Exploring The Hormonal Route. Hair=life.

[HelpMyHair!!]

The whole fuckin thing really doesn't make sense when you really think about it.

I am truly starting to believe everybody has a "sweet spot", due to a plethora of factors (number of AR in the follicles, aromatose, etc etc).

DHT GROWS hair on a male body. DHT is an anti-inflamatory everywhere else, why does it destroy male pattern baldness follicles, in certain males.

It makes 0 sense. I think if anything, the reason Finasteride/Dutasteride works or shows a slight improvement in some is because of the Estrogen increase, NOT the DHT suppression.

I know, I know, everybody likes to hang their hat on the study on 5ar deficient males never going bald as the end all/be all. Maybe those 5ar deficient males never go bald because testosterone at the follicle HAS to be converted to Estrogen by default, rather than DHT.

Maybe as we age, and our testosterone levels begin to drop slowly, the body is forced to convert more of the dwindling T to DHT to "make up" for the lack of T, by converting it to the more powerful by-product? Maybe the body selectively chooses areas it deems as "not critical" for the increased T/DHT conversion to get by?

This is all bro-science of course, but there HAS to be an answer somewhere in the middle.

 

[Rysteve93]

Wait. What's the before and what's the after!? What do you actually use in which doses?

Well if the short hair is 14 months ago that will be the before mate. The long hair is now, no temple lose anymore.. no hair lose anymore, hair line still need improvement.

 

[Pls_NW-1]

Well if the short hair is 14 months ago that will be the before mate. The long hair is now, no temple lose anymore.. no hair lose anymore, hair line still need improvement.

Yeah, sry bud, couldn't identify cuz your temples looked different to each other in the after pics. Thanks!

I see on your regimen you use plenty of stuff, what do you use now and in which doses?

 

[HelpMyHair!!]

To follow up on my previous post a bit, here's a question:

Has anybody tried to somehow increase aromatose, or supplement Estrogen ONLY without a 5ar blocker or AA to see what happens?

 

[HelpMyHair!!]

Genetic factor. Hamilton's research says that the ones that did get pattern baldness from the testosterone supplement had family history.

dHT factor. Dht in high concentrations inhibits wnt. In medium concentrations maintains wnt.

Pattern factor. A single high glucose meal inhibits endothelial vascular function, and Enos, constricting both ways. Long term NO inhibition builds vascular smooth muscle, making vasodilation even less likely. AR upregulation disrupts glucose homeostasis, reinforcing vasoconstriction where dHT is accumulating. (Both from inflammation and disfunctional circulation). The pressure of scalp plus this vasoconstriction plus genetics starts to build a cycle.

(Can't be bothered detailing more sorry).

Working on recovering from it now, it's a challenge as to what is recoverable, and whether androgens are a problem if constant NO vasodilation is achieved.

I actually found abiraterone to be counter productive, and the common side effect of hypertension would support that.

This is EXACTLY the type of thinking I'm talking about. Would love to hear more when you are able!

 

[Almas]

It makes 0 sense. I think if anything, the reason Finasteride/Dutasteride works or shows a slight improvement in some is because of the Estrogen increase, NOT the DHT suppression.

With castration, both T and E drop in you.And at the same time, you get a good result, thickening of the hair and an increase in density

https://www.hairlosstalk.com/interact/threads/i-castrated-myself-to-halt-baldness.119212/

To get moderate regrowth, it is enough not to increase estrogen, but to get rid of T and DHT, and this allows a combination of Bicalutamide and Finasteride. If the results obtained are not enough for you, you can add Estrogen, it will additionally stimulate the follicles

 

[Rysteve93]

Yeah, sry bud, couldn't identify cuz your temples looked different to each other in the after pics. Thanks!

I see on your regimen you use plenty of stuff, what do you use now and in which doses?

these results came from oral minoxidil and dust. I used 0.5 avodart(2/3yrs)and 10-40mg loniten for roughly 12 months.

I have only added in bic and E (2 months) for hairline.

 

[Rysteve93]

Did you get any edema on that dosages of min?

Nah, when I tapered to 30-40mg I had nose bleeds, sore heads, fast heart rate.
I did use small doses of spirno for water retention but it made me feel tired so dropped it.

 

[Norwoody]

Great results! Oral minoxidil is underrated. It seems like those high doses really helped you regain density.

 

[Rysteve93]

Great results! Oral minoxidil is underrated. It seems like those high doses really helped you regain density.

Yeah I agree it’s underrated mate, very powerful drug

 

[Rysteve93]

short hair was 14month ago. Dht was decimating my temples they have fully recovered I’m now recovering hairline(it’s slow)

(Short, shaved before long after) Just a density comparison before I couldn’t even grow long hair because of how thin and see through the temples were. Plus the wind would make the fluff that was left stand up and it looked awful.

 

[Reciprocity]

Are you seeing any adverse effects in terms of skin quality?

 

[2TameDHT]

My reservations about monotherapy come from the fact that on trans forums, monotherapy with E2 pills is commonly seen as less effective. They usually suggest going with E2 injections instead of pills if one wants it to be more effective.

 

[JaneyElizabeth]

My reservations about monotherapy come from the fact that on trans forums, monotherapy with E2 pills is commonly seen as less effective. They usually suggest going with E2 injections instead of pills if one wants it to be more effective.

I don't think that is correct but be that as it may, there are no studies indicating any form of estrogen ingestion to be more effective than others in terms of "results". Some people perceive psychological benefits at higher e2 levels but I am not sure that has been tested either. Some claim that CEE's might be more feminizing or better for breast growth but we have no studies there either.

One thing about people who inject is that they tend to understand the HRT process in general, much better and are alert to risks. Yes, there are better methods of ingestion than taking estrogen orally in terms of not being harsh to the liver. But patches work similarly to injections. Monotherapy works great for many people but what can happen is that a person cannot get their levels up high enough to reach adult female targets. So then adding spironolactone/cpa/bica can in essence trick the body into thinking estrogen levels are higher. But this is a method for people who want/need to hit targets quickly/sooner. I assume you are not trying to feminize so that is absent. MtF's also wish if possible to maximize breast growth so most protocols stated as being "better" are better in terms of breast growth allegedly.

 

[mj9]

(Short, shaved before long after) Just a density comparison before I couldn’t even grow long hair because of how thin and see through the temples were. Plus the wind would make the fluff that was left stand up and it looked awful.

Great results - congrats! Did you grow a lot of body hair due to minoxidil? I'm on oral minoxidil and noticed a lot of new hair all over my body and face.

 

[JaneyElizabeth]

Great results - congrats! Did you grow a lot of body hair due to minoxidil? I'm on oral minoxidil and noticed a lot of new hair all over my body and face.

I like your protocol in terms of milking effects from minoxidil.

 

[Rysteve93]

Great results - congrats! Did you grow a lot of body hair due to minoxidil? I'm on oral minoxidil and noticed a lot of new hair all over my body and face.

Yes mate, arms,hands,eyebrows,eye lashes ect. I feel 20mg although a high dose is where most of results were made. (Not saying anyone should take that much just me personally I felt ok at those dosages)

 

[Rysteve93]

Are you seeing any adverse effects in terms of skin quality?

Yes actually, using collagen supplements helped this.

 

[Norwoody]

Yes actually, using collagen supplements helped this.

Any supp in particular?

 

[Rysteve93]

I just used an iherb collage peptides one, and a collagen moisturiser lol.

can any one tell me the Pros and Cons of using 12mg cyproterone acetate along with 50mg bic, I’ve read they can’t be used together maybe the fight for the receptor? Liver toxicity.