Follica - Other New Patent 2017 - Methods For Treating Baldness And Promoting Hair Growth

[Balding curse]

Was this study posted before?
Microneedling and PRP.

I want to get this done right now, this is f*****g amazing result and the good thing no is finasteride included.

 

[brohawk]

No that's not what I said at all, the claims and embodiment's are two different things. The only thing they can patent is the methods specified in the patent which is basically perturbation and minoxidil. However they can claim whatever they like and still get a patent, the patent office does not require you prove any of your claims.

Correct, the patent office doesn't require you to prove your claims. It also doesn't require you to use all embodiments mentioned in your patent. In addition to minoxidil, they mention many other substances such as pge1, pge2, pgf2a, am211, seti, etc. yet you again say it's "basically perturbation and minoxidil". Of course one should be skeptical of a patent's claims, but they also shouldn't latch on to only 1 of umpteen other embodiments as the final product, especially w/ a company as secretive as Follica. Get my point?

 

[Tano1]

Correct, the patent office doesn't require you to prove your claims. It also doesn't require you to use all embodiments mentioned in your patent. In addition to minoxidil, they mention many other substances such as pge1, pge2, pgf2a, am211, seti, etc. yet you again say it's "basically perturbation and minoxidil". Of course one should be skeptical of a patent's claims, but they also shouldn't latch on to only 1 of umpteen other embodiments as the final product, especially w/ a company as secretive as Follica. Get my point?

Yea so in other words everything they say could be bullshit and we are back at square 1.

In that case I may as well just purchase my own dermaroller, 1mm perhaps and roll my entire head twice a week while applying minoxidil to it. That would basically sum up Follica right?

I don't understand why they wouldn't implement most of their embodiments if the device is supposed to be adjustable. Surely it's adjustable for a reason?

 

[mr_robot]

Correct, the patent office doesn't require you to prove your claims. It also doesn't require you to use all embodiments mentioned in your patent. In addition to minoxidil, they mention many other substances such as pge1, pge2, pgf2a, am211, seti, etc. yet you again say it's "basically perturbation and minoxidil". Of course one should be skeptical of a patent's claims, but they also shouldn't latch on to only 1 of umpteen other embodiments as the final product, especially w/ a company as secretive as Follica. Get my point?

Yeah, but three things. Firstly minoxidil is given more prominence than other compounds, secondly the patent itself says it is basically wounding plus a growth promoter and is also mentioned in puretech's own Doctor and as of now minoxidil is the best growth promoter out there that is not patented. Finally the patents mention compounds that are owned by other companies which don't even have efficacy data available, the mention of these compounds is just to basically broaden out the patent in case in the future they work out.

Unless they have some super secret growth promoter that they have kept secret and done no clinical trials on then it is reasonable to conclude that it is basically wounding and minoxidil. Any other conclusion is basically wishful thinking.

 

[mr_robot]

Yea so in other words everything they say could be bullshit and we are back at square 1.

In that case I may as well just purchase my own dermaroller, 1mm perhaps and roll my entire head twice a week while applying minoxidil to it. That would basically sum up Follica right?

I don't understand why they wouldn't implement most of their embodiments if the device is supposed to be adjustable. Surely it's adjustable for a reason?

Consider that the Indian study is quoted by Follica as proof of concept and that they hired the author as an adviser. However if you look at the results of the Indian study, sure there is regrowth where there was non with just minoxidil but it's not enough to give you a full head of hair or restore your hairline. Even by Follica's own admission it is 25 terminal hairs per cm2. People are projecting their hopes onto this product, like they did with the Brotzu lotion.

 

[Tano1]

Consider that the Indian study is quoted by Follica as proof of concept and that they hired the author as an adviser. However if you look at the results of the Indian study, sure there is regrowth where there was non with just minoxidil but it's not enough to give you a full head of hair or restore your hairline. Even by Follica's own admission it is 25 terminal hairs per cm2. People are projecting their hopes onto this product, like they did with the Brotzu lotion.

I do believe in wounding for regeneration, but I would be disappointed if all they came up with after all these years is simply combining microneedling with minoxidil.

That's something I could've came up with after reflecting on life in the shower.

Really am hoping there is more to them. And isn't 25 terminal per cm2 from testing for efficacy? I thought they had yet to release their phase 2 results. Being secretive can be either good or bad.

 

[tomJ]

The Indian prp and micro needling study is basically prp and micro needling directly after, ever three weeks. Correct?

 

[That Guy]

Consider that the Indian study is quoted by Follica as proof of concept and that they hired the author as an adviser. However if you look at the results of the Indian study, sure there is regrowth where there was non with just minoxidil but it's not enough to give you a full head of hair or restore your hairline. Even by Follica's own admission it is 25 terminal hairs per cm2. People are projecting their hopes onto this product, like they did with the Brotzu lotion.

I'm not sure what world you're living in where it's not possible for this to grow enough hair across the top of the head or restore a hairline. Also, can anyone actually source this supposed claim from Follica because I've seen people say it online, but never have I found any official documentation.

and again, the process can be done as many times as need be. It's not like you just go over a scalp once and then you're like "Well, f*** it. Whatever we got the first time is what we get." Theoretically, the amount of hair you should be able to regrow should only be limited to how much skin there is.

You're telling me that patient one here:

or one of our own users going from this

To this

Via repeated dermarolling and the big 3 over the span of 5 years since he began rolling is an insufficient amount of hair?

Get your eyes checked, please. There is not a sane person alive who would not take these kinds of results from a therapy that could guarantee it.

People need to stop rooting for the different upcoming technologies like they're god damn sports teams; it doesn't matter who wins it matters that someone does.

Wounding is a proven method, it's just that the underlying mechanisms are poorly understood by most who try it. Follica has been researching this stuff for a long time and most of that research is no doubt how to get the most amount of hair to grow from a single session.

Those of us who actually want to end this nightmare, will wind up using this. Yep, it could be that one pass of the treatment might leave a NW7 with a bit of a diffuse NW2, but if you wouldn't take that as a "baldite", then it's obvious that baldness is just a crutch you don't want to lose.

 

[sunchyme1]

from all the tests/studies done so far, how much better were the results for the guys who were using finasteride compared to the ones who werent?

also, this treatment wont be out for a year or two, so is it worth buying a needle yourself now and trying it out or can i do more harm than good? is it better to wait for this to come out?

 

[mr_robot]

I'm not sure what world you're living in where it's not possible for this to grow enough hair across the top of the head or restore a hairline. Also, can anyone actually source this supposed claim from Follica because I've seen people say it online, but never have I found any official documentation.

and again, the process can be done as many times as need be. It's not like you just go over a scalp once and then you're like "Well, f*** it. Whatever we got the first time is what we get." Theoretically, the amount of hair you should be able to regrow should only be limited to how much skin there is.

You're telling me that patient one here:

View attachment 60559

or one of our own users going from this

View attachment 60560

To this

View attachment 60561

Via repeated dermarolling and the big 3 over the span of 5 years since he began rolling is an insufficient amount of hair?

Get your eyes checked, please. There is not a sane person alive who would not take these kinds of results from a therapy that could guarantee it.

People need to stop rooting for the different upcoming technologies like they're god damn sports teams; it doesn't matter who wins it matters that someone does.

Wounding is a proven method, it's just that the underlying mechanisms are poorly understood by most who try it. Follica has been researching this stuff for a long time and most of that research is no doubt how to get the most amount of hair to grow from a single session.

Those of us who actually want to end this nightmare, will wind up using this. Yep, it could be that one pass of the treatment might leave a NW7 with a bit of a diffuse NW2, but if you wouldn't take that as a "baldite", then it's obvious that baldness is just a crutch you don't want to lose.

Where did I say it was not possible to grow hair along the hairline or the scalp? Look at the Indian studies where they have true NW7s, they don't get back to anything near diffuse NW2. In fact there are no examples from from NW7 to NW2. The two patients in that picture that you keep on re-posting do not even have full loss and they certainly don't have their hairlines restored, look closely at the second one, the hair is just grown out and combed over the temples.

Regarding the other example of someone on the big 3 and derma rolling, what has this got to do with Follica? There are guys who have gained their hair back on just minoxidil or finasteride. While on the flip side there are plenty of guys that have tried the same regime and got no gains at all. So stop taking what I said and using out of context.

You have no idea what Follica have been researching because they have not published anything, everything from you is either hearsay, extrapolation or wishful thinking. The only research they have cited is the Indian study and we can certainly see where they are going with the patents. The only concrete claim is of 25 terminal hairs/cm2. Until there is anything else out there I really do suggest you stop talking and making yourself look silly.

I'm not rooting for any particular technology, what I am rooting for are real potential cures and not these half-hearted attempts. People like you are giving other more desperate sufferers false hope because you cant help projecting your own hopes with the aim of reinforcing your beliefs by getting people to agree with you.

Whilst my hair may not be perfect I've got no problems with it in its current state so your ad hominem attacks are just water off a ducks back.

 

[hellouser]

from all the tests/studies done so far, how much better were the results for the guys who were using finasteride compared to the ones who werent?

also, this treatment wont be out for a year or two, so is it worth buying a needle yourself now and trying it out or can i do more harm than good? is it better to wait for this to come out?

Get the dermaroller regardless. Not only will you see some improvement with your current topicals, but it will improve their absorption. Also, the dermaroller is only about 10-20 bucks, so it's a chump change. No reason not to use it.

 

[sunchyme1]

Get the dermaroller regardless. Not only will you see some improvement with your current topicals, but it will improve their absorption. Also, the dermaroller is only about 10-20 bucks, so it's a chump change. No reason not to use it.

i actually tried this thing a few years ago when there was a lot of hype about it. prob have the dermaroller somewhere still

i bought the 1mm one. do i need the 1.5?

so i very quickly went over the dhurat study earlier. mirconeedling once a week with the 1.5mm and start topicals the day after. is this right? this is the best way to do it?

 

[mr_robot]

Additionally here are the non-responders from the same study.

 

[sunchyme1]

@Roberto_72 are you dermarolling man?

i think i remember you posting a while back that you were but you stopped because you didnt wana scar your scalp if you were doing it wrong. is this right?

or am i thinking of someone else

 

[Roberto_72]

@Roberto_72 are you dermarolling man?

i think i remember you posting a while back that you were but you stopped because you didnt wana scar your scalp if you were doing it wrong. is this right?

or am i thinking of someone else

I don't think you can scar your scalp with 0.5 mm.
That is what I use a couple of times a week before applying minoxidil.
Being consistent is the hard thing, because it is
time consuming (you need to disinfect the roller, then pass it on your scalp 10 times x four directions = 40 times, then clean it again, then store it).

 

[sunchyme1]

I don't think you can scar your scalp with 0.5 mm.
That is what I use a couple of times a week before applying minoxidil.
Being consistent is the hard thing, because it is
time consuming (you need to disinfect the roller, then pass it on your scalp 10 times x four directions = 40 times, then clean it again, then store it).

yeah i remember. prob the reason i gave it up.

so you didnt give it up for fear of scarring and potentially f*****g up your scalp for future treatments?

you think using the 1.5mm once a week, as quoted in the studies, is fine then?

 

[sunchyme1]

yeah i remember. prob the reason i gave it up.

so you didnt give it up for fear of scarring and potentially f*****g up your scalp for future treatments?

you think using the 1.5mm once a week, as quoted in the studies, is fine then?

@Roberto_72 !!!!!!!!!

 

[That Guy]

Additionally here are the non-responders from the same study.

View attachment 60576

These are not "non-responders" to the therapy lol

That's the control group that was only treated with minoxidil.

 

[coolio]

Follica -

I still say this: If they are only using minoxidil then I don't know how in the hell they are getting 25 terminals per cm from it. Nobody else has been getting that in the last 30-some years.

I'm surprised they are just now filing another patent about minoxidil, so late in the game. I'm not sure what it indicates. I can think of possibilities both good and bad.



Dermarolling -

It falls into two categories - shallow (0.5mm), and deep (1.5mm).

Shallow rolling can be done pretty much every day. It helps topicals penetrate better.

Deeper rolling causes more significant effects and should not be done so often. People have differing opinions about exactly how often is okay. Some say every week, other say barely once a month. Whatever Follica might be getting from rolling is probably coming from something this deep.

 

[That Guy]

I don't know how in the hell they are getting 25 terminals per cm from it. Nobody else has been getting that in the last 30-some years

I'm not sure what 25 hair per cm sq looks like, but I assume from your post that it must be greater than what was seen in the Dhurat study or successful dermarollers on this site.

In which case, it would definitely be sufficient.