause of hair loss, for the knowledge we have basement on papers, it is not right.

 

[MaxPayne3]

Okay, but if I was you, with all these things you took over the years, I won't blame only dutasteride if you fucked up your system.

 

[pollutionbrain]

Im also gonna go the topical route. Bought s5 cream plus, reviviogen and i have propecia pills. Im gonna mix everything together and use it topically. If thats not enough Im gonna mix in cb too. As long as it has effect locally and the systematic absorption isn´t too great it should be good.