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Oh god damn, no wonder people like @Dante are so frustrated.
What about being anything less than an NW6? That would be something for some guys.
I Had An Epiphany. Confidence Does Matter, A Lot!
- Thread starter samantha3333
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Oh god damn, no wonder people like @Dante are so frustrated.
What about being anything less than an NW6? That would be something for some guys.
Was she your co-worker? I think you lost an opportunity there. Similar things happened to me too. I remember when I first came to the US, I was in a house party and a drop dead gorgeous blonde told me, "You are sexy". I just looked at her with open mouth and couldn't say anything. Not even thank you. I didn't know what to say. Being raised in an extremely traditional family in India had crippled me socially.
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Yeah she was a coworker and I definitely lost an opportunity, I lost a few at that job but my social skills were at the extreme bottom. I did a bit better there because I was in better shape at the time, and I had higher social status. In contrast when I'm among academics, and before that university, and before that Jewish school, I'm among people born into an upper-middle class background, which makes me a social climber. Social status is very important to women.
The best way to impress women at yoga is to be good at yoga. I have always been awful at it, but I might try and pick it up seriously. It's a terrific sport.
Seems like being bartender is a better option. As far why not taking yoga classes, I have a feeling being an instructor will give me more opportunities to interact. But I may be wrong. I will have to go to yoga classes to be an instructor anyway, so i will find out the reality.
Your experiences and mine demonstrate how important social skills are. They may not make a man good looking but lack of them surely means many lost chances.
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Yes, absolutely. Better social skills also suggests a better relationship once the relationship starts, an ability to overcome problems, etc.
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I don't want to hold @WhitePolarBear accountable for everything that happens on here, but I think a lot of people relate to him and agree with his general attitude because the majority of guys on here rely on internet dating, which sounds like a tough thing to rely on if you aren't more than above average looking.
I feel that Fred's attitude reflects the general opinion of many here, and therefore the hatred of "confidence". Here is not even an overly exaggerated version of why so many people hate the word, and it's understandable:
"People peddle this idea that if you have confidence you can equal a 9/10 slayer, it removes ugliness, shortness, baldness, and elevates you to a God."
Not at all true of course, but it's all relative in taking opportunities in real life, not in online dating which is the main source for a significant number of posters/readers on this forum. David gave an example of how he missed an opportunity because of a lack of dealing with a situation, I'd extend it further that approaching or being an approachable conversationalist, gives you opportunities that you wouldn't normally get yourself into, and from there your attitude can be vital.
@shookwun is another guy who's had experience in online dating of course, but I feel he's more open to the idea of real life interactions and the difference your attitude can make (this is just the impression I'm getting from reading his posts recently, I don't want to speak for him and I could be wrong).
All things in moderation, and balance.
Going to any extreme is a cope, if you believe your personality has nothing to do with getting chicks, that's a cope because you can blame your looks, if you believe that pulling a girl is 90% the reason guys get laid, it's a cope for being deluded enough to remove looks completely, because you want to believe you can make it after all despite being an underdog.
It's a mix of both, looks are definitely more important, but personality can bump you up significantly, and more importantly it means you can take the opportunities when they come along.
I feel that Fred's attitude reflects the general opinion of many here, and therefore the hatred of "confidence". Here is not even an overly exaggerated version of why so many people hate the word, and it's understandable:
"People peddle this idea that if you have confidence you can equal a 9/10 slayer, it removes ugliness, shortness, baldness, and elevates you to a God."
Not at all true of course, but it's all relative in taking opportunities in real life, not in online dating which is the main source for a significant number of posters/readers on this forum. David gave an example of how he missed an opportunity because of a lack of dealing with a situation, I'd extend it further that approaching or being an approachable conversationalist, gives you opportunities that you wouldn't normally get yourself into, and from there your attitude can be vital.
@shookwun is another guy who's had experience in online dating of course, but I feel he's more open to the idea of real life interactions and the difference your attitude can make (this is just the impression I'm getting from reading his posts recently, I don't want to speak for him and I could be wrong).
All things in moderation, and balance.
Going to any extreme is a cope, if you believe your personality has nothing to do with getting chicks, that's a cope because you can blame your looks, if you believe that pulling a girl is 90% the reason guys get laid, it's a cope for being deluded enough to remove looks completely, because you want to believe you can make it after all despite being an underdog.
It's a mix of both, looks are definitely more important, but personality can bump you up significantly, and more importantly it means you can take the opportunities when they come along.
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Before hairloss and disfigurement I was pretty much on target for all 6 of these ridiculous requirements. I'm a long way from that now, of course, and the difference in life quality is startling. It depresses me immensely. And god, some of the chad's that I see around campus. Trust fund babies with well above average IQ's, pretty boy looks and a f*** ton of social status (+ obviously lots of cash). You wouldn't believe the lives they live. Exclusive bar/house parties three times a week, tinder validation & f*** prospects 24/7, holidays spent either skiing in the alps with a posse of 9/10s and their friends, or surfing, tanning and shagging in the Bahamas etc. It's sickening
Ah mane. It is ridiculously cruel how some people can have so much, and probably not even realise it, and then others can have so little. A lot of guys would kill for even 1% of the experiences that these Chad types get.
And the kicker? Unlike previous generations, I feel a lot of these guys aren't even bad people, they're just doing what any of us would do. The previous generations of jocks vs nerds isn't really a thing anymore, if anything, at the most, the Chads don't even care what lesser beta males do, it's just irrelevant.
I mean, at least before you could hate them for actively bullying lesser men and compounding how sh*t they feel, now you can't even hate them.
Great post. Very balanced and nuanced.
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and society worships you for this
meanwhile im the male version and society absolutely f*****g hates me for it
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Its true.
I have a gorgeous friend who was always with really hot guys---who treated her like crap..Not to her face but cheated on her with really ugly women..i felt so bad for her because it was like one bf after the next was cheating with unattractive women..so the man she married in my opinion was actually really good looking although not as gorgeous as her ex's but still pretty damn good looking by most women standards--she was never really THAT into him but she went out with him and eventually married him.
She called me close to the wedding date and was sort of anxious about doing it...she basically told me flat out she was not in love with him but she knew he would be a good husband and Father..I tried to talk her out of it but she did it..they were married for about 10 years...until he cheated on her and left her for another woman...I mean shes fine she got a new BF faster than i can click my fingers but it was ironic to me that the very thing she thought she would be 'safe' with him for he STILL did.
There is no 'safe' bet in marriage.
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Patrick Dempsey was not considered good looking when i was young. he was considered a 'geek' like the relatable guy..im not sure when he became good looking. but look at the old films when i was a teen in 80s he was not considered hot. at all.
Yup. I feel he only became considered good looking since Grey's Anatomy and later, mostly because he has imo aged very well (kept ALL his hair, good skin aging etc.). He is definitely better looking relative to his cohort now than when he was 20-25 years old. Same for George Clooney. Always amazing to me when someone wasn't even viewed as hot in popular culture (when he was on Facts of Life at age 20-24) and then is adored for their looks at age 40-50. Another guy who kept ALL his hair. Goes to show you. Another thing that helps the both of them is the facial hair/stubble fad - both of them have perfect beard growth and wear that look very well. Many men don't. The clean-shaven look was more popular 20-30 years ago.
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Patrick Dempsey I think got a great yet subtle nose job and gained some weight and learned how to master his fro hair.
George Clooney I dont get at all sorry i think he is aging awful and has been for a while now.
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God I hope that doesn't happen to me, would suck to be in a loveless marriage.
It may be that the guy cheated on your friend as she never gave him what he needed. She faked it for years but never truly loved him. All of the sex and affection would have been conditional and non-genuine.
You can't fake love for ten years.
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EvilLocks
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I am the same way. Being a recluse from all my problems has only reinforced these personality traits.
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Everybody should improve both their social skills and their looks as much as they reasonably can, which is something I've been personally practicing in the past two years. It's admittedly very difficult. It takes a lot of time and psychological energy, and this is in spite of the fact that I cannot claim to be doing so with perfect efficiency and perfect effort.
I can understand why people are reluctant to do so, make no mistake it's an expensive chore, burden, and investment and it comes with unlikely returns. There is no perfect instruction manual on improving your looks and appearance, never mind one that's tailored. "Social skills" and "looks" are themselves both dumb terms as they are multivariable concepts, not single variable concepts, and they can be correlated and jointly causal sometimes. Further, many of the pieces of advice are counterproductive, and may lead to one being worse off.
In reference to the example you cited I was 18 or 19 so I had no discernible hair loss. I was in or near the best physical shape of my life. Both of those were prerequisites, and if I were fat and bald I think it's certain that she would not have approached me. With that said I was also in an environment filled with tons of available women, my social status was comparatively high, and I missed an opportunity. The example supports every conclusion.
The best solution is arguably also to be sufficiently attractive that one doesn't need to bat 1.000 for every single opportunity for women. The latter is unrealistic, everybody misfires sometimes. But if you get more chances, that will almost certainly improve your results.
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Voice tonality is the most under rated tool in communications. Studies on all the great speakers found that it what was often not what the orator said but the way in which the words were said. Whether you like them or not, great speakers such as Churchill, King, Kennedy, Obama, Tony Robbins, all had that amazing ability to make people listen. They knew when to pause, when to add emphasis, and changed the tone of their voice during their speeches.
Even remembering lectures, the boring professors are the ones who would ramble in a monotone behind a plinth. Whereas, it was always the professors who left their notes, spoke with conviction, and paced back and forth that provided the most captivating content.
I'd advise any of you to focus not on the words you say but on how you say they. Focus on changing tonality and watch for social response.
Some links supporting these ideas:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-29800893
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/richard-greene/the-7-reasons-why-jfk-is-_b_6200548.html
https://www.wsj.com/articles/how-to-train-your-voice-to-be-more-charismatic-1417472214
Is this PUA crap still going on? I would have thought people may have woken up to this bullshit scam by now.