Exploring The Hormonal Route. Hair=life.

[bridgeburn]

Honestly, that's why I want to start taking Spironolactone (+ Estradiol if it's necessary) as soon as possible. I've noticed that it's better to not leave it too late, or I will be sorry

yes, learn from my mistakes..

I went through the denial phase, where I thought I might just have Telogen Effluvium and it will grow back. But, that is not the case especially with hairlines.

I now know this; there's no such thing as a "mature hairline"

 

[Ikarus]

yes, learn from my mistakes..

I now know this; there's no such thing as a "mature hairline"

Honestly, I do think a mature hairline is viable in certain people (my dad has kept his mature hairline for decades, and it hasn't moved back). But for a majority, it's just premature balding which is preparing itself to strike you at your most vulnerable state...

Even with people who take Finasteride / Dutasteride, eventually it's going to stop working and they're not going to have many options left; if they really want to keep their hair, I guess it's time for them to risk their masculinity or they pose the risk of going bald! Most people are really willing to risk going bald just to keep their 'masculinity' which probably just shoots into a tissue and goes straight into a bin... Can't relate!

 

[bridgeburn]

literally, I would have diva meltdowns where I would scream at everyone and start crying in my bed for hours).

If your hair comes back, you'll be crying tears of joy...
by the way, estrogen makes me cry wayy more.. I rarely cried, maybe twice a year. now its a million times a year

And honestly, I think testosterone could be causing issues for me. I do think it contributes to my severe mood swigs, and aggression.

I felt relieved when I got rid of it.. but because that was what had been my normal state for so long, I hadn't recognize that T was causing me issues.

I do think it causes my acne / oily skin too. I was on Accutane, which I had to stop after 1.5 months as my liver enzymes went too high

I think almost all acne problems could be solved with anti adrogens.. as a teen and early 20s I had goddamn acne problems. Even at 25 and 26 years old, although it wasn't as much as during teens, I would still sometimes get acne!!! after chemical castration, I Never get acne..

why all this accutane, tretinion, salytic acid, etc. etc. etc.. when people could just destroy androgens!

 

[bridgeburn]

And, it's even worse when people in my family point it out every single day as if I don't notice it.

Omg yes! I hated that. like wtf, it totally ruins my moood. I can't choose to make myself like hairloss, andwhen someone mentions what i don't like then it forces me to think about it!!! no idea how it ever became normal and socially acceptable to point it out. that is one of the rudest thing ever to sayy.. its a goddamn disease, a medical condition! how heartless does one have to be to make fun of a medical problem!

If i go to family reunion and theres a member who has gained some weight no one will say sh*t. but if a dude has lost hair since the last time There wil always be Someone to point it out!!!!

Or when my mom states that she has more hair than me and she's almost 60.

My f*****g goddamned god, stuff like this always blows my mind anyone has the nerve to say that. i can't believe it, I don't want to believe it

 

[Marky]

Omg yes! I hated that. like wtf, it totally ruins my moood. I can't choose to make myself like hairloss, andwhen someone mentions what i don't like then it forces me to think about it!!! no idea how it ever became normal and socially acceptable to point it out. that is one of the rudest thing ever to sayy.. its a goddamn disease, a medical condition! how heartless does one have to be to make fun of a medical problem!

If i go to family reunion and theres a member who has gained some weight no one will say sh*t. but if a dude has lost hair since the last time There wil always be Someone to point it out!!!!


My f*****g goddamned god, stuff like this always blows my mind anyone has the nerve to say that. i can't believe it, I don't want to believe it

Not surprising, few can relate to it or understand the underlying issues. Plus if you are a card carrying member of the human race you likely lack a license for compassion.

When my dad's friend and wife came over recently they mentioned dad's thinning head a couple times in one sitting! While the friend has a nice head of white hair for a 66 year old.
Just light hearted humor or perhaps subtle jabs. Nevertheless, just another incident pointing out the mysteriousness of protein fibers growing from our scalp.

Dad brushed it off like it was nothing, then 2 months later he's asking me if dying hair would thicken it, sheesh it even matters at 68.

 

[Jonny Craig]

Anyone using bi-estrocare cream? 1 pump = 1mg estriol, 0.25mg estradiol. OTC so very easy to get. I use 2 pumps per day.

Not sure if I'm seeing any progress, 2 weeks in. Very early yet. Not sure if I should up the dosage as well, or stay where I'm at.

I would at least hope, I cannot do any harm, in using it...

EDIT: Today, seems my right side hairline is doing a bit worse, possibly. SHOULD I INCREASE DOSAGE? 4 pumps per day? that's 4mg estriol 1mg estradiol a day. Currently at 2mg estriol 0.50mg estradiol per day. Or give it more time at current dosage?

 

[Ikarus]

If your hair comes back, you'll be crying tears of joy...
by the way, estrogen makes me cry wayy more.. I rarely cried, maybe twice a year. now its a million times a year

I felt relieved when I got rid of it.. but because that was what had been my normal state for so long, I hadn't recognize that T was causing me issues.

I think almost all acne problems could be solved with anti adrogens.. as a teen and early 20s I had goddamn acne problems. Even at 25 and 26 years old, although it wasn't as much as during teens, I would still sometimes get acne!!! after chemical castration, I Never get acne..

why all this accutane, tretinion, salytic acid, etc. etc. etc.. when people could just destroy androgens!

Honestly, the depression I get because of my hair is insane! I almost get into a manic state of mind, all because of my hair. I am so used to having such beautiful hair especially as a kid; my hair was thick enough for two people and had such a silky shine. And I always got complimented on it, but now I just overhear people saying that I have less hair than their dad (I overheard someone say that once, and it was awfully rude).

I started getting acne at 14, and it slowly just got worse as I progressed into puberty. It became cystic at one point, which was not good. Before I started having laser hair removal on my beard area, I would shave and those pimples would slit in half and bleed - along with that, I would get such bad razor bumps which made my skin look even worse.

 

[Ikarus]

Omg yes! I hated that. like wtf, it totally ruins my moood. I can't choose to make myself like hairloss, andwhen someone mentions what i don't like then it forces me to think about it!!! no idea how it ever became normal and socially acceptable to point it out. that is one of the rudest thing ever to sayy.. its a goddamn disease, a medical condition! how heartless does one have to be to make fun of a medical problem!

If i go to family reunion and theres a member who has gained some weight no one will say sh*t. but if a dude has lost hair since the last time There wil always be Someone to point it out!!!!


My f*****g goddamned god, stuff like this always blows my mind anyone has the nerve to say that. i can't believe it, I don't want to believe it

When people mention my hair loss, I honestly feel like slapping them across their face... It's worse when I finally get my mind of my hair and then some stupid b**ch has to go and mention how thin my hair looks, and suddenly I teleport to a mirror and fall into an obsession. People don't know how mentally dismantling hair loss is until they finally experience it.

I went to my GP today, and I asked about Spironolactone for my hair loss and acne. He said he's not familiar with it being used for hair loss so he has to ask other people to come to a final verdict. At first, he pointed out the notes which said I should use minoxidil and I just responded with 'no, minoxidil poses the risk of acne and unwanted facial hair growth and I have spent over $1000 removing my facial hair through laser' so he said 'okay'. I have another appointment with the doctor next week and he will tell me the verdict, if he says 'no' I'm going to say 'there's another option I had in mind which could stop hair loss permanently, and that's castration. So, I will castrate my self at home' or I will say I will commit suicide if the first emotional blackmail doesn't work.

Are there other anti-androgens which are good? Just incase...

 

[Obsessive]

Anyone using bi-estrocare cream? 1 pump = 1mg estriol, 0.25mg estradiol. OTC so very easy to get. I use 2 pumps per day.

Not sure if I'm seeing any progress, 2 weeks in. Very early yet. Not sure if I should up the dosage as well, or stay where I'm at.

I would at least hope, I cannot do any harm, in using it...

EDIT: Today, seems my right side hairline is doing a bit worse, possibly. SHOULD I INCREASE DOSAGE? 4 pumps per day? that's 4mg estriol 1mg estradiol a day. Currently at 2mg estriol 0.50mg estradiol per day. Or give it more time at current dosage?

I'm using Estrogel, at around 0.5 to 0.75 mg beta-estradiol, per day. Over three months in now...still not sure if it's helping, hurting, or doing nothing. I have noticed that my temples are losing ground, and that is one place where I apply the gel. Again, not sure if estrogel is causing that or not. I had my hormonal profile checked last week. E levels were in the normal male range before I started this regimen:
Now: total estrogen is 340 (60-190) and b-estradiol is 61 (<39). According to a Google search, these figures are high for a woman but not out of the range. Unfortunately I don't know what a good target blood level is for hair purposes.

 

[Jonny Craig]

I'm using Estrogel, at around 0.5 to 0.75 mg beta-estradiol, per day. Over three months in now...still not sure if it's helping, hurting, or doing nothing. I have noticed that my temples are losing ground, and that is one place where I apply the gel. Again, not sure if estrogel is causing that or not. I had my hormonal profile checked last week. E levels were in the normal male range before I started this regimen:
Now: total estrogen is 340 (60-190) and b-estradiol is 61 (<39). According to a Google search, these figures are high for a woman but not out of the range. Unfortunately I don't know what a good target blood level is for hair purposes.

God damn, what the f***...

Sigh.

Debating if I should just get back on Progesterone..

 

[Obsessive]

God damn, what the f***...

Sigh.

Debating if I should just get back on Progesterone..

Haha. Yea, I know what you mean. I thought hitting the E would be a guaranteed success. I figured since nothing great was happening hair-wise that maybe the transdermal E wasn't getting through my skin...blood test confirms it most definitely is. BTW, this has brought my free T down from 95 to 50. Also, sex drive was unaffected for a few months but I'm starting to notice that it might be taking a hit. I know this is a game of give and take but when it's time to perform this really sucks.

 

[Jonny Craig]

Haha. Yea, I know what you mean. I thought hitting the E would be a guaranteed success. I figured since nothing great was happening hair-wise that maybe the transdermal E wasn't getting through my skin...blood test confirms it most definitely is. BTW, this has brought my free T down from 95 to 50. Also, sex drive was unaffected for a few months but I'm starting to notice that it might be taking a hit. I know this is a game of give and take but when it's time to perform this really sucks.

Right. Success or at least, stay at baseline.

I'm sure it's going systemic for me too, but I don't mind, sides are fine for now, even if they weren't, if it worked then OK..

Damn. I mean, based on theory, it makes so much sense, for topical estrogen to work, I don't get it.

If this doesn't work I'll be going back on Progesterone, topically on hairline instead of the oral I used to do. There's a guy on this forum who I know uses Prog and says it doesn't grow new hair for him but maintains for sure.

Thanks for posting, I really appreciate it. You've given me something to think about here. I would have thought it was just in my head otherwise and that this HAS to work, but guess not.

 

[bridgeburn]

Now: total estrogen is 340 (60-190) and b-estradiol is 61 (<39).

ideally, you want more to the estradiol side as possible. estrone is not good.

 

[bridgeburn]

I have lost around 50% of my hair all over due to a severe eating disorder. I have no idea if it will grow back to its full thickness, or I will just follow the road of it being permanent. I have noticed regrowth after I have combated the eating disorder (around 10% of regrowth after three months) but I don't know if it will stop there due to my family history. So it's better for me to be safe than sorry I guess...

get enough zinc, iron, vitamin d, and biotin. they are known to cause hairloss in extreme deficiency. still 95% of hairloss is from androgens.

 

[Sonolmn98]

This might break it down easier, note that anyone who is chemically castrated before 21 yo, might notice changes in bone structure such as increased in height, hips growth and limbs extensions, it is happening to me and it is kinda cool, ignore the man Pic on this Pic, because being a man for us means a bald head and a hairy body but this what chemical castration can do the body in the long-run (5+ years), welcome to the second puberty, @Ikarus, you are starting young like me, and this regimen can bring up more changes, so you have to be okay with the changes so you won't regret it

 

[Obsessive]

ideally, you want more to the estradiol side as possible. estrone is not good.

@bridgeburn - I agree. It seems that my body is keen on oxidizing my estradiol, which is a bummer. At this point, should I drop the estrogel?

 

[Obsessive]

Right. Success or at least, stay at baseline.

I'm sure it's going systemic for me too, but I don't mind, sides are fine for now, even if they weren't, if it worked then OK..

Damn. I mean, based on theory, it makes so much sense, for topical estrogen to work, I don't get it.

If this doesn't work I'll be going back on Progesterone, topically on hairline instead of the oral I used to do. There's a guy on this forum who I know uses Prog and says it doesn't grow new hair for him but maintains for sure.

Thanks for posting, I really appreciate it. You've given me something to think about here. I would have thought it was just in my head otherwise and that this HAS to work, but guess not.

I hate making negative posts because I know how soul crushing bad news posts are when I read them. Still, everyone's biochemistry is different so perhaps you'll get the effects you want. I try to give everything three months before making a decision.

 

[bridgeburn]

I think this will work for 99% of guys
200mg of spironolactone + 5mg finestride+4mg of estradiol

If you are still losing hair in that protocol then you are delusional

I find it hard to believe anyone who says they continue losing hair with this.. how is it possible to lose hair without androgens, the name of the conditions is literally ANDRO- genetic alopecia. I can understand no regrowth but maintainence is possible but actually losing hair?? ifthat is the case then perhaps they have another type of hairloss andnot just Androgenetic Alopecia?? but probably just delusional as f***

 

[Jonny Craig]

I hate making negative posts because I know how soul crushing bad news posts are when I read them. Still, everyone's biochemistry is different so perhaps you'll get the effects you want. I try to give everything three months before making a decision.

No worries, it is what it is.

I am using these products on a FUT hairline, so I don't have time to waste.. especially if something is potentially harmful to hairline.

I will wait to see what bridge has to say..

 

[Obsessive]

No worries, it is what it is.

I am using these products on a FUT hairline, so I don't have time to waste.. especially if something is potentially harmful to hairline.

I will wait to see what bridge has to say..

Yes, good idea. Apparently my body is converting a lot of my estradiol into estrone, which could be less than helpful. I may drop the estradiol and move on to spironolactone very soon. This game requires so much damn trial and error...uggh.