Setipiprant Does Work, But Only On Really Really High Doses.

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IdealForehead

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A quick abstract talking about how antihistamines stabilize mast cells through at least as of 1999, very much unknown mechanisms:

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/10444213

I won't say any more about this in this thread as guys here should be free to talk about seti without alternatives being proposed instead.

But again, in short pgd2 and many other inflammatory cytokines are likely flooding the scalp because mast cells are being activated as part of the dht triggered cascade.

Using a topical antihistamine will block mast cell activation and thus block not only the pgd2 flood but all the associated inflammatory cytokines that mast cells dump out.

I think this is a better solution to the problem than using an oral enzyme inhibitor to interfere with the production of just pgd2 alone.

Stabilizing the mast cells through the scalp is as stated likely safer, can be done topically, cheaper, and actually represents a probably broader method of action. It will reduce pgd2 and more.
 
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ALightInTheDark

ALightInTheDark

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IdealForehead said:
Using a topical antihistamine will block mast cell activation and thus block not only the pgd2 flood but all the associated inflammatory cytokines that mast cells dump out.
Click to expand...

No matter what you're using, Cetirizine won't BLOCK PGD2. It will only decrease it a little. Not block it it's not an inhibitor.

IdealForehead said:
I think this is a better solution to the problem than using an oral enzyme inhibitor to interfere with the production of just pgd2 alone.
Click to expand...

Cetrizine reduces pgd2 produced by mastcells and NOT by Lpgds, and it increases PGE2. Pgd2 produced in hair folicles are not from mastcells but from L-PGDS.
Moreover,Seti is an CRTH2 inhibitor not a full PGD2 inhibitor. And sleep is induced by DP1 of the PGD2 and not DP2.
 
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IdealForehead

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ALightInTheDark said:
No matter what you're using, Cetirizine won't BLOCK PGD2. It will only decrease it a little. Not block it it's not an inhibitor.

Cetrizine reduces pgd2 produced by mastcells and NOT by Lpgds, and it increases PGE2. Pgd2 produced in hair folicles are not from mastcells but from L-PGDS.
Moreover,Seti is an CRTH2 inhibitor not a full PGD2 inhibitor. And sleep is induced by DP1 of the PGD2 and not DP2.
Click to expand...

How do you explain two studies showing topical cetirizine increases hair growth significantly? I've offered my best theory.

Mast cells are everywhere in the body. When you put something on your skin and have an allergic reaction and the area swells up and starts itching, guess what did that. Mast cells. Even on your scalp.

You can read about mast cells in the skin here:
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1854042/?page=1

Here's what the PGD2 study said:

In miniaturized hair follicles in balding human scalp, sebaceous gland and hair follicle keratinocytes outside of the bulge (Fig. 4, C and E), and in some cases within the suprabasal bulge (Fig. 4D), expressed PTGDS. We also detected PTGDS outside of the hair follicle epithelium, indicating potential sources of PGD2 in the dermis (Fig. 4, E and F). In hair follicles undergoing catagen, PTGDS was present in mast cells within the fibrous streamer, which is the former site of the regressed follicle (Fig. 4E).

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3319975/​

We know antihistamines stabilize mast cells against initiating inflammatory responses. Good odds whatever the mechanism is, antihistamines will do the same in the sebaceous gland and keratinocytes.

PGD2 is just one inflammatory cytokine. It is not the only one. For example:

In vitro studies have shown that desloratadine inhibits the release or generation of multiple inflammatory mediators, including IL-4, IL-6, IL-8, IL-13, PGD(2), leukotriene C(4), tryptase, histamine, and the TNF-alpha-induced chemokine RANTES.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/11295678
​
I think that's plenty of sufficient evidence to explain why these antihistamines work and to conclude they may be even broader in their mechanism of action than something like setipiprant, which focuses on just one enzyme and blocking production of just one prostaglandin.

EIther way they seem to work, so it's not "if" it's "how".
 
icecold7

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Gents -

To pull this thread back to the original topic: I've just started a Seti regimen, and plan to dose at 1000mg+, depending on sides. My thought process around trying seti & costs below, but first a few questions:

1) @Sanchez1234 - Thanks for looking into getting Kane's seti tested again. Any results on that? If I can help on that, financial or legwork, let me know.

2) Does anyone have a list of labs in the US that are able to test Seti and other hair loss compounds for purity?

3) This may be a stupid question, but I've paged through 1000+ posts on this forum without finding an answer. How, exactly, does one go about taking Seti orally without an unacceptable amount of time & prep? I had planned on filling capsules with the powder, preparing enough for several weeks at a time, and then simply taking them. However, given the large daily dose of 1000mg, it takes FOUR capsules to make a dose, and it takes me 15-20 minutes to get that done (measuring and filling the capsule). Basically, it would take me all day to make a 30 day supply, and I don't have that kind of time. I tried dissolving the seti in water and drinking it, but that doesn't work. Recommendations here??

My justification for trying Seti:
I've seen good arguments for and against seti, but for me, when it comes down to it, a large pharma company spent real money to acquire the seti molecule and run tests on it's oral application. This tells me it has more chance of success than most other options.

Cost justification: Yes, this is quite expensive, but as I look at the ecosystem it seems to me that in 2-4 years we should have multiple drugs attacking PGD2 in various ways (either inhibiting it directly or its receptor) being produced by major pharma companies. At that point, it seems there should be generic versions produced internationally at a cost much lower than today (like generic finasteride). I'm hoping to use this seti regimen as a "bridge" to save my hair (which is falling out at a scary pace) for another few years until that happens - when seti or other options are more widely available and less expensive. The way I look at it, even if that costs $8k, it's worth it.

I'll update this thread after 3 and 6 months with the results, and potentially chime in earlier with sides. So far (after 3 days) I haven't had any.
 
westonci

westonci

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dont use kane seti orally. He said he no longer sells the acid version and only sells the sodium version.

Acid Seti on left and Sodium Version on right side.

Igwtxi6.png
 
icecold7

icecold7

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westonci said:
dont use kane seti orally. He said he no longer sells the acid version and only sells the sodium version.

Acid Seti on left and Sodium Version on right side.

View attachment 69680
Click to expand...

Thanks @westonci, I understand that the salt version dissolves in ethanol easier, which makes it better for topical applications. However, why do you say that it shouldn't be taken orally? Is it dangerous or otherwise not suitable for oral consumption?

Is there anyone else taking Kane's seti orally?

@westonci , where did you get your seti? You mention the private forum, which I don't believe I have access to. Is there any way you can shoot me a link or another resource to source seti from the same place as you? How did you consume it? Capsules or dissolving it in liquid somehow?
 
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kawnshawn

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icecold7 said:
Gents -

To pull this thread back to the original topic: I've just started a Seti regimen, and plan to dose at 1000mg+, depending on sides. My thought process around trying seti & costs below, but first a few questions:

1) @Sanchez1234 - Thanks for looking into getting Kane's seti tested again. Any results on that? If I can help on that, financial or legwork, let me know.

2) Does anyone have a list of labs in the US that are able to test Seti and other hair loss compounds for purity?

3) This may be a stupid question, but I've paged through 1000+ posts on this forum without finding an answer. How, exactly, does one go about taking Seti orally without an unacceptable amount of time & prep? I had planned on filling capsules with the powder, preparing enough for several weeks at a time, and then simply taking them. However, given the large daily dose of 1000mg, it takes FOUR capsules to make a dose, and it takes me 15-20 minutes to get that done (measuring and filling the capsule). Basically, it would take me all day to make a 30 day supply, and I don't have that kind of time. I tried dissolving the seti in water and drinking it, but that doesn't work. Recommendations here??

My justification for trying Seti:
I've seen good arguments for and against seti, but for me, when it comes down to it, a large pharma company spent real money to acquire the seti molecule and run tests on it's oral application. This tells me it has more chance of success than most other options.

Cost justification: Yes, this is quite expensive, but as I look at the ecosystem it seems to me that in 2-4 years we should have multiple drugs attacking PGD2 in various ways (either inhibiting it directly or its receptor) being produced by major pharma companies. At that point, it seems there should be generic versions produced internationally at a cost much lower than today (like generic finasteride). I'm hoping to use this seti regimen as a "bridge" to save my hair (which is falling out at a scary pace) for another few years until that happens - when seti or other options are more widely available and less expensive. The way I look at it, even if that costs $8k, it's worth it.

I'll update this thread after 3 and 6 months with the results, and potentially chime in earlier with sides. So far (after 3 days) I haven't had any.
Click to expand...
S&N labs does testing for purity and identification of chemical for $450, or at least that's what I was quoted.
 
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Keisi92

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Seti seems good for regrowth and maintaning and I think that if it continues like this on westonci, his hariline will get even better, but seeing the reported side effects(talking about general reported side effects on studies not westonci) it's still not good enough imho. I can live with dry mouth, but somnolence, anxiety, nausea are deal breakers for me. Still in confront to finasteride which I am not willing to try, if this comes to market I would give it a go and hope I get no sides. From what I read here fevi should be even better. Does it have the same reported side effects as seti?
 
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kawnshawn

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Keisi92 said:
Seti seems good for regrowth and maintaning and I think that if it continues like this on westonci, his hariline will get even better, but seeing the reported side effects(talking about general reported side effects on studies not westonci) it's still not good enough imho. I can live with dry mouth, but somnolence, anxiety, nausea are deal breakers for me. Still in confront to finasteride which I am not willing to try, if this comes to market I would give it a go and hope I get no sides. From what I read here fevi should be even better. Does it have the same reported side effects as seti?
Click to expand...
Chances are if you had side effects on seti than you will probably have them on fevi. Fevi does the same exact same thing as seti (antagonist of crth2 receptor) except that it is much stronger. The nausea and anxiety might be the nocebo effect but insomnia definitely is real.
 
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jgray201

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@westonci or others, did you struggle did get setipiprant to stay dissolved? I am using a 2% cetirizine solution which dissolves great, but toying with the idea of adding Seti too. But it doesnt stay fully dissolved longer than a few days, i am using dmso too.
 
westonci

westonci

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jgray201 said:
@westonci or others, did you struggle did get setipiprant to stay dissolved? I am using a 2% cetirizine solution which dissolves great, but toying with the idea of adding Seti too. But it doesnt stay fully dissolved longer than a few days, i am using dmso too.
Click to expand...

I stopped doing topical. Oral at high dose is more effective.
 
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alexdaniels

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Having trouble sleeping on 500mg of seti daily. Anyone know of any good supplements that could counteract the sleeplessness like melatonin or gaba?
 
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